Iranian Agreement goes through

Originally posted by jaden101
I don't really think I can give a starker example of how things change than America only a fear years ago condemning Hezbollah as a terrorist organisation and now working with them.

I'll give you some examples of how the political change in Iran is an inevitability
http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/06/the-iran-we-dont-see-a-tour-of-the-country-where-people-love-americans/258166/
http://www.vox.com/2015/7/12/8933915/iran-middle-east

That second article brings an interesting point in that Iran is unlike any other nation in that most arab countries have regimes that are pro western and populations that are anti western and Iran has traditionally had the opposite. A pro western population and an anti western leadership. Seems they are well on the path to having both being pro western. It also makes a point about the Quds day traditions.

I'd post more but it's nearly 5am here.

Ill respond tomorrow so you can go to sleep.

Originally posted by psmith81992
Since Israel is our biggest ally in the middle east?

and allies have geopolitical interests

but so do we

when i read netanyahu's letter... what it sounded like he was really saying to me, if you read between the lines is: "hey, if you ease the sanctions on iran to stop them from getting a nuke, iran is going to benefit economically. which is a security risk for us"

well, sorry israel, but iran developing a nuclear weapon is a security risk for you and us as well, and you don't dictate our foreign policy decisions. because tbh the israelis won't be content with anything other than us launching a war with iran on their behalf. and frankly a lot of us have no interest in fighting israel's wars for them. if they want to topple the regime so bad then let them do it themselves.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/14/world/middleeast/iran-nuclear-deal-who-got-what-they-wanted.html

Pretty good analysis of the give and take in the deal's negotiation.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
What is awesome is Bibi said he is not honoring this deal.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/14/world/middleeast/iran-nuclear-deal-who-got-what-they-wanted.html

Pretty good analysis of the give and take in the deal's negotiation.

Yup they got everything they wanted.

Total bullshit.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/14/world/middleeast/iran-nuclear-deal-who-got-what-they-wanted.html

Pretty good analysis of the give and take in the deal's negotiation.

but Iran has 24 days to comply with a request

😂

Oh somehow they will try and convince us that 24 days is a good thing.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Russia never was willing to strap bombs to their chest for Jihad.

Silly comparison considered how many people died in the Soviet Union to advance the Communist agenda.

Originally posted by Bentley
Silly comparison considered how many people died in the Soviet Union to advance the Communist agenda.

Im sure all the people they killed who opposed them thought the same thing.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Im sure all the people they killed who opposed them thought the same thing.

So we agree? Good.

Originally posted by Bentley
So we agree? Good.

You agree with my sarcasm, good good, I have taught you well frenchy.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
You agree with my sarcasm, good good, I have taught you well frenchy.

Proves you can be right at times 😈

😂

So you think this "deal" is good or bad?

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
😂

So you think this "deal" is good or bad?

It's good for Iran and it has the virtue of being based in cooperation instead of punishment. Other than that, I have little expectations from it.

Here's the thing: The deal does what people have been wanting from Iran from decades- an agreement not to make nuclear weapons.

It also has checks to ensure that's happening, and an immediate reduction in capacity which makes it significantly more work to get to nukes even aside from checks. It's not just talk and watching, it's actual demonstrated action in the proper direction.

And yet, now that it's actually happening, people are having sour grapes about it when, in large part, if it'd happened under someone else's watch, it'd be trumped to high heavens about having stopped Iran's 'nuclear ambitions'.

Note that Iran has never shown signs of wanting nukes *that* much, but wanted the option on the table for discouragement, and wanted their civilian nuclear program which lets them use their oil for sale rather than self-use, and makes them more resistant to Saudi Arabia meddling with prices (one of the things about oil is you can hurt an oil producing country by flooding the market).

Now they feel with this deal, they're reasonably safe without nukes, and now *we*- and our allies- don't have to worry about them having nukes.

Not only is it something of a win-win, it's exactly what people like George W. Bush wanted during his term.

Will it solve all problems with Iran? Of course not. But it's a deal that, due to being backed by a bunch of major world powers and with a rapid snap-back of sanctions should they reneg, that they're unlikely to break, and that could lay groundwork to future deals.

The endgame here is to hopefully shift them from 'hostile enemy' to 'wary neutral,' which would solve a lot of problems.

Originally posted by psmith81992
24 days? Wtf

24 days unless there's a vote by the council at which point it drops to 3 days.

This was in the prior article I linked to you.

3 days, shit, how are they even going to get there logistically in that short a time...

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Yup they got everything they wanted.

Total bullshit.

Iran gave up a lot more than we expected them to. It's not a perfect deal, but it's intellectually dishonest to say this was the Iranian coup that some people were predicting it would be. The only really troublesome part of the deal is how much time Iran has to prepare for an inspection, but this is much better than what the Iranians actually wanted: which was a total prohibition of ANY inspections of military facilities at any time.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
You either didn't read or read with the aim of confirming what you already wanted to believe rather than what was on the page.

Iran gave up a lot more than we expected them to. It's not a perfect deal, but it's intellectually dishonest to say this was the Iranian coup that some people were predicting it would be. The only really troublesome part of the deal is how much time Iran has to prepare for an inspection, but this is much better than what the Iranians actually wanted: which was a total prohibition of ANY inspections of military facilities at any time.

I read it, and it gave them everything they need/want.

Show me any concession. There are no snap inspections, there will be a Iranian sitting on the inspection council and it can take 24 days to inspect. Almost a month time is plenty to hide/move things to a new facility.

Speaking of Russia, anyone hear the BS they pulled in regards to trying to find out about that shot down plane? They aren't cool with a tribunal finding out if Russia did it, it would be "untimely" and "counterproductive".