Loki vs Obi-wan Kenobi

Originally posted by Robtard
"Greater durability" doesn't mean "can't be hit", you don't even debate.

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre. Go on, prove it.

IM took a hit from the hammer before the lightning amp. Ignoring the obvious power amp =/= durability. You don't even Marvel either 😂

Prove it. Greater energy output equals greater damage.

I don't have to disprove your claim you need to prove it. Onus is on you, midget.

The power amp obviously affected his entire suit. Now prove the intensity of the lightsaber is greater than that heat you referenced. Prove something.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You said prove he can survive. I just did. Now prove he can hit him at that point.

Prove it. Greater energy output equals greater damage.

I don't have to disprove your claim you need to prove it. Onus is on you, midget.

The power amp obviously affected his entire suit. Now prove the intensity of the lightsaber is greater than that heat you referenced. Prove something.

You have yet to prove that Loki could withstand a lightsabre

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre. Go on, prove it.

Blunt force trauma =/= intensive heat

You claimed IM only took a hammer hit after he was amped, you were wrong and I laughed. You don't even Marvel.

Originally posted by Robtard
You have yet to prove that Loki could withstand a lightsabre

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre. Go on, prove it.

Blunt force trauma =/= intensive heat

You claimed IM only took a hammer hit after he was amped, you were wrong and I laughed. You don't even Marvel.

Post definitive proof why this damage you call different would kill Loki. Who has it killed of lokis durability feats ?

Prove how hot. You made another claim you don't prove. You're about to go rage loop to cover up your incompetence as a debater.

You listed an irrelevant comparison. You thought IM took hammer hits only after he was amped because you don't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Originally posted by Robtard
You listed an irrelevant comparison. You thought IM took hammer hits only after he was amped because you don't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Prove it. Quit repeating yourself like a mindless fool and actually prove it.

Originally posted by quanchi112
IronMan's suit is durable. My point was in reference to a prolonged fight with Thor. Loki has survived hammer shots. Loki is more durable than ironman.

Prove it. Quit repeating yourself like a mindless fool and actually prove it.

No, you clearly thought that IM took hits from the hammer only after he was amped. You don't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

"irony"

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Originally posted by Robtard
No, you clearly thought that IM took hits from the hammer only after he was amped. You don't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

"irony"

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Prove it. Prove by feats the saber kills him. Onus is on you since I listed feats of greater power output.

Originally posted by quanchi112

You'd need to prove lightsaber a are hotter than the extreme heat used.

shouldn't be too difficult,

IM was hit with lightning. No melt.

Vastly Upgraded suit was melted by Extremis soldiers, extremis soldiers explosion was clocked at , I can't remember exactly but it was stated in the movie, maybe 3000c.

So 3000c to melt ironmans suit.

now we speculate on the blast doors on a space craft whenre qui-gon melted throught the blast doors. An educated guess would say the Blast doors (being a space travel vehicle) would be of some super, durable steel+, heat shielded type material. What is steels molten temp?

lets math!

also as for the 'durability' question, would you say Thor is = Loki in durability? Because didn't Thor take a regular old dagger in the side?

Originally posted by quanchi112
No, but iron man is always worn down and comes apart. He needed special armor to withstand a barrage from the hulk. He tore through the special armor but did hulk did Loki apart ? Nah. Loki is more durable than ironman.

Prove it. Prove by feats the saber kills him. Onus is on you since I listed feats of greater power output.

IM was fresh when he first got slammed with Mjolnir. So your point is still invalid and you don't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Originally posted by Juk3n
shouldn't be too difficult,

IM was hit with lightning. No melt.

Vastly Upgraded suit was melted by Extremis soldiers, extremis soldiers explosion was clocked at , I can't remember exactly but it was stated in the movie, maybe 3000c.

So 3000c to melt ironmans suit.

now we speculate on the blast doors on a space craft whenre qui-gon melted throught the blast doors. An educated guess would say the Blast doors (being a space travel vehicle) would be of some super, durable steel+, heat shielded type material. What is steels molten temp?

lets math!

also as for the 'durability' question, would you say Thor is = Loki in durability? Because didn't Thor take a regular old dagger in the side?

I'd say around the same tier.

Originally posted by Robtard
IM was fresh when he first got slammed with Mjolnir. So your point is still invalid and you don't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Prove it.

Keep doing flips for me, the guy who doesn't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Originally posted by Robtard
Keep doing flips for me, the guy who doesn't even Marvel, not even a little bit.

Repeat: Not all damage is the same. Blunt force trauma from a hammer isn't the same as intensive heat. You need to prove Loki could survive a lightsabre due to his "durability". Go on, prove it.

Prove it is greater due to feats. You made the claim.

Originally posted by quanchi112

I'd say around the same tier.

So you agree that all damage types are not equal.

Thor took punches in the face from ironman, and a 400% repulsor blast with no effect. Good durability.

Got stuck with a dagger in the side, with little force from Loki.
Bad durability.

Ironman, took Lightning (which has the temperature of?) with no ill effect. Good durability.

Melted by 3000c extremis soldiers, not so good durability.

all damage is not the same.

And judging by what we've seen of lightsabres, why don't you play devils advocate and speculate on the temp?

Originally posted by Juk3n
So you agree that all damage types are not equal.

Thor took punches in the face from ironman, and a 400% repulsor blast with no effect. Good durability.

Got stuck with a dagger in the side, with little force from Loki.
Bad durability.

Ironman, took Lightning (which has the temperature of?) with no ill effect. Good durability.

Melted by 3000c extremis soldiers, not so good durability.

all damage is not the same.

And judging by what we've seen of lightsabres, why don't you play devils advocate and speculate on the temp?

I believe the dagger was magical in nature hence powerful.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why didn't he rag doll Jango with his force powers ? Or was he getting beaten up by a vastly weaker character than Steve.

None of those characters possess Thor's skill or power. Maul also showed pre viszla was able to give him a very close battle despite the lack of force powers. Why didn't he rag doll him ?

Because he was handling him anyway. You keep saying Jango was beating him up, yet it was Jango, who still had his equipment AND a space ship, who fled from an unarmed and holding back Kenobi. Not to mention that Obi-Wan managed to trail him to the CIS base anyway.

Yeah, keyword here is power. Thor's skill alone is unremarkable. Maul is a warrior first and foremost, he rarely resorts to using his powers unless he has to, he's not Sidious.

Originally posted by Psychotron
Because he was handling him anyway. You keep saying Jango was beating him up, yet it was Jango, who still had his equipment AND a space ship, who fled from an unarmed and holding back Kenobi. Not to mention that Obi-Wan managed to trail him to the CIS base anyway.

Yeah, keyword here is power. Thor's skill alone is unremarkable. Maul is a warrior first and foremost, he rarely resorts to using his powers unless he has to, he's not Sidious.

Kenobi was armed and disarmed. Obi failed. Jango fled despite his force powers.

Thor's skill is amazing. You may not be surprised by it but it's there. You keep saying to avoid the evidence. They all use their powers at the most opportune moments. Maui uses them when he feels the tactic will be most effective like any Sith Lord.

Originally posted by quanchi112

Thor's skill is amazing.

Your idea of amazing skill and, it seems, everyone else's is way skewed dude.

When I look at the Marvel CU line up of characters there's a clear and distinct tier on things like power output, durability, skill etc and no one person i master in all things.

On the 'Amazing Skill' side, id put Cap, Winter Soldier to a lesser degree, Black Widow and to a lesser degree Barton. Being "amazingly skillful" physically, means being able to pull off feats of martial prowess other people cannot perform.

Hulk, not skilful.
Thor, more skilful than hulk, but still an out and out brawler just with variety.
Vision, powerful as Phuck, but I woudnt classify him as 'amazingly skilled'.

Every single mainstream jedi is legitimately amazingly skilled to varying degrees of 'amazing' with a ground burst speed of about 100m per second (as demonstrated in the first scene of TPM). Whats another example I can use..lets see, John Mclane (die hard) Durable, Toughness, Endurance, with a little cunning. "Amazingly skilled"? No. That title would be reserved for someone like Jason Bourne.

If Caps shield was made out of 'SABRE energy instead of vibranium, Avengers Assemble would have been about 30 minutes long.

Weve seen Black Widow take a Backhand from Hulk into steel that should have liquefied her organs or atleast rupture something important. Yet she is not bullet or knife proof. All durability is not equal, even on the same person. Ive seen nothing of Loki to suggest his skin or armor is withstanding a lightsabre.

He can win here. I just don't think he does.

Originally posted by Juk3n
Your idea of amazing skill and, it seems, everyone else's is way skewed dude.

When I look at the Marvel CU line up of characters there's a clear and distinct tier on things like power output, durability, skill etc and no one person i master in all things.

On the 'Amazing Skill' side, id put Cap, Winter Soldier to a lesser degree, Black Widow and to a lesser degree Barton. Being "amazingly skillful" physically, means being able to pull off feats of martial prowess other people cannot perform.

Hulk, not skilful.
Thor, more skilful than hulk, but still an out and out brawler just with variety.
Vision, powerful as Phuck, but I woudnt classify him as 'amazingly skilled'.

Every single mainstream jedi is legitimately amazingly skilled to varying degrees of 'amazing' with a ground burst speed of about 100m per second (as demonstrated in the first scene of TPM). Whats another example I can use..lets see, John Mclane (die hard) Durable, Toughness, Endurance, with a little cunning. "Amazingly skilled"? No. That title would be reserved for someone like Jason Bourne.

If Caps shield was made out of 'SABRE energy instead of vibranium, Avengers Assemble would have been about 30 minutes long.

Weve seen Black Widow take a Backhand from Hulk into steel that should have liquefied her organs or atleast rupture something important. Yet she is not bullet or knife proof. All durability is not equal, even on the same person. Ive seen nothing of Loki to suggest his skin or armor is withstanding a lightsabre.

He can win here. I just don't think he does.

Jedi are skilled in their own ways but bounty hunters and other skilled opponents minus their skill sets have been a threat and better than Jedi. Defeating shield agents minus your powers shows amazing skill to me and effectiveness.

Fiction is not consistent but greater power feats mean something. Loki has survived greater and a lightsaber has failed to cut through less. I don't think Obi has a chance if Jango Fett can be a threat to him. Honestly.

Originally posted by Juk3n
Your idea of amazing skill and, it seems, everyone else's is way skewed dude.

When I look at the Marvel CU line up of characters there's a clear and distinct tier on things like power output, durability, skill etc and no one person i master in all things.

On the 'Amazing Skill' side, id put Cap, Winter Soldier to a lesser degree, Black Widow and to a lesser degree Barton. Being "amazingly skillful" physically, means being able to pull off feats of martial prowess other people cannot perform.

Hulk, not skilful.
Thor, more skilful than hulk, but still an out and out brawler just with variety.
Vision, powerful as Phuck, but I woudnt classify him as 'amazingly skilled'.

Every single mainstream jedi is legitimately amazingly skilled to varying degrees of 'amazing' with a ground burst speed of about 100m per second (as demonstrated in the first scene of TPM). Whats another example I can use..lets see, John Mclane (die hard) Durable, Toughness, Endurance, with a little cunning. "Amazingly skilled"? No. That title would be reserved for someone like Jason Bourne.

If Caps shield was made out of 'SABRE energy instead of vibranium, Avengers Assemble would have been about 30 minutes long.

Weve seen Black Widow take a Backhand from Hulk into steel that should have liquefied her organs or atleast rupture something important. Yet she is not bullet or knife proof. All durability is not equal, even on the same person. Ive seen nothing of Loki to suggest his skin or armor is withstanding a lightsabre.

He can win here. I just don't think he does.

I'd have to disagree with Thor being simply a brawler. Though I won't consider him as skilled as Cap, you can see his skill in majority of his fights. Like when he took out "skilled" SHIELD agents, or frost giant brawlers, or even the way he ducks and dodges shots from IM and Hulk and the ultron-thralls.

Considering what we've seen him do, it's not a stretch to think he should at least be as skilled as Barton.