Shaak Ti vs. Jaden Korr vs Kas'im

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Yes because being forced to your knees by being slammed with multiple heavy objects and slashed across the face with a lightsaber is totally the same as focusing on something else, realizing something's about to happen, then returning her attention to her defenses? Seems legit.

It's quite amazing how you can constantly miss the point. QTEs happen after you already beat your opponent. It's like me saying Kenobi could've ragdolled the burning Anakin so the duel must've been one sided.

Anyway can we stop debating canonically irrelevant gameplay mechanics?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
That's a relief, the false equivalency you were trying to draw to make Shaak's egregious mistake excusable by comparison was getting a bit irritating to read. So good on you for stopping 👆

Sure thing kid 🙄

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Well he's making more sense than you on this thread tbf

Lmao, that comment says a lot more about you than me.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
That or she sensed the attack cutting and cut herself off mid sentence to erect a Force defense as quickly as possible.

You are just constantly repeating yourself without even addressing my argument. Pretty shit ngl. Are you gona explain how can someone defend from an attack to such degree that she's not even blow off her feet but at the same time gets seriously injured? Sounds f-ucking contradictory to me.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
And there could've easily been more time between Shaak turning around and Galen unleashing the repulse by that same logic.

I'm starting to think your mind has missing panels by the jumps of logic you make. Anyhow, as I already said, and as you already ignored (as you seem to be doing with most of my arguments), Shaak was already hit by the attack before she could've even raise her hands.

I even highlighted it for your convenience.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
I'm pretty sure anyone reading this debate can tell that I'm not the one whose upset here lmfao

Because despite how much you like to rip on Joker for wanking Ahsoka, you seem to take Shaak Ti wank a lot more personally and emotionally than he takes Ahsoka wank. I'd hate to see what kinda tantrum you'd throw if the two of you ever debated Shaak vs Ahsoka honestly. The amount of salt Joker wanking Ahsoka and arguing against Shaak Ti would generate within you would honestly make Trigglypuff seem calm and mature by comparison.

Right, you are oh so not upset that you are spending several posts to detail just how salty I presumably am. Is that suppose to be an argument against my points or a defensive mechanism? From my experience it's always the latter.

And yeah unlike Joker I'm constantly whiteknighting Shaak every day in every thread...Oh wait, I f-ucking don't. Your salty comments by the virtue of being a desperate strategy shit tier debaters use, which I thought you are not, is quite pathetic and it also horribly inaccurate.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
No I'm arguing the main point of his attack is to free himself from the Sarlaac tentacles. That's why he used a repulse to begin with. Regardless he's clearly not focusing most of his power on Shaak, even if there's somehow a focal point headed in her direction.

Or he knew he could attack Shaak who lowered her defenses and still free himself. Anyhow either way it's speculative.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
So much of the novel was nondescript fighting throughout the Sarlaac pit, and so much of the game was gameplay (though it's worth noting the Sarlaac played a huge role in the gameplay and quicktime events), and in the comic it's noted that Shaak Ti used the planet's flora and fauna to attack Galen and actually got Galen in a stranglehold via the Sarlaac, so I'd say it obviously played a role in the fight.

Yes but it never actually gave her an edge. In the comic she almost won the fight with the Saarlac, but it ended up being her demise. In the novel Shaak only controls the Saarlac once, which was pretty much useless:

"The apprentice cut off teeth and threw the fragments at his adversary's head. In return she took tighter control of the beast's distributed intelligence and sent its food-seeking tentacles flailing for him. He repulsed them and fought on."

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Shaak Ti made it's tentacles attack him in every source, so obviously Galen would have to work on positioning himself so he's not in a vulnerable position to the tentacles.

I guess, but for a Soresu master that's a minor setback.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
The comic also notes that she had the flora and fauna of the planet attack him and that she had the planet at her command and wielded it against him.

Yeah, which begin and end with the Saarlac which I detailed above just how useless it ended up to be. Because Galen was too powerful to be contained by it.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
It's pretty funny coming from the 2 guys who never had the balls to debate Sel on Shaak vs Ahsoka. So all you are left with is butthurt comments 🙂

I'll respond to DMB after my exam.

lel at shaak ti not being off guardm by the time she puts her hand ups she's literally screaming

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Galen then proceeds to remove one of Shaak's lekku indicating the shift in the fight.

"He slashed at her own feet as they spun by overhead and sent one of her ribbons twirling down into the sarlacc's gaping mouth. "Spare me the philosophy lesson, Jedi," he snarled. "I'm only here for your blood." - The Force Unleashed.

****ing lmao.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
You do realize that that same type of Force lock also happens in the Ultimate Sith edition between Starkiller and Luke right? Even though Starkiller is displayed as being significantly above Luke?

Just the fact that they're force powers clashed doesn't prove anything when there's no evidence as to how those clashes went.

I mean, raw power wise they're pretty close...

I'm claiming the game supports Galen being above Shaak because in the only shown instances of them engaging in direct combat, Galen is driving Shaak back or landing Force strikes on her.

And I'm saying that you cannot extrapolate a temporary advantage in a small portion of the fight to the whole fight. Especially when that advantage is minimal.

So you're telling me that there's no chance of Galen bringing his blade higher and cutting through Shaak's vital organs and heart as a defensive reflex... even though such a move would be bringing his blade up towards her blade? Seems like a pretty reflexive move to me tbh

And what is this? Galen positioning his blade wouldn't have worked because Shaak would be able to predict it... even though she didn't predict him blocking it and according to you didn't predict his Force attack later on?

Not no chance, a very minimal chance. She has obviously been fine having massive damage to her vital organs, we know that, since she was shot through her vital organs and the fact file says you'd need far more than that to bring her down. A stab through the heart would end her life, obviously, since that's how she died in a deleted scene, but the idea that she would have no idea about the potential angles of his blade is farcical, considering her decades of combat experience. If you force an opponent to parry a specific strike, as she did, you limit their options for a next defence.

And yes, I've admitted several times she didn't predict his outrageous force potential, shocker.

Mutual destruction would leave the obviously flawed apprentice Maris Brood without a master, remove one of the last remaining Jedi Masters from the Galaxy, and rob the native Felucians of her leadership.

Small scale, compared to leaving an assassin as powerful as Vader alive to hunt the Jedi down one by one. At least if Vader's doing it, he's vulnerable.

It doesn't detract from Yoda's because the extent to which Yoda has that weakness has never been displayed getting him impaled by a Galen Marek level duelist.

Except that isn't a fault in her fighting style either, in regards to duelling. It's a flaw because she wasn't as strong in the force as he was, hence my inability to comprehend why you apply it to duelling specifically. We've seen on several occasions that she doesn't leave herself open to any strikes while duelling.

If she feels him fading, then clearly he is weakening. What else do you think him fading means?

Dying.

Having your energy being depleted by physically resisting being crushed by a giant tentacle monster does hinder Sith. If he's having to constantly apply force augmentation to boost his strength and durability to resist the Sarlaac crushing him then that is taxing his power.

Obviously resisting the Sarlaac would tax his power, but it would tax it less than his rage would boost it. Seeing as you seem so obsessed with game mechanics, I'd refer you to the Sarlaac repulse in the game version of the fight, where he charges his power into a force repulse...

Originally posted by Emperordmb
You're suggesting he couldn't have raised his lightsaber in response to her first two strikes because he didn't block them with his lightsaber... but you're suggesting he did raise his lightsaber to block a third strike that he also didn't block with his lightsaber... and for some reason he raised his blade after he already blocked the strike?

What you are suggesting here makes no ****ing sense.

What? No. I'm suggesting he obviously didn't raise his blade and just fvcking keep it there and hold it like that over the course of three words. He would've raised his blade to try and parry each and every attack, which means the final time Galen raised his blade would be when she started to decapitate him. Not after her final strike, but rather during it. Him keeping there for the length it took for Shaak to say three words and tag him twice is actually retarded when in that span of time far inferior Force users have cut through swarms of droids.

You still aren't proving jack shit. She was in the process of attacking him, so he clearly raised his blade in response to that assault, and likely raising his blade reflexively towards her as a result of her charging him. If she's charging towards him and he interposes his blade between them that is a valid reflex.

Galen raising his blade after Shaak's last strike though? What the **** is that in reaction to?

You're not understanding my argument, DMB. I said he raised his blade as she performed her last strike. The two things happened almost simultaneously. The only difference is Ti would've decapitated Galen, thus forcing him to lower his raised lightsaber and effectively preventing a full on impalement.

It says that she practically, as in almost threw herself onto his blade, specifically referring to her actions. Maybe she didn't literally jump on his blade, but the text still clearly implies that she moved into his blade, and if Galen is wondering whether or not she did it intentionally and did it with the intention of mutually assured outcome, then clearly Galen's blade was raised as she was attacking, not after her attack failed.

If he didn't raise his blade until after her attack failed then he wouldn't be wondering if she intentionally moved to kill them both at the same time. I don't get why this is such a difficult concept for you to grasp Wollf. If Shaak Ti's attack succeeding would've prevented her from being stabbed, then Galen would not have been wondering if she was going for a mutual destruction outcome, and he wouldn't have been noting her as moving into his blade in the desperation of her final attack, not after it.

As I said, my point isn't that Galen raised his lightsaber after her final attack, but rather that his attack would have been rendered ineffective if he had been decapitated first which was the likely result.

No. Galen is a fallible source, but I'm trusting Galen, a trained Force sensitive lightsaber duelist, to know if he raised his blade or blocked Shaak's lightsaber strike first, and given that he's wondering if she intended a mutual destruction outcome, it's clear Galen is judging this from the perspective of a combatant who had his blade up before he blocked Shaak's attack rather than raising it after her attack, because if he had raised his blade after her attack then his musings would make zero sense, and as a trained lightsaber and Force combatant who was actually in that duel he wouldn't have mused that in the first place if he had raised his blade after her attack failed.

But Galen's little theory revolves around the idea that Shaak had seen him raise his lightsaber before she unleashed her final attack which wouldn't make sense since then Marek would not be reacting to anything so it couldn't be done by reflex.

Conversely, the idea that Galen did so while she was attacking -- which is what I'm arguing, BTW -- makes perfect sense, but that still does not mean Ti did it intentionally. That is Galen's musings based on him succeeding in impaling her after she failed to decapitate him.

Wollf, there is a reason you are the only person on the forums who I have ever seen make this argument, and it is because other Shaak wankers like Zoltan and Sel recognize that this is an argument with no basis.

...

All of the evidence supports my position, and none of the evidence supports your position. That is why nobody else in the history of the forums and Shaak Ti wankers has ever used this ****ing argument, and why none of your fellow Shaak Ti wankers have adopted this argument.

DMB, there is a reason I do not care.

The text does not say Galen raised his blade after he blocked her strike, and his musings are evidence that his blade was raised before he telekinetically blocked it because she moved into his blade during her attack and that for the possibility to exist of her attempting a mutually assured destruction outcome her attack succeeding would've still ended in her being impaled on her blade.

While I admit that is a possibility, given Shaak Ti's faster and more skilled than Galen, as shown throughout the entire fight, she would have been the one to land the strike first, which would ultimately mean Galen wouldn't successfully impale her(might scar her, but a headless corpse certainly can't hold a lightsaber in place long enough and steady enough to fully pierce her) and she would have won.

I'm not mentioning it because it isn't relevant to the point I was making. It doesn't change the fact that Galen pressed Shaak hard enough in lightsaber combat to force her into that desperation tactic, or the fact that if Galen hadn't telekinetically blocked her strike it still would've ended in mutual destruction.

Again, Galen seems to think that's a desperation tactic, doesn't mean it actually was. She could have simply overextended, Galen acted on reflex and managed to stop her final attack and impale her.

Galen's physical appearance doesn't change either of those facts, so you acting as if I'm ignoring it when it has nothing to do with my point is nothing more than a thinly veiled attempt to make it look like I'm being disingenuous and ignoring context, and it's an accusation with no weight behind it all things considered.

I do think it shows who was in fact the superior throughout the entire fight if Galen would only get a lucky shot-in and Shaak could ravage his body like a rancor and land dozens of blows on him.

So Just to be sure. This is Sel, Zoltan and Myth VS Emperordmb and Syn?

Cuz I'm rooting for team Shaak

Team 1 is cooler, but Shaak is laem. 🙂

We learned one thing in this thread.
DMB can solo Wollf, Zoltan and Sel 🙂 🙂 🙂

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
So Just to be sure. This is Sel, Zoltan and Myth VS Emperordmb and Syn?

Cuz I'm rooting for team Shaak

I wouldn't group it like that, tbh. I'm avoiding the more general argument, just enjoying DMB jump through hoops to justify his blatantly false statements earlier....

Originally posted by Ursumeles
We learned one thing in this thread.
DMB can solo Wollf, Zoltan and Sel 🙂 🙂 🙂

mmm

Actually, scratch the above, pretty sure I can speak for myself, Wollf and Zoltan when I say; if anyone actually cared about your opinion on literally any topic, that might have been a decent attempt at bait 🙂

Poor Urs. 🙁

Originally posted by Selenial

Actually, scratch the above, pretty sure I can speak for myself, Wollf and Zoltan when I say; if anyone actually cared about your opinion on literally any topic, that might have been a decent attempt at bait 🙂

But why do you debate this, when you prolly debated this sh!t thousand times? (Or at least DMB vs you, lol).

Spoiler:
Did DMB showed you the gif btw?

I bought Fated with Overwatch memes.

He only wants your body.

That's one thing more than what people want from you 🙂

Nice one 🙂
Not true, tho 🙂

Originally posted by Selenial
****ing lmao.

?

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
It's quite amazing how you can constantly miss the point. QTEs happen [b]after you already beat your opponent. It's like me saying Kenobi could've ragdolled the burning Anakin so the duel must've been one sided.

Anyway can we stop debating canonically irrelevant gameplay mechanics?

Lmao, that comment says a lot more about you than me.

You are just constantly repeating yourself without even addressing my argument. Pretty shit ngl. Are you gona explain how can someone defend from an attack to such degree that she's not even blow off her feet but at the same time gets seriously injured? Sounds f-ucking contradictory to me.

I'm starting to think your mind has missing panels by the jumps of logic you make. Anyhow, as I already said, and as you already ignored (as you seem to be doing with most of my arguments), Shaak was already hit by the attack before she could've even raise her hands.

I even highlighted it for your convenience.

Right, you are oh so not upset that you are spending several posts to detail just how salty I presumably am. Is that suppose to be an argument against my points or a defensive mechanism? From my experience it's always the latter.

And yeah unlike Joker I'm constantly whiteknighting Shaak every day in every thread...Oh wait, I f-ucking don't. Your salty comments by the virtue of being a desperate strategy shit tier debaters use, which I thought you are not, is quite pathetic and it also horribly inaccurate.

Or he knew he could attack Shaak who lowered her defenses and still free himself. Anyhow either way it's speculative.

Yes but it never actually gave her an edge. In the comic she almost won the fight with the Saarlac, but it ended up being her demise. In the novel Shaak only controls the Saarlac once, which was pretty much useless:

"The apprentice cut off teeth and threw the fragments at his adversary's head. In return she took tighter control of the beast's distributed intelligence and sent its food-seeking tentacles flailing for him. He repulsed them and fought on."

I guess, but for a Soresu master that's a minor setback.

Yeah, which begin and end with the Saarlac which I detailed above just how useless it ended up to be. Because Galen was too powerful to be contained by it. [/B]

QTE's are depictions of events that occurs after the opponents have fought for a while. They're reference points for major shifts in the fight.

Sounds like you're trying to redirect.

Given you refuse to even read or address my posts I'd say you're not the most qualified person to judge such a thing. Just a thought.

You mean kind of like how Revan's barrier was torn through by Vitiate and his melted flesh fused with his mask yet he wasn't thrown back? Lmao.

Nice cut of that image where it shows Shaak facing the blast with raised hands. Holy shit. You must be the biggest ****ing hypocrite on the planet. How do you even have the gall to accuse others of ignoring context?

And what's that highlighted portion supposed to be? Shaak Ti? The reaching you're doing would impress Sonny Liston. But to entertain this notion for moment if that was Shaak Ti what's that raised mass attached to the left side of her body which is coincidentally facing the blast? Christ Zoltan, your debating really is as shit as your trolling.

I imagine he's asking you to take a breath and try to calm down for your own sake. You seem like you're about to have an aneurysm tbh.

Given our stance is backed up by the fact that he was being killed by the sarlaac something Shaak herself could sense and your stance is backed up by nothing at all I think anybody reading the debate knows which stance is speculative and which isn't.

That's not saying Shaak only used the beast once. It was saying that she used the beast during that segment of the fight and whenever it attacked Galen he repulsed it and continued to fight her.

He's also being attacked by Shaak simultaneously and that's the point.

If the comic notes that the flora and fauna is being used against Galen in one panel then later uses the sarlaac against him in another then no, that's now what the sentence is referencing. You seem to be a fan of assuming one thing means another simply because it wasn't shown.

Dear Syn,

Is it that hard to at least, try to format your post in a way that slightly resembles Forum normality?

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Dear Syn,

Is it that hard to at least, [b]try to format your post in a way that slightly resembles Forum normality? [/B]

I'd do it for Skillz or someone I respect ( maybe even you ) but none of these people fit such a criteria.

I'm just going to give Emp a break since he's been going non stop. If they choose to respond to it then great. If not then I'll accept their concession with grace. 🙂