Originally posted by Mindset
He was created in the 40's in the Marvel Universe. There was/is racism in the Marvel Universe.It's irrelevant what year it is in the real world.
If you aren't talking about making Steve Rogers black, I'm not sure what you're talking about.
Nope wasn't talking about making Rogers black.
Originally posted by Bardock42
One aspect of the character can be that he is ostensibly the ideal of the superman in a nazi context. However a further reading can be that he actually isn't at all until he gets made into the super soldier, making a statement about everyone being able to be the superman. Obviously a black Captain America in the 1940s would be a completely different character, alone due to the even more blatant racism in the US at that time, but the ideals of Captain America aren't linked to being white. And Falcon being Captain America is most definitely not ridiculous, but rather natural and imo good.
You sir are right!!
Originally posted by Bardock42They wouldn't have picked Rogers to even be in the super soldier program if he were black.
One aspect of the character can be that he is ostensibly the ideal of the superman in a nazi context. However a further reading can be that he actually isn't at all until he gets made into the super soldier, making a statement about everyone being able to be the superman. Obviously a black Captain America in the 1940s would be a completely different character, alone due to the even more blatant racism in the US at that time, but the ideals of Captain America aren't linked to being white. And Falcon being Captain America is most definitely not ridiculous, but rather natural and imo good.
Originally posted by Supermex
All in all there shouldn't be any backlash on Captain America being White, Black, Hispanic or any other race. He represents America the melting pot of the world. But you will always have opposition on that point.The current Captain America is black.
I haven't read any comics (especially not Marvel) in a while but please tell me you're joking about that. If they make such a huge change to such an iconic and well-known character's appearance as changing their race then I will never touch another comic made by that comic company ever again.
Making CA black? Seriously? Who's next? Superman? Wonder Woman? LOL. I'm sorry but doing something like that is utterly ridiculous. You wanna change the race of a lesser known character fine but don't make such a drastic change to the appearance of the icons we all grew up watching and reading and are such a huge part of our culture. That's like spitting in our faces. You wanna call me a "racist" for feeling that way then I don't really give a ****.
Originally posted by Star428Racist.
I haven't read any comics (especially not Marvel) in a while but please tell me you're joking about that. If they make such a huge change to such an iconic and well-known character's appearance as changing their race then I will never touch another comic made by that comic company ever again.Making CA black? Seriously? Who's next? Superman? Wonder Woman? LOL. I'm sorry but doing something like that is utterly ridiculous. You wanna change the race of a lesser known character fine but don't make such a drastic change to the appearance of the icons we all grew up watching and reading and are such a huge part of our culture. That's like spitting in our faces. You wanna call me a "racist" for feeling that way then I don't really give a ****.
Originally posted by Star428
I haven't read any comics (especially not Marvel) in a while but please tell me you're joking about that. If they make such a huge change to such an iconic and well-known character's appearance as changing their race then I will never touch another comic made by that comic company ever again.Making CA black? Seriously? Who's next? Superman? Wonder Woman? LOL. I'm sorry but doing something like that is utterly ridiculous. You wanna change the race of a lesser known character fine but don't make such a drastic change to the appearance of the icons we all grew up watching and reading and are such a huge part of our culture. That's like spitting in our faces. You wanna call me a "racist" for feeling that way then I don't really give a ****.
They didn't change the original Captain America(Steve Rogers)
They handed the Captain America mantle to a new person who happens to be black.
Nothing wrong with that.
Originally posted by NemeBro
Shaft being black is arguably important to his character/identity, sort of like Captain America one might say.Aquaman being white isn't.
You might say,"Oh, well just create new cool black/hispanic/asian/gay/brony/whatever characters", but see, here's the thing: movies have a finite screen time. They can't just create a black character and be done with it. Then they have another character who they have to make interesting and complex, one who detracts from the screen time of the more major players. The reason the ethnicity of an established character is altered is because then one is able to have a more ethnically diverse cast of characters without distracting viewers from the more central aspects of the movie. It's the most efficient way of both creating a cool black character without bringing down the film's quality.
So really, why do you care?
Except that with Aquaman, they aren't just changing his skin-colour. They're changing his origin to go with it.
So it's a really bad example, tbh.
And I really don't get the whole "it's not that big a part of his identity" argument. The dude's white. Just like Black Panther is black. Karma is Asian. Falcon is black. Guy Gardner is white. Changing something solely for diversity is a piss poor reason, imo, when they could just use a different character.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Except that with Aquaman, they aren't just changing his skin-colour. They're changing his origin to go with it.So it's a really bad example, tbh.
It's only a bad example if people were only complaining about any change in background. But they are also whining that Jason Momoa is just dark enough to make them uncomfortable. So the example is fine. 👆
And I really don't get the whole "it's not that big a part of his identity" argument. The dude's white. Just like Black Panther is black. Karma is Asian. Falcon is black. Guy Gardner is white. Changing something solely for diversity is a piss poor reason, imo, when they could just use a different character.
It's a considerably lesser part of his identity than Black Panther being an African male, to the extent that it doesn't really matter at all. I have no idea who the other characters sans Guy are, so okay?
If Aquaman was black, literally nothing about him would be changed. That the execs are choosing to change his backstory is incidental.
So what about Aquaman being dark-skinned bothers you?
Originally posted by NemeBro
It's only a bad example if people were only complaining about any change in background. But they are also whining that Jason Momoa is just dark enough to make them uncomfortable. So the example is fine. 👆It's a considerably lesser part of his identity than Black Panther being an African male, to the extent that it doesn't really matter at all. I have no idea who the other characters sans Guy are, so okay?
If Aquaman was black, literally nothing about him would be changed. That the execs are choosing to change his backstory is incidental.
So what about Aquaman being dark-skinned bothers you?
I disagree, considering that the change in race is specifically something that is making them change his origin. Because Momoa has Polynesian ancestry, so will Aquaman too. They go hand in hand.
The part that bothers me is the assumption that somehow the version from the comics is somehow inadequate, and that wholesale changes are needed to bring him to the big screen. that diversity matters more than a character's integrity. changing his race and his origin are just symptoms of a larger problem to me.
most of these characters have their backgrounds wired into their skin colour. Bruce Wayne for instance is from old money; white people are old money, may sound racist but its true. Clark Kent is alien but specifically white because his backstory has him found by a white family in rural Kansas, the subterfuge of passing him off as their natural son wouldn't work had he been any other colour. Wonder Woman should be olive skin because she's from Greek myth. Peter Parker COULD be changed, he is after all a guy that grows up in New York but he's so iconic that honestly it would probably be weird for the GA to see a black kid play Pete. All the characters that have been mentioned have been the only one to wear the mantle of the mask for their entire history (few exceptions not withstanding) so, like Peter, their skin colour is forever linked with their iconic imagery
Not sure what's greater in this thread, the racism or whining.
Who the **** cares if a comic-character's standard "race" is changed when 99% of the time the character's "race" is irrelevant to their story. I can understand if a character like the Red Skull was cast as Black or Asian or any non-white, since being "Aryan" is an intrinsic part of the charater.
eg People whining over the possibility of Spider-Man going black, when it doesn't matter. Peter Parker is an awkward nerdy kid, his "white" skin is next to irrelevant to his backstory
eg Does a black Johnny Storm matter when they added the change of "adopted" to his backstory? No, it does not.
eg People crying over a black Heimdall, when he's Asgardian (ie an alien for all intents) and not an actual Scandinavian
/endrant