Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Emperor smoked some of the most powerful Jedi of the Order inside a space station. Improvement is apparent.
Originally posted by Nephthys
My contention is that if he had the ability to freely allow time for one area of his Sith persona, then why not also have time to study ancient texts or meditate or perform some rituals or think of new ways to be really, really evil.
Issuing/relaying orders via private communication as Sidious is much less extreme than conducting dark side rituals a la Sithisis or "Sacrifice" or conducting Sith field trips to kick ass "The Lawless" or Son of Dathomir. I agree that opportunities existed, I just doubt he had time or opportunity to study consistently.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Prove he couldn't do that before. Then you would have to show the actual strength of completely featless characters. Go on, I'll wait for the title wave of hype you have saved on your hard drive that's back up by not a single showing.
Growth in power is visible with other actions in the following manner:
Emperor became more powerful then the greatest Lords of the ancients such as Marka Ragnos and Tulak Hord at the culmination of Nathema ritual. 20 years later, Emperor arrived in Dromund Kaas and began to hone his talents in the dark side even further, eventually managing to alter the environment of the entire planet with great exertion (Dromund Kaas is an enormous planet with diameter of around 22000 kms). At certain point, Emperor confronted a Strike Team of powerful Sith Lords and smoked it. Later on, Emperor broke the duo of Jedi heroes Revan and Malak with just his telepathic abilities in a confrontation with them (Revan was already the most powerful Jedi of the Order during this time). Some years later, after the events of KoTOR II, Revan believed that Emperor could perform Nathema ritual on his own during his time, and exceeded Meetra's imagination regarding the potential of a Force-user. After the events of Revan, Emperor increased his safe-guard by shifting his essence into other hosts (Voices) at will, literally destroyed the minds of some (Jedi) opponents with just his telepathic abilities, and expanded his influence on many worlds by transforming thousands of individuals into Children whom he dispersed on galactic scale including within the Jedi Order itself. Emperor had been literally multi-tasking with his activities on an enormous scale since the events of Revan. As of SWTOR, Emperor had fully prepared himself for his most ambitious ritual with which he would consume the entire galaxy successfully and had mastered the dark side to its fullest.
Originally posted by Sinious
Do you think Vitiate is not around ROTS Sidious level?
I think ROTS Sidious is noticeably more power than Vitiate. Just not to the extent that he'd ragdoll him. I think Vitiate can put up a fight in a force contest before being overpowered. Vitiate had to conjure up his most powerful attack to overpower Revan (on a DS nexus); whereas Sidious proved that he could have easily ended both Maul and Savage at the same time, and has manhandled Dooku from across the galaxy (both feats off a nexus).
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Emperor have the feat of defeating a Strike Team earlier so I cannot say much in the context of combat prowess. However, it is pointed out in multiple sources that Emperor continued to grow in power throughout his span of existence by utilizing Force Drain related talents against his subjects and/or individuals in general.Growth in power is visible with other actions in the following manner:
Emperor became more powerful then the greatest Lords of the ancients such as Marka Ragnos and Tulak Hord at the culmination of Nathema ritual. 20 years later, Emperor arrived in Dromund Kaas and began to hone his talents in the dark side even further, eventually managing to alter the environment of the entire planet with great exertion (Dromund Kaas is an enormous planet with diameter of around 22000 kms). At certain point, Emperor confronted a Strike Team of powerful Sith Lords and smoked it. Later on, Emperor broke the duo of Jedi heroes Revan and Malak with just his telepathic abilities in a confrontation with them (Revan was already the most powerful Jedi of the Order during this time). Some years later, after the events of KoTOR II, Revan believed that Emperor could perform Nathema ritual on his own during his time, and exceeded Meetra's imagination regarding the potential of a Force-user. After the events of Revan, Emperor increased his safe-guard by shifting his essence into other hosts (Voices) at will, literally destroyed the minds of some (Jedi) opponents with just his telepathic abilities, and expanded his influence on many worlds by transforming thousands of individuals into Children whom he dispersed on galactic scale including within the Jedi Order itself. Emperor had been literally multi-tasking with his activities on an enormous scale since the events of Revan. As of SWTOR, Emperor had fully prepared himself for his most ambitious ritual with which he would consume the entire galaxy successfully and had mastered the dark side to its fullest.
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
I think ROTS Sidious is noticeably more power than Vitiate. Just not to the extent that he'd ragdoll him. I think Vitiate can put up a fight in a force contest before being overpowered. Vitiate had to conjure up his most powerful attack to overpower Revan (on a DS nexus); whereas Sidious proved that he could have easily ended both Maul and Savage at the same time, and has manhandled Dooku from across the galaxy (both feats off a nexus).
in the force:
Sidious > Vitiate
in a duel:
Sidious >>> Vitiate
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That's what I thought. You have absolutely nothing to establish the power level of any member of the strike team besides the HoT. Nothing to refute the fact that the trully powerful can't be mindraped and it takes prep, and nothing to establish Vitate's actual powerlevel or his growth. Moving on then.
Tol Braga have some feats in the game; he Force-pushed HoT mid-air and ripped apart a large structure from its foundation which he threw towards HoT in an attempt to crush the opponent beneath it. Both are telekinetic actions.
Braga also have history of defeating a Dark Council member in an extremely lengthy confrontation (arguably the longest known yet, spanning 3 days).
The other two have significant hype and managed to reach Emperor's position inside the Space Station after fighting through its defenses much like HoT (which happened off-screen). One of them (Sedoru) was very good at reading the minds of others as far as his known talents are concerned.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Go on, I'll wait for the tidal wave of hype you have saved on your hard drive that's back up by not a single showing.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Emperor have the feat of defeating a Strike Team earlier so I cannot say much in the context of combat prowess. However, it is pointed out in multiple sources that Emperor continued to grow in power throughout his span of existence by utilizing Force Drain related talents against his subjects and/or individuals in general.Growth in power is visible with other actions in the following manner:
Emperor became more powerful then the greatest Lords of the ancients such as Marka Ragnos and Tulak Hord at the culmination of Nathema ritual. 20 years later, Emperor arrived in Dromund Kaas and began to hone his talents in the dark side even further, eventually managing to alter the environment of the entire planet with great exertion (Dromund Kaas is an enormous planet with diameter of around 22000 kms). At certain point, Emperor confronted a Strike Team of powerful Sith Lords and smoked it. Later on, Emperor broke the duo of Jedi heroes Revan and Malak with just his telepathic abilities in a confrontation with them (Revan was already the most powerful Jedi of the Order during this time). Some years later, after the events of KoTOR II, Revan believed that Emperor could perform Nathema ritual on his own during his time, and exceeded Meetra's imagination regarding the potential of a Force-user. After the events of Revan, Emperor increased his safe-guard by shifting his essence into other hosts (Voices) at will, literally destroyed the minds of some (Jedi) opponents with just his telepathic abilities, and expanded his influence on many worlds by transforming thousands of individuals into Children whom he dispersed on galactic scale including within the Jedi Order itself. Emperor had been literally multi-tasking with his activities on an enormous scale since the events of Revan. As of SWTOR, Emperor had fully prepared himself for his most ambitious ritual with which he would consume the entire galaxy successfully and had mastered the dark side to its fullest.
laughcry
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Great.You mean in martial terms or holistic?
EDIT: I see that your edited your remark.
Proved by whom?
By people making good arguments in favor of Sidious. I've seen nothing that suggests Vitiate eclipses Sidious in the force.
And, importantly, even if we assume they are equals in the force, Sidious still has a tremendous edge in a dueling scenario.
Originally posted by Stigma
I did, at first glance I thought you quoted my whole post.By people making good arguments in favor of Sidious. I've seen nothing that suggests Vitiate eclipses Sidious in the force.
And, importantly, even if we assume they are equals in the force, Sidious still has a tremendous edge in a dueling scenario.
👆
Originally posted by Stigma
I did, at first glance I thought you quoted my whole post.By people making good arguments in favor of Sidious. I've seen nothing that suggests Vitiate eclipses Sidious in the force.
And, importanlty, even if we assume they are equals in the force, Sidious still has a tremendous edge in a dueling scenario.
Sidious have advantage in the sense of having exceptional martial abilities. However, Vitiate fights safely by relying on his overwhelming powers to get the job done, this strategy have served him well for an enormous span of time.
Not trying to rule out a lightsaber score on Sidious's part but it is a remote possibility.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Eclipsing is not the point. However, it shall be understood that Vitiate can harm and eventually eliminate Sidious with his powers, should it come down to combat between the two, he is just that good. If people assume that Sidious will be immune to Vitiate's powers, they are not being rational and realistic.Sidious have advantage in the sense of having exceptional martial abilities. However, Vitiate fights safely by relying on his overwhelming powers to get the job done, this strategy have served him well for an enormous span of time.
Vitiate isn't immune to Sidious's powers either and Sidious can eliminate him either with Force powers or his lightsaber. 👆
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Vitiate isn't immune to Sidious's powers either and Sidious can eliminate him either with Force powers or his lightsaber. 👆
Sidious's best chances are with a lightsaber and a bit of luck factor.