Originally posted by ares834
Yes he did... "he used his dark Force powers to enslave the people on the world" and "Almost mindless under the oppression of the Emperor’s dark side influence."
Byss populace was loyal to Palpatine before DE related events:
At the height of the New Order, long before the Rebellion gained its first victories, Palpatine would vacation on Byss and entertain his circle of intimates. Beings of great intelligence, they had proven their loyalty to their master. Guests at the palace were soon indoctrinated into the ways of the Dark Side.
Unlike many of the Emperor's other servants, a number of these were aliens. Most of these individuals had already mastered the unique sorceries of their own species, and the Emperor has brought them to Byss as much to study their knowledge as to train them in his.
While none of them were permitted to advance far compared to Palpatine's own level of power, they did become quite powerful indeed. Some were taught ways of combat and made into Dark Jedi. Others joined the elite of Imperial functionaries, traversing the galaxy and seeing to the proper enforcement of Palpatine’s decrees. Still others were courtiers at the Palace in the new capital on Byss.
Whatever they do, they enact the Emperor's will and policies with his total trust and confidence because their link to him through the Force allows him to always observe them. Before the Emperor's defeat, many had been gathered into the Imperial Ruling Council. It had been planned that eventually these adepts would replace the system of Moffs, Grand Moffs and governors, instituting a Dark Side Theocracy.
With his adepts securely in power, they were to participate in experiments on the "Science of Darkness," feeding on and draining the life essence of the citizenry.
Taken from Dark Empire Sourcebook (Page 68)
Originally posted by ares834
Palpatine had control over most of the populace of Byss which had a population of almost 20 billion.Exar Kun has also created deadly creatures "at will" out of dark side energy.
Palpatine did so at his leisure over a 20 year period. He could easily have performed rituals or vastly amped himself to do so. Vitiate did it in a weakened spirit form on a battalion of Jedi to boot and in much less time. His domination was also far more complete and impressive.
Originally posted by ares834
Both quotes were taken from the miniatures/role playing game online supplement. He also fed of them though as well.
Not the most solid of sources....
Sidious also mindwiped potentially millions on Coruscant.
Also the Sith Emperor's spirit form would in many ways make him more dominating, we've seen many times "mortals" unable to resist Sith spirits. Take the Dark Temple for example, where spirits of Sith Lords (eclipsed by the Emperor's power no doubt) were able to easily dominate the minds of non-Force sensitives and Force sensitives alike. Any supremely powerful Sith spirit would be able to magnify this feat tenfold.
Originally posted by NephthysHere's a better one:
Not the most solid of sources....
Almost mindless under the oppression of the Emperor's dark side influence, the people of Byss find their life energies constantly leeched off during the Emperor's vile machinations.No it wasn't instantaneous, but the feat is much much greater in scope, and he did it in corporeal rather than spirit form.--Taken from The Dark Empire Endnotes
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Here's a better one:
No it wasn't instantaneous, but the feat is much much greater in scope, and he did it in corporeal rather than spirit form.
Sucking the "life" out of inhabitants for decades isn't as impressive as wiping out a planet within 10 days and becoming immortal.
Also, where does it say Palpatine mind wiped coruscant?
Originally posted by psmith81992
Sucking the "life" out of inhabitants for decades isn't as impressive as wiping out a planet within 10 days and becoming immortal.Also, where does it say Palpatine mind wiped coruscant?
That was the Lusankya incident wasn't it? He built a super star destroyer under Coruscant, it took off so he mind wiped the planet into forgetting it happened. That includes everyone who saw it on the news etc, everyone who saw the buildings rubble afterwards and basically anyone who came into contact with it.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Also the Sith Emperor's spirit form would in many ways make him more dominating, we've seen many times "mortals" unable to resist Sith spirits. Take the Dark Temple for example, where spirits of Sith Lords (eclipsed by the Emperor's power no doubt) were able to easily dominate the minds of non-Force sensitives and Force sensitives alike. Any supremely powerful Sith spirit would be able to magnify this feat tenfold.
Spirits are weaker in general though and have limited power. Merely using the Force means they require substantial rest or a power source. And the case here is that Vitiate is actively possessing countless soldiers and people. The spirits in the Dark Temple were limited to possessing a single person and not particularly well at that. Aside from Kallig they were basically crazed and disorientated, unable to perceive reality. Plus they were aided by the Dark Temple, in that it's energies already put people under considerable mental strain merely being near it. And we actually saw that the main Jedi Vitiate was using was able to attempt to resist him, indicating that there is an element of will and power at play.
Also if you believe this, then what do you think of Sidious brainwashing billions of non-force sensitives who actually have no means of resistance?
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Here's a better one:
No it wasn't instantaneous, but the feat is much much greater in scope, and he did it in corporeal rather than spirit form.
But the fact that he performed it under unknown circumstances and time already eliminates it from consideration as an indication of his standing power. In my opinion. Plus while it may be greater in scope, that doesn't mean its greater in power. Vitiate is a weakened spirit for one thing, which makes it more impressive in my estimation. And he's actively possessing and subjugating those individuals at all times. He'd need to constantly be applying his power to maintain this. By all accounts Sidious' domination of Byss was a gradual process and requires no active strain upon him to maintain. Sidious may have influenced more people, but Vitiate did it to a far greater extent and in a much more impressive manner. And Vitiate performed it on actual Force Users who have the means to resist him. It's always a far superior feat to mentally influence Jedi and Sith than it is to do so to normal people.
What? Being a spirit doesn't make one weaker, plus isn't Ziost a nexus? So Vitiate being able to dominate the minds of all those guys, of course it's gonna happen given he can draw on the energies much like many Sith spirits have done to use vast power and the like. It's nothing new really.
It's impressive sure, but people it's nothing that hasn't been done.
Wolf is right, being a spirit makes one much more potent, as you are no longer restricted by the limitations of your physical form e.g. midichlorians and altogether are in closer harmony with the Force. Just like Jedi, Sith Spirits can become "more powerful than you can possible imagine".
Hence why Exar Kun believed that by transforming into a spirit, he would become unstoppable.
This is of course counter balanced by the fact that as a Sith spirit, struggling against their own annihilation or rather subsumption into the Force, are in a precarious state of limbo, and often require some kind of anchor to the physical plane.
Anyway, I'm going to wait until 3.2 is released before passing judgement, I'm just making observations at this point.
Originally posted by Zenwolf
What? Being a spirit doesn't make one weaker, plus isn't Ziost a nexus? So Vitiate being able to dominate the minds of all those guys, of course it's gonna happen given he can draw on the energies much like many Sith spirits have done to use vast power and the like. It's nothing new really.It's impressive sure, but people it's nothing that hasn't been done.
Also, this is official disclosure:
Unleashed from hiding on Yavin 4, the former Sith Emperor has struck the Imperial world of Ziost. Using his immense power in the dark side of the Force, he has dominated the minds of the planet's martial forces--as well as an elite cadre of militaristic Jedi--and has set them against the populace, engaging in a bloody slaughter.
Source: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=802798
Ziost, being strong in the dark side, is irrelevant. Emperor Vitiate is not dependent on a nexus setting to perform great feats, he represents embodiment of the dark side:
The Emperor is more than a man - he is the living embodiment of the dark side.
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
[I]He was a living embodiment of the dark side of the Force who delighted in destroying the minds and spirits of those Jedi who came too close to him.[/I
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
---
Also, Emperor creates nexuses in his wake in any region, as a side-effect of his actions. He is the embodiment of the dark side.
Originally posted by ares834
Umm.... What? If we are using disney canon and not EU then Vitiate doesn't even exist.
It baffles me how people keep forgetting that Disney have stated they will be borrowing/recycling stuff from the EU/Legends continuity. That means they can easily bring him back into it.
They are not so stupid that they'd just ignore so many awesome ideas.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
While spirits are powerful manifestations of the Force in their own right, they do not match the raw power of their mortal-self.Also, this is official disclosure:
Unleashed from hiding on Yavin 4, the former Sith Emperor has struck the Imperial world of Ziost. Using his immense power in the dark side of the Force, he has dominated the minds of the planet's martial forces--as well as an elite cadre of militaristic Jedi--and has set them against the populace, engaging in a bloody slaughter.
Source: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=802798
Ziost, being strong in the dark side, is irrelevant. Emperor Vitiate is not dependent on a nexus setting to perform great feats, he represents embodiment of the dark side:
The Emperor is more than a man - he is the living embodiment of the dark side.
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
[I]He was a living embodiment of the dark side of the Force who delighted in destroying the minds and spirits of those Jedi who came too close to him.[/I
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
---
Also, Emperor creates nexuses in his wake in any region, as a side-effect of his actions. He is the embodiment of the dark side.
That says nothing about Spirit beings not being able to match their mortal body. All it's saying is that Vitiate used his immense power of the Dark side and he's a spirit there.
Also PS, Exar Kun?...He showed far more power than when he was mortal.
But i'll let the people with better knowledge of spiritual forms take this.