Paris Rampage

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
Not necessarily. There's just far, far, FAR more of them and they're orders of magnitude more bloodthirsty and determined.

Could have. All of the thousands of deadly Islamist attacks that followed and preceded 9/11 also could have been Christian, Hindu, Buddhist, etc... but they weren't. Starting to see a pattern?

Christianity probably is the second place winner, it's just that Islam is leading by a country mile.

The difference is motive. I guess that we could pretend that all killings are the same, regardless of what motivated the killers, but I think we'd be burying our heads in the sand.

Now you're saying they are the most common? What supports this? I've posted a link showing where a Christian organization is displacing tens of thousands of people.

So you're saying it is terrorism only the case if done as an ideology. Well in that case there so many Christian terrorist organizations in Eastern Europe killing so many other Christians for not being like them.

Like I said you don't really know what you are talking about. You have no actual statistics to support Islam being the worst by a country mile.

I normally wouldn't even acknowledge such a waste of time except it is this kind of rhetoric that breeds uninformed and dangerous people who want blood. It should not be encouraged. Most of Islam is the same as most of Christianity. They don't really care.

And the one poster had it right. A religion isn't to blame it is an ideology that hates and destroys opposition on the grounds of being different that is.

Seriously though this event is horrible and shouldn't happen. I hate sullying such a sad event with a needless debate because you want to make uninformed claims.

Originally posted by Bentley
Yes, just like we could duly pretend this is about religion, when it's clearly about politics and the current state of unease between moderate islam populations and Europe.

A lot of this is about religion, a religion called Islam. Not all of it, of course not, and I don't want anyone to think that it's 100% about Islam, but it's a very significant factor.

You said it yourself: "unease between moderate Islam populations and Europe". If this isn't about religion, then why are you even pointing this out?

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
A lot of this is about religion, a religion called Islam. Not all of it, of course not, and I don't want anyone to think that it's 100% about Islam, but it's a very significant factor.

You said it yourself: "unease between moderate [b]Islam populations and Europe". If this isn't about religion, then why are you even pointing this out? [/B]

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
A lot of this is about religion, a religion called Islam. Not all of it, of course not, and I don't want anyone to think that it's 100% about Islam, but it's a very significant factor.

You said it yourself: "unease between moderate [b]Islam populations and Europe". If this isn't about religion, then why are you even pointing this out? [/B]

This is obvious, why pretend these attacks are about religion (they aren't) if the religion angle can't be used at all. The perpetrators claim it's about religion as they could claim it was about race, about a nation, ecology or freedom. It isn't about religion in any true sense of the word, they want to divide the population and it has to be done at some level.

Originally posted by Newjak
Where are you getting this data though. All you did was post 9/11(over a decade old event) had 3000 deaths as to your reason that Islam is by the far the worst religion.

Now you're saying they are the most common? What supports this? I've posted a link showing where a Christian organization is displacing tens of thousands of people.

So you're saying it is terrorism only the case if done as an ideology. Well in that case there so many Christian terrorist organizations in Eastern Europe killing so many other Christians for not being like them.

Like I said you don't really know what you are talking about. You have no actual statistics to support Islam being the worst by a country mile.

I normally wouldn't even acknowledge such a waste of time except it is this kind of rhetoric that breeds uninformed and dangerous people who want blood. It should not be encouraged. Most of Islam is the same as most of Christianity. They don't really care.

And the one poster had it right. A religion isn't to blame it is an ideology that hates and destroys opposition on the grounds of being different that is.

Seriously though this event is horrible and shouldn't happen. I hate sullying such a sad event with a needless debate because you want to make uninformed claims.

I said 9/11 alone resulted in 3000 deaths. The website I linked actually tracked 5000 deaths resulting from Islamist attacks in a single month(!).

Yea, and Islamists are displacing millions. Hell, ISIS alone has probably displaced hundreds of thousands. Have you read my previous post?

Perhaps you would like to give some names and links? If you mean the Kosovo cluster****, then yes, it's bad, but it's got a long way to go if it wants to match the Islamists.

I just provided you with statistics. Don't like it, leave it. Provide some of your own.

Yeah, most of Muslims, like Christians, don't really care and yet the adherents of one of them commit far more atrocities than the other.

Yep, religions tend to be those kind of ideologies. One, in particular, is especially bad.

http://youtu.be/raVW9mvJtp8

Jesus and Mo.

Originally posted by Bentley
This is obvious, why pretend these attacks are about religion (they aren't) if the religion angle can't be used at all. The perpetrators claim it's about religion as they could claim it was about race, about a nation, ecology or freedom. It isn't about religion in any true sense of the word, they want to divide the population and it has to be done at some level.

What are you trying to say? Can you read their minds if you say that it wasn't about religion?

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
What are you trying to say? Can you read their minds if you say that it wasn't about religion?

We are at war. I'd be an idiot if I was to take the propaganda spout by the enemy at face value.

When you communicate, is not only about the message you send, but also to choose the topic that must be discussed. Recently the terrorists have chosen to call themselves an Islamic State, because they want to enforce the idea of Islam fighting the West. They are making noise to control the opinion we have on them.

I can't help but to give a comicbook example. In Earth X, the terrorist organization that Magneto leads is called the Brotherhood of Evil mutants. Magneto explains that by calling his side evil, the other side is forced to get the higher moral ground and assume the "good" side of the battle. This is just silly entertainment for young adults, but they figured out already the kind of propaganda these terrorist use. They are the Islamic side so the other side has to be the anti-islamic side.

I won't buy into their lies.

Wait...

So you don't believe that they (they as in Jihadists and Extreme Theocratic Sharia Parties, i.e. ISIS, not every Muslim) are really trying to create a theocratic caliphate, and believe it's all lip service? They don't really want to impose "God's Law" as they claim (and in some cases, actually do)?

Originally posted by MF DELPH
Wait...

So you don't believe that they (they as in Jihadists and Extreme Theocratic Sharia Parties, i.e. ISIS, not every Muslim) are really trying to create a theocratic caliphate, and believe it's all lip service? They don't really want to impose "God's Law" as they claim (and in some cases, actually do)?

Did Stalin really want to establish a Socialist world government with equality for the working class in every region on Earth? Maybe that was the case but very likely that wasn't the point at all. Ideology helps to you get a tight grip on power and to rally the lower classes into a helpless battle. Bottomline, the difference never mattered.

There is also the fact that terrorists don't have what it takes to build any kind of government, they thrive in the lack of stability on their region, so fighting a battle that is impossible to win fuel their endless pursuit of power.

ICM Poll: 20% of British Muslims sympathize with 7/7 bombers
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1510866/Poll-reveals-40pc-of-Muslims-want-sharia-law-in-UK.html

NOP Research: 1 in 4 British Muslims say 7/7 bombings were justified
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/14/opinion/main1893879.shtml&date=2011-04-06
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY

YNet: One third of Palestinians (32%) supported the slaughter of a Jewish family, including the children:
http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/04/06/32-of-palestinians-support-infanticide/
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4053251,00.html

World Public Opinion: 61% of Egyptians approve of attacks on Americans
32% of Indonesians approve of attacks on Americans
41% of Pakistanis approve of attacks on Americans
38% of Moroccans approve of attacks on Americans
83% of Palestinians approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (only 14% oppose)
62% of Jordanians approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (21% oppose)
42% of Turks approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (45% oppose)
A minority of Muslims disagreed entirely with terror attacks on Americans:
(Egypt 34%; Indonesia 45%; Pakistan 33%)
About half of those opposed to attacking Americans were sympathetic with al-Qaeda’s attitude toward the U.S.
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb09/STARTII_Feb09_rpt.pdf

Pew Research (2010): 55% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hezbollah
30% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hezbollah
45% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hezbollah (26% negative)
43% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hezbollah (30% negative)
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

Pew Research (2010): 60% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hamas (34% negative).
49% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hamas (48% negative)
49% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hamas (25% negative)
39% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hamas (33% negative)
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

Pew Research (2010): 15% of Indonesians believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
34% of Nigerian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/

16% of young Muslims in Belgium state terrorism is "acceptable".
http://www.hln.be/hln/nl/1275/Islam/article/detail/1619036/2013/04/22/Zestien-procent-moslimjongens-vindt-terrorisme-aanvaardbaar.dhtml

Populus Poll (2006): 12% of young Muslims in Britain (and 12% overall) believe that suicide attacks against civilians in Britain can be justified. 1 in 4 support suicide attacks against British troops.
http://www.populuslimited.com/pdf/2006_02_07_times.pdf
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

Pew Research (2007): 26% of younger Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are justified.
35% of young Muslims in Britain believe suicide bombings are justified (24% overall).
42% of young Muslims in France believe suicide bombings are justified (35% overall).
22% of young Muslims in Germany believe suicide bombings are justified.(13% overall).
29% of young Muslims in Spain believe suicide bombings are justified.(25% overall).
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

Pew Research (2011): 8% of Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (81% never).
28% of Egyptian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (38% never).
http://www.people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-americans-no-signs-of-growth-in-alienation-or-support-for-extremism/

Pew Research (2007): Muslim-Americans who identify more strongly with their religion are three times more likely to feel that suicide bombings are justified
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

ICM: 5% of Muslims in Britain tell pollsters they would not report a planned Islamic terror attack to authorities.
27% do not support the deportation of Islamic extremists preaching violence and hate.
http://www.scotsman.com/?id=1956912005
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist.html

Federation of Student Islamic Societies: About 1 in 5 Muslim students in Britain (18%) would not report a fellow Muslim planning a terror attack.
http://www.fosis.org.uk/sac/FullReport.pdf
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

ICM Poll: 25% of British Muslims disagree that a Muslim has an obligation to report terrorists to police.
http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/Guardian%20Muslims%20Poll%20Nov%2004/Guardian%20Muslims%20Nov04.asp
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

Populus Poll (2006): 16% of British Muslims believe suicide attacks against Israelis are justified.
37% believe Jews in Britain are a "legitimate target".
http://www.populuslimited.com/pdf/2006_02_07_times.pdf
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

Pew Research (2013): At least 1 in 4 Muslims do not reject violence against civilians (study did not distinguish between those who believe it is partially justified and never justified).
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Religious_Affiliation/Muslim/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf

Pew Research (2013): 15% of Muslims in Turkey support suicide bombings (also 11% in Kosovo, 26% in Malaysia and 26% in Bangladesh).
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Religious_Affiliation/Muslim/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf

PCPO (2014): 89% of Palestinians support Hamas and other terrorists firing rockets at Israeli civilians.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/08/poll-89-of-palestinians-support-jihad-terror-attacks-on-israely

Pew Research (2013): Only 57% of Muslims worldwide disapprove of al-Qaeda. Only 51% disapprove of the Taliban. 13% support both groups and 1 in 4 refuse to say.
http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/09/10/muslim-publics-share-concerns-about-extremist-groups/
http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/09/10/muslim-publics-share-concerns-about-extremist-groups/

Pew Research (2007): 5% of American Muslims have a favorable view of al-Qaeda (27% can’t make up their minds). Only 58% reject al-Qaeda outright.
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans.pdf#page=60

Pew Research (2011): 5% of American Muslims have a favorable view of al-Qaeda (14% can’t make up their minds).
http://www.people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-americans-no-signs-of-growth-in-alienation-or-support-for-extremism/

Pew Research (2011): 1 in 10 native-born Muslim-Americans have a favorable view of al-Qaeda.
http://people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-americans-no-signs-of-growth-in-alienation-or-support-for-extremism/

al-Jazeera (2006): 49.9% of Muslims polled support Osama bin Laden
http://terrorism.about.com/b/2006/09/11/al-jazeeras-readers-on-911-499-support-bin-laden.htm

Pew Research: 59% of Indonesians support Osama bin Laden in 2003
41% of Indonesians support Osama bin Laden in 2007
56% of Jordanians support Osama bin Laden in 2003
http://www.forbes.com/2010/02/15/iran-terrorism-al-qaida-islam-opinions-columnists-ilan-berman.html

Pew Global: 51% of Palestinians support Osama bin Laden
54% of Muslim Nigerians Support Osama bin Laden
http://frontpagemag.com/2010/02/10/blinded-by-hate/
http://pewglobal.org/files/pdf/268.pdf

MacDonald Laurier Institute: 35% of Canadian Muslims would not repudiate al-Qaeda
http://www.torontosun.com/2011/11/01/strong-support-for-shariah-in-canada
http://www.macdonaldlaurier.ca/much-good-news-and-some-worrying-results-in-new-study-of-muslim-public-opinion-in-canada/

World Public Opinion: Muslim majorities agree with the al-Qaeda goal of Islamic law.
Muslim majorities agree with al-Qaeda goal of keeping Western values out of Islamic countries;
(Egypt: 88%; Indonesia 76%; Pakistan 60%; Morocco 64%)
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb09/STARTII_Feb09_rpt.pdf

ICM Poll: 13% of Muslim in Britain support al-Qaeda attacks on America.
http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/guardian-muslims-march-2004.asp
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-survey-research-from-a-british-islamist

World Public Opinion: Attitude toward Osama bin Laden:
Egypt: 44% positive, 17% negative, and 25% mixed feelings
Indonesia: 14% positive, 26% negative, 21% mixed feelings (39% did not answer)
Pakistan: 25% positive, 15% negative, 26% mixed feelings (34% did not answer)
Morocco: 27% positive, 21% negative, 26% mixed feelings
Jordanians, Palestinians, Turks and Azerbaijanis. Jordanians combined for: 27% positive, 20 percent negative, and 27 percent mixed feelings. (Palestinians 56% positive, 20% negative, 22 percent mixed feelings).
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb09/STARTII_Feb09_rpt.pdf

NOP Research: 78% of British Muslims support punishing the publishers of Muhammad cartoons;
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/14/opinion/main1893879.shtml&date=2011-04-06
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY

Wow... the numbers are actually worse than I suspected. Religion of Peace(tm) roughly half of whose adherents support terrorism. ****in' A.

Lol @ everyone here defending Islam as usual.

AG is the only one here who has any clue, the rest is just trying to be politically correct.

And talking about India Terrorism. Gimmie a fcking break, since that is really an issue and what we are talking about in this thread.

Is India's "terrorism" running rampet through London streets with guns and the middle east?

Back ass liberal thinking.

Blame everyone but the people responsible.

Be ashamed.

It's disheartening to see normally intelligent people like Robtard suffering from selective blindness when it comes to Islam.

Any religion or ideology can be used as a weapon. Today's establishment of a Caliphate was yesterday's Reich, or the Inquisition before that and so on. I just draw the line at special pleading for religious ideologies being exempt from responsibility for the atrocities they inspire. If you can blame nationalism, socialism, communism, or tribalism you can blame theism. As Ras Kass spit, "Racism, sexism, every ism is a schism".

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
It's disheartening to see normally intelligent people like Robtard suffering from selective blindness when it comes to Islam.

What exactly did I post here that showed "selective blindness"?

Originally posted by Robtard
What exactly did I post here that showed "selective blindness"?

You actually attempted to mount a defense of this horrid religion and its followers(of whom an absolutely appalling number support terrorism).

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
You actually attempted to mount a defense of this horrid religion and its followers(of whom an absolutely appalling number support terrorism).

Pointing out errors/false claims/statistics doesn't automatically mean "defending". I don't care for Islam anymore than I do any other religion.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Lol @ everyone here defending Islam as usual.

AG is the only one here who has any clue, the rest is just trying to be politically correct.

And talking about India Terrorism. Gimmie a fcking break, since that is really an issue and what we are talking about in this thread.

Is India's "terrorism" running rampet through London streets with guns and the middle east?

Back ass liberal thinking.

Blame everyone but the people responsible.

Be ashamed.

Can you name a single person here who hasn't blamed the two gunmen and condemned their actions?