SWTOR Revan, Bastila Shan, Satele Shan, Lord Scourge vs Full-Power Vitiate

Lawl.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Scourge knows the limits of his power? Really? How do you suppose that worked?
"Wrath, you ever wonder how I mind control people."
"Why...yes actually, I won't ever use this to betray you"

Well Scourge knows the technique to defend against it for one thing. And he touched the Emperor's mind, remember. But most importantly he's been by his side for 300 years, trying to find a way to defeat him. You really think Scourge never attempted to learn more about his greatest weapon? And he's in the perfect position as the Wrath to observe it. Vitiate has broken the minds of dozens of Jedi and turned them to evil. Scourge knows more about Vitiates power than anyone else, he knows that Satele and the Council can't stand against him.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
No which is why they don't want to risk the whole Jedi Council becoming his thralls.

No, they can't resist it because they don't know the defense against it.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Again Scourge had a ritual performed on him by Vitiate, is made immortal by Vitiate's power. He has no idea how that would affect him if he's in direct confrontation with him.

I'm sure he probably does. By that's irrelevant speculation. Scourge states that he can't join the Hero because he can't defend against his direct influence. Nothing more.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Oh really? Then why didn't Vitiate mind control him during their battle? He was clearly scared of the prospect of fighting all three of them, and even resorts to trying to convince Scourge to betray them. If he could just force persuade Scourge into doing his dirty work he would have done it with the same results and zero risks.

There was no battle between Vitiate and Scourge. So we don't know that he couldn't have, do we? 😬

Originally posted by Lord Stark
I never argued that. I am saying that if Person A and Person B have the same mental resilience. Person A imbued with a ritual from Vitiate will have a far more difficult time resisting him than Person B just encountering him.

And I'm disagreeing with you. It's hugely different. Vitiate was just possessing Kira's body, not dominating her will. She was able to fight back against his possession, but she wouldn't be able to do that to his mental assault in person. If she could have she would have fought him with the Hero.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
No he was resisting far before that. During the battle he heals you for crying out loud. Also Kira is bound to him, she even comments on hearing his voice post mortem.

And you don't think that the First Son would have difficulty maintaining his dominance while fighting the Barsen'thor? When he's concentrating on fighting her and using his power in combat, he can't fully focus on subduing Syo's personality.

Kira is connected to him, not bound to his will.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Why would the Emperor tell Scourge the extent of his mind control powers?

I wonder if they did chat. Scourge has to be the closest he has to a friend. Maybe they shot the shit after crushing some Jedi weakling over whiskey and smokes.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
My understanding is that Emperor Vitiate learned about the existence of Foundry after probing Revan, no? 😕

Nah. Considering Vitiate told Revan about the Star Forge and to find it its likely he knew of the Foundry as well.

My point is that Vitiate didn't transform Scourge to his puppet at any point in history. This wouldn't have been productive for Emperor's Wrath role.

This is true.

I really doubt that Kira is strong enough to resist Emperor Vitiate by herself. Not even Revan was able to shrug off Emperor's influence on him, he broke free with aid of the Jedi Council that performed mindwipe on him. Heck, HoT couldn't break free from telepathic influence of Emperor Vitiate without aid of Orgus Din.

No. Revan and Malak both freed themselves long before.

Barsen'thor's actions were proving to be effective.

Syo couldn't shrug off First Son at any point earlier.

Point is Syo was able to resist and heal the Barsen'thor at various intervals.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Well Scourge knows the technique to defend against it for one thing. And he touched the Emperor's mind, remember. But most importantly he's been by his side for 300 years, trying to find a way to defeat him. You really think Scourge never attempted to learn more about his greatest weapon? And he's in the perfect position as the Wrath to observe it. Vitiate has broken the minds of dozens of Jedi and turned them to evil. Scourge knows more about Vitiates power than anyone else, he knows that Satele and the Council can't stand against him.

Lol observing him break lesser Jedi doesn't mean he automatically knows the exact mechanics of it. I could observe Darth Nihilus eating doesn't mean I know the exact mechanics nor its limits.

No, they can't resist it because they don't know the defense against it.

They aren't experts on the technique. They simply can't risk the whole fvcking Council getting compromised.

I'm sure he probably does. By that's irrelevant speculation. Scourge states that he can't join the Hero because he can't defend against his direct influence. Nothing more.

Because he's connected to Vitiate by this point of course he couldn't resist him.

There was no battle between Vitiate and Scourge. So we don't know that he couldn't have, do we? 😬

Are you serious? In the Revan novel right Scourge sees visions of the Emperor's defeat Vitiate says something along the lines of 'I thought better of you Lord Scourge.' If he could just casually mind dominate him Scourge wouldn't have seen visions of Revan triumphantly standing over the Emperor's corpse.

And I'm disagreeing with you. It's hugely different. Vitiate was just possessing Kira's body, not dominating her will. She was able to fight back against his possession, but she wouldn't be able to do that to his mental assault in person. If she could have she would have fought him with the Hero.

Of course she couldn't face Vitiate that's a no brainer. She would have had more trouble resisting him than even

And you don't think that the First Son would have difficulty maintaining his dominance while fighting the Barsen'thor? When he's concentrating on fighting her and using his power in combat, he can't fully focus on subduing Syo's personality.

And you don't think Vitiate would have trouble maintaining control over a combatant while fending off Revan and two others? Please.

I wonder if they did chat. Scourge has to be the closest he has to a friend. Maybe they shot the shit after crushing some Jedi weakling over whiskey and smokes.

You're funny. Something tell something tells me Vitiate wasn't the conversational type.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Lol observing him break lesser Jedi doesn't mean he automatically knows the exact mechanics of it. I could observe Darth Nihilus eating doesn't mean I know the exact mechanics nor its limits.

If you had Force Senses I'm certain you'd figure out what he's doing eventually. Scourge had 300 years to prepare for combating Vitiate. He knows more about his power than anyone. If he didn't believe the Council could help, I'm taking his opinion over you saying theres a possibility they could.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
They aren't experts on the technique. They simply can't risk the whole fvcking Council getting compromised.

Right on both counts. Now admit that they'd fall for his mental power and you'd make it a hatrick!

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Because he's connected to Vitiate by this point of course he couldn't resist him.

He's not connected to him though. Just because Vitiate amped him doesn't make them connected in any way. Swtore says that Scourge is not bound to Vitiate.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Are you serious? In the Revan novel right Scourge sees visions of the Emperor's defeat Vitiate says something along the lines of 'I thought better of you Lord Scourge.' If he could just casually mind dominate him Scourge wouldn't have seen visions of Revan triumphantly standing over the Emperor's corpse.

So what? Scourge later says that that vision wouldn't have come to pass. It's just a vision, they don't really mean that they're probable to occur. Jacen had a vision of himself killing Luke and we all know how likely that is.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Of course she couldn't face Vitiate that's a no brainer. She would have had more trouble resisting him than even

As I said, no one but the Hero of Tython and Revan can resist Vitiates direct influence.

Although I'd say the Barsen'thor or Malgus could if taught the defense.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
And you don't think Vitiate would have trouble maintaining control over a combatant while fending off Revan and two others? Please.

Vitiate doesn't need to maintain control. He twists your will and then you serve him without him having to consciously keep dominating you.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Nah. Considering Vitiate told Revan about the Star Forge and to find it its likely he knew of the Foundry as well.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
No. Revan and Malak both freed themselves long before.

Revan and Malak managed to (partially) reduce telepathic influence of Emperor Vitiate on them. They didn't shrug off Emperor's influence.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Point is Syo was able to resist and heal the Barsen'thor at various intervals.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
And you don't think Vitiate would have trouble maintaining control over a combatant while fending off Revan and two others? Please.

It shall be kept in mind that Emperor Vitiate can reduce even Revan to ash with his powers, I am not sure if others will stand much of a chance at surviving either.

If Vitiate knew where the Foundry was, then why was he trying to find its location in Revan's mind? I mean, Vitiate told him about the Star Forge, but he and Malak had to find it themselves through the Star Maps.

It shall be kept in mind that Emperor Vitiate can reduce even Revan to ash with his powers, I am not sure if others will stand much of a chance at surviving either.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
👇 Revan survived a full frontal attack from Vitiate's lightning, and even managed to get back up several seconds later through Force Heal.
Even when Vitiate's lighting completely took a injured Revan off-guard, it only made Revan unconscious. 😬

Revan ended up badly injured or burned from like a second of exposure to that power. If Revan had to endure that power for greater duration, you can do the math.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You forgot about T3-M4. He saved Revan was such a fate.

Revan ended up badly injured or burned from like a second of exposure to that power. If Revan had to endure that power for greater duration, you can do the math.

"What he saw was not good. Revan was being electrocuted, his body spasming uncontrollably as the Emperor blasted him with dark purple lightning."
-and-
"...as the Emperor poured more and more power into him."

Team steamrolls.

Revan shits on Vitiate's body and writes a folk song about it

I agree with what Carthage thinks