Maul & Savage vs. 4 Council Member

Originally posted by Selenial
That's not true, she Kept the Felucians in line and taught them the Light, which in turn shifted the planet.

"Without Shaak Ti, the planet almost immediately reverted to the darkness it had always in reality been. Maris Brood and the shamans became twisted by evil so quickly that it was as if the Jedi Master was merely the dam holding back the flood."

"The Togruta was a beacon of light in the darkness, if she had given into evil, she through the planet could have become the darkest power in the galaxy."

"The surviving Jedi Master had lived in symbiosis with the planet, much like her own midichlorians. Through the strength of the Togruta the planet began to heal it's immense wounds following the Clone Wars."

All from The Force Unleashed Campaign Guide and the Prima Guide.

Originally posted by ares834
No it doesn't. All it does is call her a "great sword being " doesn't mean she is Fistos superior. There is absolutely no reason to believe that all the "great swordbeings" are mentioned there.

'six'....

Originally posted by AncientPower
'six'....

Which comes form where? Wookieepedia? Because the actual quote you posted that comes from the novel does not mention"six" anywhere.

Regardless, it lists the great Sword-beings of the Order, which are Mace Windu, Depa Billaba, Count Dooku, Shaak Ti, Yoda, Anakin Skywalker and Obi-Wan Kenobi.

You can spin this as if it is only mentioning the styles, etc... but it is pretty damned clear to me that it's listing off the 'Great Sword-beings of the Order'.

All the biggest names are there, Shaak Ti and Depa Billaba get included, not to mention she is praised by Dooku himself.

She is highly skilled in every form, is stated to be a master of Ataru & Makashi:

"Shaak Ti is a master of the Makashi and Ataru forms in addition to her legendary strength in the force. Known far and wide as cunning and serene Jedi, Only the most skilled of the order could stand against her"
- Clone Wars Adventures.

Not to mention stunning feats with Jar'kai and is praised by Kenobi:

"…and Shaak Ti's the most cunning Jedi I've met. She's even taught me a few tricks."

In Labyrinth of Evil, Mace praises Shaak Ti as well:

"As beautiful as a flower and as deadly as a viper"

Let us examine the final moves of her fight with Starkiller:

"On her last three words, she struck three blows that partially found their mark. The first burned a sizzling line down the apprentice's left shoulder. The second scored diagonally across his chest. The third would have skewered his right eye had he not held her back at the last minute with a desperate telekinetic block that stopped her lightsaber barely a millimeter from his skin. He could feel his eyelashes and eyebrows burning. The right side of his sight was entirely blue.
She gasped and staggered backward. Her lightsaber and her gaze dropped. A full half meter of red blade emerged from her stomach, then the rest came free with a hiss.

He backed away, shocked by how close he had come to death and how lucky he had been to defeat her. He had raised his lightsaber by reflex. She had, in the desperation of her final assault, had practically thrown herself on the blade. Perhaps she had meant for the two of them to defeat each other at the same time."

She had him on the defensive and if not for his own pure instinct he'd have his skull cut in half.

Now comes the 'He isn't very impressive by Felucia', I challenge that strongly:

"He had fended off many wild, slashing attacks that would have overwhelmed even an extraordinary Jedi Knight."
- The Force Unleashed

The above is during a sparring match with VADER.

It's merely listing great swordsmen of the order not necessarily the greatest.

Fisto, Koon, Tiin, Kolar, Koth and the rest still are not mentioned. All the confirmed best which are Dooku, Yoda, Mace, Kenobi and Skywalker are all there, as well as Ti and Depa whom already have a vast amount of sources claiming they are among the greatest in the Jedi Order are included to.

However Ti's feat of combining Makashi and Ataru into a hybridized form that Starkiller could not keep track of is not paralleled by any of the five at the top and is indeed praised highly by Dooku and even Vader views her very highly, not expecting Starkiller to return.

Ti is among the six best in the Jedi High Council, it is that simple.

Not that simple at all. The quote you posted earlier certainly doesn't suggest as much. If you believe so based on feats and such though, fair enough.

We will have to disagree on the quote then, because it is quite clear to me.

Except you are giving it a meaning that it doesn't have. It lists some of the greatest sword masters in the order. Nothing more or less.

No it lists the great 'sword-beings' of the Order, comparing them and their skills to Obi-Wan's simplistic Soresu mastery.

This is merely backed up by the feats that I have posted.

Originally posted by ares834
Which comes form where? Wookieepedia? Because the actual quote you posted that comes from the novel does not mention"six" anywhere.

This quote is the 'six' quote:

"There is an understated elegance in Obi-Wan Kenobi's lightsaber technique, one that is quite unlike the feel one might get from the other great swordbeings of the Jedi Order. He lacks entirely the flash, the pure bold elan of an Anakin Skywalker; there is nowhere in him the penumbral ferocity of a Mace Windu or a Depa Billaba nor the stylish grace of a Shaak Ti or a Dooku, and he is nothing resembling the whirlwind of destruction that Yoda can become."

Which lists six other great swordbeings. Really it should be seven...

Originally posted by Q99
This quote is the 'six' quote:

"There is an understated elegance in Obi-Wan Kenobi's lightsaber technique, one that is quite unlike the feel one might get from [b]the other great swordbeings of the Jedi Order. He lacks entirely the flash, the pure bold elan of an Anakin Skywalker; there is nowhere in him the penumbral ferocity of a Mace Windu or a Depa Billaba nor the stylish grace of a Shaak Ti or a Dooku, and he is nothing resembling the whirlwind of destruction that Yoda can become."

Which lists six other great swordbeings. Really it should be seven... [/B]

It does sound to me like it's talking about the Elite swordsmen of that era. Or at least the best of forms 2, 3, 4, 5 and 7. So unless the best users of Forms 1 & 6 are as good as them, the quote does seem to be implying these are the best Swordsmen of the Order.

Originally posted by ares834
It's merely listing great swordsmen of the order not necessarily the greatest.

Strawman, he's not saying that. What he's saying is Depa and Shaak were lumped in with the best duelists in the order, 3 of which are level 9 swordsmen.

Additionally its not the first time Shaak Ti is grouped with the greatest swordsmen in the order.

"Do I need to demonstrate what responses you can expect from Shaak Ti or Obi-Wan Kenobi? From Mace Windu or, stars help you, Yoda?"
^ Only reason Skywalker isn't there is because Dooku very often dismisses him as not as good.

Seems clear to me Shaak Ti is on Kenobi's level.

Again, it's Drallig, not Ti.

Originally posted by Lord Stark

Seems clear to me Shaak Ti is on Kenobi's level.

She could be below Kenobi or above him. We don't really know. What we do know is from EU Sources she seems to be in the elite few. And 2nd best known Makashi practitioner after Dooku.

That quote makes me respect Depa more than I did previously.

Also Marek, for doing as well as he did against Shaak Ti in sabers.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Strawman, he's not saying that. What he's saying is Depa and Shaak were lumped in with the best duelists in the order, 3 of which are level 9 swordsmen.

Ah, no. That's exactly what he was saying. He is claiming that the quote lists of all of the greatest swordsmen of the order, which could be possible but isn't necessary.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Seems clear to me Shaak Ti is on Kenobi's level.

Hardly. Two quotes calling her a good swordsman don't put her on the level of a guy who has defeated Vader and Maul/Savage.

Shaak Ti is no where near as 9. Nick said that Obi-Wan step up to 8, what I understand that even being 8 is good. Only Kit Fisto can be 8 in here, since Agen and Saesee can't even tag Sidious and gets speedblitz.

And some people are forgetting that Savage did solo Anakin & Obi-Wan for a decent time ;

YouTube video

Savage can solo any duo here without trouble for a decent time, then Maul beats his team and helps Savage. Brothers wins.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Sure, his views were pretty off imo, but his all-around debating skill is basically unmatched. This is the dude who gave a very legitimate argument that Palpatine would defeat Superman. And besides, if he said Maul>Revan, I'd like to see you try and convince him otherwise. 😉

I think you'd be able to convince him that Revan may be a superior force user. All around combat, however, you might find that difficult.

DarthAnt? No.

Ant could. I believe in him.