Originally posted by Galan007
using a select few showings, wherein superman steps WAY out of character and becomes as strong as the plot needs him to be, is a silly line of 'logic'. we use *average* showings to gauge characters here--not 2 or 3 cherry-picked feats. pretty much any character you can name has stepped WELL beyond their 'normal' tier at *some* point--doesn't mean these random high showings become their average level, though. this is day one stuff, tbh. srslythat being said: superman and shazam have ALWAYS been portrayed as near-equals EVERY time they've battled on panel. hell, on more than one occasion shazam has been able to gain the ever-so-slight advantage, because supes is vulnerable to his magic. where strength alone is concerned, however, they are all but identical. the writer intent is absolutely irrefutable.
No one is cherry picking events. It has been retcon that Superman SUBCONSCIOUSLY holds back and that it takes either dire circumstances or extreme meditation to overcome his subconsciousness. Most other heros hold back consciously. It took meditation and hypnosis to get Superman well beyond in OWAW arc.
If you read the beginning of the discussion you would see that we are not talking about Superman's everyday strength (average strength) here but his extreme strength when he drops his mental blocks. So your silly comment about we use "average" showings is not only irrelevant BUT FALSE. Everyone and their momma uses high end feats to argue a character here. Champion with PG planet feat. Carver with his insane Hulk feats, Abhi with his insane Superman feats, Rage with his insane Loki and Thor feats, Vince with his insance Surfer feats, Mr. Master with his Beyonder insane feats, etc. Plus we have the Full Capacity Rule.
Superman average shown strength is not his maximum strength (because he is holding back). His average showings doesn't have him show a limit. That's like saying that since Superman lifts cars for the most part without effort then his average strength on a forum is car lifting strength, when we know he can lift mountains and greater if he wanted to. Plus we have the Full Capacity Rule.
No character in comics have went from not being able to hurt someone with physical strength to killing them with physical strength in mere moments SOLELY because they released mental blocks. No character in comics have went from fighting something for hours with little progress to one shotting them with ease SOLELY because they released mental blocks. I challenge you to find ample examples of a character doing that in the same story arc.
Also, Superman has gotten upgrades over the years. CM wasn't never stated to get any upgrades in power. It would be silly to say that CM is still equals to Superman. Otherwise, we have Pandoras box. Everyone that has an upgrade is irrelevant as they still remain relevative the same as everyone else. This is stupid.
With that said, CM isn't going to hit Kurse with all his might UNTIL he's sees that he can take it. CM will use his speed and flight to fight Kurse.
So Kurse loses this fight with little difficulty. A bfr is a simple win, whenever CM wants to employ that.
