Originally posted by AuraAngel
Point out anywhere in my posts where I said Tsukuyomi wouldn't affect more than one person at a time? That was not the purpose of any of my posts.It is not. He used it twice on two different people. Under the effects of Tsukuyomi means trapped in Itachi's genjutsu world. Sasuke and Kakashi were only there for a second a piece. Both were left in comas after wards but Tsukuyomi was well and truly over. You can in no way say that this is an example of Itachi placing two people into Tsukuyomi simultaneously.
Now do I think he could use it on multiple people at once? Maybe. We've never seen it hit multiple targets but Kakashi telling Kurenai and Asuma to close their eyes implies he can. Of course the implication that all 5 Kage will look into Itachi's eyes directly is foolish. It's Itachi. Why would they make eye contact with him when they all know what he can do?
Basically what you're arguing that a burn victim is still on fire because they have burns even after the fire was put out. Which is a pointless argument to be making since the much easier argument(Kakashi's statement to his pals to shut their eyes) supports your claim far more than Itachi somehow keeping Kakashi and Sasuke in a genjutsu state for weeks when he'd be miles away from either. The genjutsu was cast, and ended, on two different occasions.
Unless you truly think that Wakka believes Itachi can't cast Tsukuyomi twice. Which is not present in his/her posts at all.
As it stands I won't be giving an argument for either side here because it is my thread and I enjoy watching the debate in these cases rather than participating. But your misunderstanding of Tsukuyomi was too egregious for me to pass up commenting.
I'm legitimately beginning to think you have some kind of debilitating mental condition.
You insinuated that Itachi couldn't use it on more than one person at a time in ALL of your posts.
Yes, he used it twice on two different people, but they were both being effected by it at the same time. I'm not arguing that "a burn victim is still on fire because they have burns even after the fire was put out", i'm arguing that a burn victim is still under the effects of the fire after the fire is put out, genius. You obviously have no clue what this entire argument has been about in the first place, so let me re-explain it to you.
If I am shot in the stomach, I will not be getting continuously shot in the stomach. It will happen once for an instant, but I will continue to bleed out, experience pain, die, and be UNDER THE EFFECTS of the bullet, will I not? Unless a surgeon treats me, I will not heal, and eventually will die. Is that not the EXACT same phucking thing that happens to someone who's fallen prey to Tsukiyomi? The coma induced by Tsukiyomi is an EFFECT of Tsukiyomi. Being under a coma that was induced by Tsukiyomi is being under the EFFECT of Tsukiyomi, is it not?
How does the "close your eyes" argument hold any weight whatsoever? Kakashi told them to keep there eyes closed so they wouldn't get trapped in Tsukiyomi, not because Itachi could use it on them all at once. Kakashi was looking out for them individually, because if one of them got hit by Tsukiyomi, they would have most likely died as neither had Sharingan.
My argument is that no, Itachi can't use Tsukiyomi once to effect five people. He can, however, use it five times simultaneously to effect all five.
Again though, that would take too much of his chakra, and isn't how he would fight them. That hasn't been my argument in the first place. I KNOW he would avoid Tsukiyomi in this fight. He would simply use a finger-Genjutsu to distract the team for a few seconds, giving him enough time to land an Amaterasu-shotgun, which would vaporize all of them within two attacks.
You're still trying to dodge the argument itself, and claim I don't know what I'm talking about, when you are making yourself look stupid by avoiding what the thread is about. Who would win, Itachi or the Gokage. Not "How does Tsukiyomi work", which I would still crush you in, as you think that the coma induced from Tsukiyomi isn't an effect of Tsukiyomi. That's literally saying "The coma induced from Tsukiyomi isn't a coma induced from Tsukiyomi.", I mean shit, do you even realize how stupid you come off when sticking to your sinking ship of an argument, in a futile attempt to change the ****ing subject? You look like a ****ing dumb ass, and I'm not even saying that to be rude. ❌
I have a question to ask concerning the Tsukuyomi argument. So if Madara with 25 pairs of sharingans couldn't genjutsu all the Kage at once exactly how would Itachi with only one eye for it get all five Kages? In order for it to work he'd have to either get in close, which would be suicide if he tried that with Tsunade or A, or try to catch one of the Kages with it mid combat in which any of the other 4 kages could compensate so it still wouldn't work. Then you have one guy who's fast enough to avoid Itachi's eyes outright so the taking out all five Kages with Tsukuyomi still doesn't work.
Susanoo and Amateratsu can both be countered with teamwork plus he has no answer to the combo-Kage attack.
Originally posted by Bentley
Legitimately? Nope, not ever 👇Hope you grow out of insulting people man.
What? That entire post made no sense. I said I was legitimately beginning to think that guy had a mental handicap, and you claim I don't? You can't read my mind, so... get back to failing at debates.
I'll grow out of insulting people, when people grow out of insulting me. Him repeating my posts with different wording and claiming I don't know what I'm talking about, is an insult to my intelligence. Just like you trying to lecture me because you haven't been able to counter anything I've posted on these forums since I started here, is an insult to my intelligence.
Me saying that had nothing to do with you, and if you wanted to get through to me at all, you should have attempted to "legitimately" challenge what I said by providing proof, which just so happens to be the purpose of these forums, not for people on a superiority trip to play the hero. 👆
Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
I have a question to ask concerning the Tsukuyomi argument. So if Madara with 25 pairs of sharingans couldn't genjutsu all the Kage at once exactly how would Itachi with only one eye for it get all five Kages? In order for it to work he'd have to either get in close, which would be suicide if he tried that with Tsunade or A, or try to catch one of the Kages with it mid combat in which any of the other 4 kages could compensate so it still wouldn't work. Then you have one guy who's fast enough to avoid Itachi's eyes outright so the taking out all five Kages with Tsukuyomi still doesn't work.Susanoo and Amateratsu can both be countered with teamwork plus he has no answer to the combo-Kage attack.
I also have a question concerning the Tsukiyomi argument.
Why do you think that it has anything to do with me, and holds any merit to my arguments, when it was originally brought up by someone else(theTyrant)?
I have stated MULTIPLE times, that Itachi would NOT use Tsukiyomi against the Kage's. He would use SIMPLE finger Genjutsu to restrain them all, and simply vaporize them with an Amaterasu-shotgun.
Why have you dodged this question for so long? You are beginning to look like you don't know what to say to it... oh wait.
What about the Kage combo? First off, nothing they could do would be enough to get past the Yata mirror, which has blocked more than them all combined are capable of. Secondly, they would have NO time WHATSOEVER to land it as Itachi instantly caught them all in basic Genjutsu, and then vaporized them with Amaterasu.
They have no defense, and if they do, then explain what it is. Itachi is faster than all of them, stronger, deadlier, more perceptive, and overall VASTLY more powerful.
How is teamwork going to do anything when they are ALL being mind-raped with Genjutsu, as well as vaporized with the most deadly attack in all of Naruto?
PLEASE explain, or just admit that you've changed your opinion.
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
What? That entire post made no sense. I said I was legitimately beginning to think that guy had a mental handicap, and you claim I don't? You can't read my mind, so... get back to failing at debates.
Ok, maybe our definition of legitimacy is different, but who is exactly giving you that right? Yourself?
You're claiming that breaking the rules is legit, I'm just calling you out in that outrageous claim 👆
Originally posted by Bentley
Ok, maybe our definition of legitimacy is different, but who is exactly giving you that right? Yourself?You're claiming that breaking the rules is legit, I'm just calling you out in that outrageous claim 👆
No, the US constitution is giving me that right. 👆
I didn't break any rules. I didn't bash or insult, I just stated my opinion. I only said that his posts were giving me the feeling that he was mentally handicapped. Again though, you've ignored the rest of my post so since you have nothing to contribute to the discussion... yeah, I'm done with you. 😉
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
This fight would literally be child's play to Itachi. He would blitz everyone while using Genjutsu to mind **** them as he vaporized them easily. This isn't a fight between the most powerful here, it's a fight between the deadliest. Itachi isn't as strong as say Madara or Hashirama, but if you were Hashirama, would you rather be faced with a meteor falling on you, or a stab with the Totsuka blade that would seal you in a drunken stupor for all eternity? Prolly the meteor. 👆The Kage's have NO defense against someone faster, deadlier, smarter, and with better hair than them. Especially when they couldn't even get past his base Genjutsu that he can use from continents away on multiple people.
Originally posted by SSJGGogetaThis is you over exaggerating the extent that Itachi can use his MS abilities while low-balling the Kages. For instance you low-balled A's speed while not taking into account that Naruto wasn't using his KCM speed in that fight. Also Gaara has shown the ability to get around Susanoo from the inside.
Itachi used Amaterasu to cover the field, spammed it to hit Sasuke, overcome his fireball, and shoot at him during the entire fight. Along with Tsukiyomi, a couple fireballs, Susano'o fully cloaked and blocking Kirirn ALL while being on his deathbed and sick, as stated by Zetsu, proves he has MORE than enough chakra to dish out a couple Tsukiyomi's, some Amaterasu coverage, Yata mirro blockage and some Totsuka blade stabs, in Edo Tensei with a smile on his face like it's nothing.
Also that question wasn't directed to you specifically otherwise I would have included it in a quote. On top of that I even acknowledge my mistake of thinking that this was mortal Itachi here:
Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
Hold up...I just now realized that they're up against Edo Itachi. Which means he could possibly use his MS techs as much as he wanted on top of Izanami(though it would hinder more than help IMO). I still think the Kages win but it'll be much tougher.
Consider that another warning for member bashing, SSJGGogeta. You've been told numerous times to quit your hostile attitude and stop with the insults and vulgarity, and even received a temp ban. Keep it up and you'll receive another. It's not hard to have a civil and non-hostile debate, you know.
Oh, by the way, if posting on these forums is an "insult to your intelligence" then, by all means, find another one.
Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
This is you over exaggerating the extent that Itachi can use his MS abilities while low-balling the Kages. For instance you low-balled A's speed while not taking into account that Naruto wasn't using his KCM speed in that fight. Also Gaara has shown the ability to get around Susanoo from the inside.Also that question wasn't directed to you specifically otherwise I would have included it in a quote. On top of that I even acknowledge my mistake of thinking that this was mortal Itachi here:
Excuse me? Itachi has been stated to be able to use Genjutsu on multiple people from continents away. I'm pretty sure a few Kage's at close range that would be stumped by Kurenai's Genjutsu would be fodder to his. 👆
LOLOLOLOLOLOL, Naruto was IN KCM mode, and FIGHTING AT HIS BEST in KCM mode, yet your excuse is that he wasn't using KCM speed? LOL. That's got to be up there with the most fanboy-ish posts I've ever seen on here.
When has Gaara done that? I don't recall him ever going inside of Susano'o. Not that it would matter, considering you're still dodging what I've been trying to get across for several posts.
I didn't read that comment since it was posted to the Tyrant guy. It's fine that you didn't notice this was Edo Itachi, but that really has nothing to do with this. This all all something Itachi could do normally. That's why it's been stated in the manga that only someone with Sharingan could beat him. He's simply too deadly with his jutsu's and too skilled with Genjutsu for someone without it to beat him, other than the Ten Tails jinchuriki, or possibly Hashirama.
Again, for the last time, either explain what the Kage's could do against Itachi's Genjutsu before he would have the chance to kill them all, admit that you were wrong, or just tell me that you're too close-minded to change your opinion so I can stop wasting my time with you. I've posted scans and facts to prove my point, you're simply making outrageous claim after claim. It's ridiculous, and I don't want to keep this pointless argument up if you're not going to contribute anything other than your biased opinion. 👆
Originally posted by Impediment
Consider that another warning for member bashing, SSJGGogeta. You've been told numerous times to quit your hostile attitude and stop with the insults and vulgarity, and even received a temp ban. Keep it up and you'll receive another. It's not hard to have a civil and non-hostile debate, you know.Oh, by the way, if posting on these forums is an "insult to your intelligence" then, by all means, find another one.
You know what? Thank you. Thank you for actually approaching this without hostility. I won't say who, but another mod pissed me off when he did what you just did. He did it rudely though, and basically forced me to reply with even more hostility. (IMO)
Since you seem like a nice guy though, just trying to comply with the report Bentley sent, I'll actually try to be less rude on here. You have my word. In fact, before sending my previous post, I actually toned it down severely to assure you wouldn't be displeased.
Thank you for that post. I meant what I said, by the way; It's not hard to be civil and non-hostile, even if some posts do make you infuriated sometimes. Trust me, there are some posts I see here on these boards that make me want to punch a 5 year old because of rampant stupidity. However, the best way to handle situations like that are to just not be so reactionary and just go with the flow. If someone keeps making posts that are redundant or disrupt the flow of the thread then, by all means, hit the report button and send one to me so I can handle the situation. Eezy peezy. I'm glad to see that you're an active poster and are contributing to the board since we need more action. 👆
Originally posted by TheTyrant
Nothing suggests that Itachi would have a chance against Itachi in a 1-on-1. In the manga, Kishimoto would have Itachi one-panel the Raikage with a casual genjutsu.
I disagree.
Nothing suggests that Itachi would have a chance against the Raikage in a 1 v 1. In the manga, Kishimoto made it pretty obvious that Raikage is pretty much the end all be all of 1 v 1 fights minus Minato*. Itachi literally does not have the speed or reflexes to keep up with the Raikage. Itachi will not get as far as Sasuke did against the Raikage because Itachi is not as fast as Sasuke AND Itachi does not have as much Amaterasu skill as Sasuke.
*Madara and Obito do not count.