Originally posted by Nai
What lightsaber accomplishments exactly?I don't see many "lightsaber based" feats for Sidious.
His fight against Maul and Savage is certainly impressive. Yet, he defeats them with pretty much force powers only, instead of outduelling hin. Sure. He was capable of holding his own against the duo, but so was Obi-Wan Kenobi.
Didn't Mr. Filoni, the new head of canon, state that Sidious was toying with the duo?
Disregard that if you like, there's a reason many are still debating whether or not Sidious was toying with them. Still, you can't deny that it would be rather easy for Sheev to take on Maul when Sidious knows his combat style and form in and out.
When he manages to defeat the three masters coming to arrest him, he probably hindered them through the force, disabling their defense. In the RotS novel, he outright distracts them before starting a concealed attack,
He only took advantage of Saesee Tiin's attempt to read his mind then began his attack afterwards, although i'm not entirely sure if i'm correct.
in the movie, they don't move at all, despite Sidious making a comment after igniting his lightsaber, which kind of overwrites that idea that he "blitzed" them.
Couldn't that be because he was too fast for the Masters?
Then he fights Mace, and is disarmed. "Wins" through the intervention of Anakin. And it's made pretty obvious, that he couldn't overcome the swordplay of Windu before. Now you may want to consider, that Mace, quite clearly, is no match for Sidious in terms of force abilities. He just manages to overcome the Sith Lord with pure fighting skill and a unique ability (Shatterpoint), but even his skill alone was enough to reach a stalemate with the Sith Lord.
First off, i want to state that i have yet to reach a conclusion of what I think happened or didn't happen in that fight. So i can't agree or disagree.
That said, you're forgetting that Mace Windu's mastery of Vaapad would grant Mace a significant edge.
Now imagine what would happen if somebody closer to Sidious in terms of power and with a better lightsaber skill faces the Sith Lord.
Except that, Kun isn't that powerful when compared to Sidious nor is he on the same level as Yoda. I have not seen something that shows me that Exar is on par with Yoda.
Or stop imagining this, because we know what happend from his fight with Yoda. Despite constantly fighting from a position of advantage, Sidious - if we can trust the RotS script - is disarmed by the Jedi Master in less than a minute. And if that is the case, Yoda is head and shoulders above Sidious when it comes to lightsaber fights.
But, isn't that debatable? after all Sidious has many quotes calling him a masterful user of the blade, I've seen a user provide the quote, but i don't seem to remember which thread they posted the quote in.
Then you need to consider the fact, that Sidious did never focus on "direct combat". He's the epitome of cunning, stealth and manipulation, but clearly not the type of character that seeks direct combat. Instead, he tries to avoid it whenever he can. Unlike Kun, who is shown to focus on nothing but superiority in combat through the entirety of his career, starting with his sparing fight against Vodo, continueing in his duel with Ulic and ending with the defeat of his master in a lightsaber duel.
Perhaps, Sidious' main focus is not in direct combat, but he's not one to shy away from it either, as i stated before, Sidious and Yoda are among the top duelists of their respective eras.
The argument can be made for Kun that he, too, is the top "dog" of his era. But, i counter with this.
"What other notable duelists lived at that time?"
So one might ask, who is better suited for a lightsaber duel. The guy who focused on the discipline, even going so far, that he came up with a unique weapon and a unique fighting style to use it or the guy that saw direct combat as a matter of last resort? If Sidious has to deal with an opponent that he doesn't eclipse in terms of force powers, I don't see him winning a lightsaber duel, since he relies so much on the force instead of just "technique" - and I'm rather certain, that Exar Kun is more in a league with Sidious than Mace Windu was, when it comes to force powers - while probably having a similar talent for bladework in comparison to Mace (a view that can be questioned of course).
That's a good point, however i feel that you seem to forget that Sidious trained Maul in the saber-staff style and in several forms of combat, to the point where Maul became the most highly trained & skilled sith in history, meaning that Sidious' focus on combat isn't as ..."lax"? as you presume.
But, in all honesty, you do make a lot of good points, Nai. 👆