Originally posted by Stealth Moose
And since the asian tech stereotype guy needs to determine how bright, large, loud and persistent Sids' lightning is, the same logic applies.
But Nick Gilliard isn't the universal authority on saber fighting any more than Bob Anderson is for the OT. I don't understand why you insist this has validity but let's cover it again:
1. NG has no official capacity as an authority in canon.
2. NG is interpreting GL's vision through fights. Unless GL explicitly says "These levels exist, implement them" or something to that effect, there's no reason to assume his isolated comments reflect G-canon.
3. If they can't conclucisely be G-canon, they are regulated to C-canon, an area in which NG is utterly ignore of already. So numerous other C-canon quotes would either need to corroborate his views or contradict them.
4. The asian dude is the creator of Sids' lightning. If I hold your reason as valid, only the asian tech dude can decide Sids' lightning values, EU be damned.
Neph, Barriss Offee took down Ventress who killed Jedi Masters including premier master uber swordsman Kit Fisto in seconds. Barriss is better than all of them by extention, so I win.
Erm, no. That's not correct. Bob Anderson is the Olympic professional fencer who worked as swordsmaster/Vader double for the OT. He's never given us any power charts but if he did they'd be just his opinion without canon material corroborating them.
NG isn't an LFL official in his capacity; he's the swordsmaster/stunt coordinator LFL hired to choreograph the film's action scenes. If he says "Kit Fisto is a level 9" but this is not shown in film or EU, we would do best to disregard it because of his position within the company and lack of support. These "levels" are nowhere else in the mythos.
Let me use another example: Bob Anderson trained Viggo Mortensen as Aragorn, and said Viggo was the best student of the sword he'd ever trained. Aragorn over everyone else by virtue of this comment? Or is it perhaps a matter of opinion based on his work with the actors and role in the production. Or does Bob make LotR film canon now?
Oh, lol. I thought it was the guy who wrote some of the Ancient Sith comics. Wasn't he called Anderson as well?
Eh, we would see if there's anything contradicting it. In this case, there's nothing that contradicts the idea that Anakin, Yoda, Sidious, Mace and Dooku are on the same level skill-wise with Kenobi one tier down.
i should clarify, I wasn't against the conclusions necessary, but how they were reached. The classification was too cut and dry and NG is the sole source and creator of the levels, so I consider them his opinion at best.
And yeah, another Anderson was an author. Forget his first name. Kevin J Anderson? Idk.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
I'm pretty sure Gillard has stated that he discussed the levels with Lucas first.
And I'm pretty sure he didn't. Burden of proof, is the whole point. NG was hired to do the same job in the PT as Anderson was in the OT and LotR; no one here would consider unreplicated power levels from Bob as binding in either case. Why apply inconsistency? Because it favors the feeling someone already has?
In the end, it may be the case. But I want those making the assertion that it is valid to prove such. Otherwise, why should I trust in it?
Originally posted by Stealth Moose
And I'm pretty sure he didn't. Burden of proof, is the whole point.
There's a quote from Gillard that was posted here somewhere (will have to find it) by the great poster Arhael. It was a NG quote where he says he discussed the levels with George.
But there's no quote from Lucas himself on the subject.
Originally posted by Stealth Moose
Didn't Grievous only last a few seconds against Mace before getting crushed and fleeing?Also, noted Darth Power. Lemme know if you find it sometime.
I don't think so. At least not according to Mace.
Before Obi-Wan had left Coruscant, Mace Windu had told
him of facing Grievous in single combat atop a mag-lev train during
the general's daring raid to capture Palpatine. Mace had told
him how the computers slaved to Grievous's brain had apparently
analyzed even Mace's unconventionally lethal Vaapad and
had been able to respond in kind after a single exchange.
"He must have been trained by Count Dooku," Mace had said,
"so you can expect Makashi as well; given the number of Jedi he
has fought and slain, you must expect that he can attack in any
style, or all of them. In fact, Obi-Wan, I believe that of all living
Jedi, you have the best chance to defeat him."--ROTS novel
Originally posted by Stealth Moose
Even though Dooku's Makashi makes Obi-Wan look like amateur hour, so why would Grievous' own attempts rattle Mace and fail against Obi? Ah, more inconsistencies. This fight is from Labyrinth of Evil, IIRC, when Grievous still had hype.
Fight is also referenced in the same novel/ movie where Grievous' dehyping began.
Grievous has always been a threat to Jedi in Sabers and Close Combat. That never changed. But in an all out the most powerful Jedi can TK Grievous into defeat.
Let's not forget even in the clone war mini series when Grievous's hype was at it's greatest, Mace TK crushed Grievous's chest pretty easily. So yeah I do think Sith Skywalker and even Opress are foes Kenobi has defeated who are considerably more powerful than Grievous in an all out.
Originally posted by Petrus
What an idiot. Attempting to define how good a combatant is wielding a lightsaber with levels as if the whole SW universe was a videogame or something. Good thing he doesn't hold canon authority.I hate these "levels" of lightsaber mastery. Who invented that shit? Stupid.
I agree that "levels" shouldn't be treated as absolutes (i.e. A is level 8 so he beats B because B is only level 6), but I don't have a problem using them as rough guides.
Let me elaborate. I see the "levels" as being how good the fighter is in pure technical bladework. That is, if he stood in front of a panel of experts and did a demo, the level would indicate how good his technique was.
Of course in actual lightsabre combat, sabre technique is just one of several factors which could tip the balance.
Also, even in a "fair and square arena-type match," a lower level doesn't mean a guaranteed defeat. He could still win, it just means he'd have an uphill battle.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Grievous has always been a threat to Jedi in Sabers and Close Combat. That never changed. But in an all out the most powerful Jedi can TK Grievous into defeat.Let's not forget even in the clone war mini series when Grievous's hype was at it's greatest, Mace TK crushed Grievous's chest pretty easily. So yeah I do think Sith Skywalker and even Opress are foes Kenobi has defeated who are considerably more powerful than Grievous in an all out.
Considering Grievous is not Force sensitive, the effectiveness of TK against him doesn't reveal anything new that we didn't already know, for the same reason why we shouldn't shit bricks that Vader can ragdoll Han Solo and Chewie together, or Sidious could break Boba Fett's neck. Muggles don't have a defense, it's axiomatic.
Originally posted by chilled monkey
I agree that "levels" shouldn't be treated as absolutes (i.e. A is level 8 so he beats B because B is only level 6), but I don't have a problem using them as rough guides.Let me elaborate. I see the "levels" as being how good the fighter is in pure technical bladework. That is, if he stood in front of a panel of experts and did a demo, the level would indicate how good his technique was.
Of course in actual lightsabre combat, sabre technique is just one of several factors which could tip the balance.
Also, even in a "fair and square arena-type match," a lower level doesn't mean a guaranteed defeat. He could still win, it just means he'd have an uphill battle.
👆
As usual, good points made. It's more like Hunger Games ranking or something. Just a number, not a revelation on its own and a mere facet of the other factors in a fight.