Originally posted by Skybreaker
On the dispute over Shaak Ti's power level, it is very possible that she has grown far more powerful between TCW and TUF, so which era are we pulling from in this fight?
I assume during TCW, otherwise characters will get confused ^^
If it's TUF Shaak, the brothers are in real trouble.
Originally posted by AncientPower
So i just got up, i'll look for the actual source on those statements but I did find these:"Shaak Ti was grouped among the six "great swordbeings" of the Jedi Order" - Revenge of the Sith novelization
"There is an understated elegance in Obi-Wan Kenobi's lightsaber technique, one that is quite unlike the feel one might get from the other great swordbeings of the Jedi Order. He lacks entirely the flash, the pure bold elan of an Anakin Skywalker; there is nowhere in him the penumbral ferocity of a Mace Windu or a Depa Billaba nor the stylish grace of a Shaak Ti or a Dooku, and he is nothing resembling the whirlwind of destruction that Yoda can become.
He is simplicity itself.
That is his power." - RotS, hardcover, pg. 293-294
Now that's something we can use to place Shaak Ti above all other Council Members (not mentioned above).
Kinetite is the only one she performed on Felucia solely, yes.
Still given that her clarity and prowess on the High Council is praised by six other Jedi/Sith, I strongly believe over-all she sits around Kenobi to Dooku level in ROTS.
By TFU however I could see her being even stronger than that, I mean she did shift Felucia's force alignment merely with her presence.
Originally posted by AncientPower
So i just got up, i'll look for the actual source on those statements but I did find these:"Shaak Ti was grouped among the six "great swordbeings" of the Jedi Order" - Revenge of the Sith novelization
Stover's novel? Are you reffering to that quote below?
Originally posted by AncientPower
"There is an understated elegance in Obi-Wan Kenobi's lightsaber technique, one that is quite unlike the feel one might get [b]from the other great swordbeings of the Jedi Order. He lacks entirely the flash, the pure bold elan of an Anakin Skywalker; there is nowhere in him the penumbral ferocity of a Mace Windu or a Depa Billaba nor the stylish grace of a Shaak Ti or a Dooku, and he is nothing resembling the whirlwind of destruction that Yoda can become.He is simplicity itself.
That is his power." - RotS, hardcover, pg. 293-294 [/B]
That?! Oh god, so Depa (who - supported by Koon and Tiin - couldn't even touch Yoda) is equal to Windu, and Shaak Ti is equal to Dooku? It's a bullshit, you know?
Which would leave Mace and Agen Kolar—both among thegreatest bladesbeings the Jedi Order had ever produced—hereon Coruscant in case Sidious did indeed take this opportunity tomake a dramatic move.
Ok, Agen is in their group as well.
"Anakin, why? The Masters are the best of the Order. Whatcan you possibly do?"
And Fisto and Tiin as well. And they're best in the Order, which place them above Shaak Ti.
Not to mention, that Jedi Council believed, that Dooku is better then Mace:
We have seenthat young Skywalker has the power to battle a Sith Lord alone, if need be; he has proven that with Dooku.
Council believed, that someone who defeated Count Dooku is able to defeat Sidious as well.
Forget not the existence of Sidious. Anticipate your action, he may. Masters will be necessary, if the Lord of the Sith you must face.
Yoda believed, that Mace wouldn't be able to face Sidious alone.
That place Dooku above in the Council eyes, so is Shaak Ti considered as Windu's superior as well?
That quote that you posted doesn't necessary mean, that Shaak Ti is equal to Dooku and that Depa is equal to Mace. It may just mean, that Depa is - like Mace - Vaapad's user, and Shaak ti is Makashi's user - like Dooku. That doesn't make them equal.
Originally posted by McPThat quote that you posted doesn't necessary mean, that Shaak Ti is equal to Dooku and that Depa is equal to Mace. It may just mean, that Depa is - like Mace - Vaapad's user, and Shaak ti is Makashi's user - like Dooku. That doesn't make them equal.
But it does seem to suggest that they are the best users/representations of those forms.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Now that's something we can use to place Shaak Ti above all other Council Members (not mentioned above).
No it doesn't. All it does is call her a "great sword being " doesn't mean she is Fistos superior. There is absolutely no reason to believe that all the "great swordbeings" are mentioned there.
Originally posted by Nargaroth
May I ask who he is?
Nai was one of the best debaters here, but he's not in Silver's league. Silver is a much more analytical thinker, and he is much better at comparing and contrasting character feats in very detailed analysis. Silver also has a very vast grasp of context and logic. That's not to say that Nai lacks those qualities, because he doesn't, and he is very knowledgeable on SW. I don't care too much for Nai, but I've always been a person who gives credit where it's due. Look him up, and some of his older arguments; the guy is smart, but not quite on par with Silver. Neph just doesn't like Silver, which is evident in his claim that Silver only spams quotes, which is a lie. I don't agree with Silver on everything, but most of his arguments are hard to counter.
You should follow NewGuy's arguments. He has the potential of being just as good, IMO. I'm pretty sure you're already familiar with The_Tempest/Gideon.
@Neph, don't be a hater. Lol
Originally posted by AncientPower
Kinetite is the only one she performed on Felucia solely, yes.Still given that her clarity and prowess on the High Council is praised by six other Jedi/Sith, I strongly believe over-all she sits around Kenobi to Dooku level in ROTS.
By TFU however I could see her being even stronger than that, I mean she did shift Felucia's force alignment merely with her presence.
That's not true, she Kept the Felucians in line and taught them the Light, which in turn shifted the planet.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Silver was rather trash tbh. Having Ventress over Bane was pathetic.
Real list: Nalaniel>Gideon>Revan Fans>Silver>the rest>SWTOR forums.
I don't think he would argue that anymore, and as far as duelling goes, he is right anyways. Don't agree with your list, but whatever.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Silver was rather trash tbh. Having Ventress over Bane was pathetic.
Real list: Nalaniel>Gideon>Revan Fans>Silver>the rest>SWTOR forums.
Sure, his views were pretty off imo, but his all-around debating skill is basically unmatched. This is the dude who gave a very legitimate argument that Palpatine would defeat Superman. And besides, if he said Maul>Revan, I'd like to see you try and convince him otherwise. 😉
Originally posted by McP
That's actually true. After Bulq left the Order, Depa was second only to Windu as a Vaapad user. And undoubtedly - besides Dooku - Shaak Ti was best Makashi practicioner of her era.
Hm, do we even know who was better between Depa and Bulq....? Well, that's a question for another thread... *goes off to make thread*
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
But it does seem to suggest that they are the best users/representations of those forms.
Yes. I'd expect the listings were in order: Windu, then Depa. Dooku, then Shaak Ti. Each the second best in that area, but worth mentioning in the same breath.