Originally posted by quanchi112
Shields, intelligence, tactics, battle savvy. Thanos wins, easily.
AND the belief he'd be facing a Flash behaving in a PIS/CIS capacity.
The OP says different.
A full potential Flash is, simply, too much for Thanos.
What is the smallest increment of time? Planck time? As soon as this battle has progressed that far, Flash can and will be able to curb stomp Thanos a million times.
If he's lazy.
Anyone who claims otherwise is delusional.
Tough call, really.
Knee-jerk is Flash just absorbs all of his speed and hammers him with IMP.
But I don't think one IMP could take him, he'd need many hits, and with CIS off I don't see why Thanos wouldn't spam AOE abilities.
Correct me if I'm wrong on this one, but I never see Flash outrun Grodd's telepathic attacks once they're actually 'launched'. Thanos has the shields/durability to take several IMPS and can just blanket the field in a TP wave.
I don't know about speed-stealing.
They fight in a neutral setting, so I don't see why Thanos would be connected to the speed-force, he's from Marvel.
Kinetic energy absorption? He can't override Thanos' energy control.
Originally posted by riv6672
Again, this wont be the case with a CIS/PIS-less Flash.
The incident vs Zum had him running and building up energy.
Obviously the Flash doesn't need to actually build up speed in order to hit lightspeed, but I still don't see him firing off a million IMPS before Thanos can do anything. Flash stated that he could hit Zum more than once, but I don't see how that equates to an endless number of attacks before Thanos reacts.
With PIS off, Thanos should still have somewhere around lightspeed reaction time.
Originally posted by krisblaze
The incident vs Zum had him running and building up energy.Obviously the Flash doesn't need to actually build up speed in order to hit lightspeed, but I still don't see him firing off a million IMPS before Thanos can do anything. Flash stated that he could hit Zum more than once, but I don't see how that equates to an endless number of attacks before Thanos reacts.
With PIS off, Thanos should still have somewhere around lightspeed reaction time.
Zum had around lightspeed reactions, if we give White Martians equal power levels (like we give average Kryptonians power levels). He may even be faster, given that he was chosen to be the team's speedster.
Wally said he could hit such a speedster a thousand times before he could even blink.
The White Martians roles in the team had nothing to do with their abilities.
Some of them had abilities that would rank below ordinary white martians. There's no reason to speculate that Zum was faster than displayed.
That's just Morrison trying to show off with lightspeed relativity. By that logic the first person to hit lightspeed in a fight would be have an infinite amount of attacks against the other person. It has nothing to do with the Flash being that fast, but rather lightspeed-speed being portrayed that way.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
That's like saying Flash isn't from Marvel, so telepathy doesn't work on him....He overrode Amazo, who had Flash level control over the Speed Force.
How many IMPs do you think he can hit Thanos with? Five, ten, twenty, fifty?
It would be like saying that Surfer couldn't cut a DC character off from their star powers by power cosmic shenanigans. Or that Marvel Zeus could deny DC Thor access to the lightning. Or that the Gamesmaster wouldn't be connected to every DC individual.
Flash still has his abilities, but Thanos wouldn't have weaknesses that are inherent to DC characters.
Thanos does not rely on the speed-force for his speed.
Okay. That still doesn't warrant better control than Thanos.
How many? I don't know. Maybe enough, maybe not.
Originally posted by krisblaze
They fight in a neutral setting, so I don't see why Thanos would be connected to the speed-force, he's from Marvel.
The guillotine blade isn't connected to the speed force per se, he still speedsteals:
Anything that has kinetic energy, he can take it's speed. It's like saying Iceman wouldn't be able to control moisture when in a neutral setting, or Pyro wouldn't be able to control fire, or Magneto etc etc.
I already mentioned this in my first post, and you already addressed it.
I'm well aware that Flash has several ways to steal someone's speed.
Originally posted by krisblaze
I don't know about speed-stealing.They fight in a neutral setting, so I don't see why Thanos would be connected to the speed-force, he's from Marvel.
Kinetic energy absorption? He can't override Thanos' energy control.
Originally posted by krisblaze
I already mentioned this in my first post, and you already addressed it.I'm well aware that Flash has several ways to steal someone's speed.
Fair enough. I see your point, and I understand where you're coming from.
Its just that I guess I interpret the rules about a neutral battlefield differently:
Also, all characters, regardless of where the fight takes place, or what universe/medium they are native to, will have full access to their abilities at optimum efficiency as they are depicted in their native universes. It will be assumed that each character fights as they are normally presented regardless of battle locale. This means that, for example, Flash will in fact have SpeedForce abilities if the battle took place in Marvel Manhattan. Battles will always take place on an assumed equal playing field.
Emphasis mine.
Not picking on Krisblaze, but a lot of your arguments are just supposition that favor Thanos.
While that obviously works both ways, pro Flash supposition is supported by his actual feats/full potential. Pro Thanos still seems predicated on him fighting, with no prior warning, at a level he simply is not normally shown to. He's not a speedster.
(DarkSaint's rules quote: characters fight as they are normally presented)
Just because he's fighting one doesnt mean he's going to be in some sort of speedster mind set. As an example there was a thread here pitting Pym and Superman, no prep. Poster A said Pym goes subatomic to attack. Poster B says Superman can see subatomic objects.
Well yes, but he doesnt go around doing that all the time. Poster B just arbitrarily turned that ability on to favor Superman because he faced a size shifter. Same here.
By the time Thanos realized he faced the kind of speed Flash has, Flash, who IS a speedster would have had the opportunity to attack. In the millions.
No matter how many pages of denial this thread may get to, Thanos is not in a position to get the win here.
^If you don't know what CIS off means, read up on the rules.
I'll elaborate:
They get basic knowledge of the opposition.
CIS off means they're doing anything to win, even if it's out of character.
Obviously Thanos knows that he's fighting against a speedster, and obviously he'll use tactics that go well against speedsters...