Valkorion vs Darth Plagueis & Darth Sidious

Originally posted by Nephthys
I meant in lightsaber combat. Venamis was a better duelist than him yet Plagueis still managed to beat him because he's just that good.

That's fair, but still incomparable to even Arcann imho.

Edit: I shouldn't say incomparable, as that would imply vastly inferior. I more or less meant that such a feat is, at its highest worth, Arcann level. Which even that I still doubt, though not by vast disparity.

Originally posted by Nephthys
What if Plagueis used it to kill him though? It's not like Vitiate has a response to that.

Is there any proof that Plagueis can comfortably pull that shit with Valkorion raining on him?

Originally posted by Nephthys
I'm not saying that Plaguies' force feats are as good as Vitiates, just that I can see a plausible scenario for him winning. Plagueis attacks Vitiate with his saber. Sure, Vitiate can block it, but with Plagueis' monster-strength and speed it wouldn't exactly be easy. And unlike Arcann, Plagueis isn't gonna get pimp-slapped. With his comparable level of power, Valkorion would need a lengthy force battle to batter Plagueis into submission, all which the latter is battering him into submission as well. Eventually Plagueis just tanks and spanks him.

If Plagueis is in your top 3 or 5 then I don't see why you think theres such a gap between them that Plagueis gets owned. That's ****in' retarded bro.

You're misunderstanding my argument. In terms of feats, Plagueis isn't necessarily much better than Arcann, much less Vitiate. I give Plagueis his benefit of the doubt because of his implied power and standing in the Banite Line. But in terms of feats, There's no way in hell Plagueis is closing in on Valkorion.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
That's fair, but still incomparable to even Arcann imho.

That's your opinion.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Is there any proof that Plagueis can comfortably pull that shit with Valkorion raining on him?

Frankly, I don't know and I don't care. It's not as if it suits me to try to prove that. I'd rather it wasn't. However, it's a plausible argument someone could make.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
You're misunderstanding my argument. [B]In terms of feats, Plagueis isn't necessarily much better than Arcann, much less Vitiate. I give Plagueis his benefit of the doubt because of his implied power and standing in the Banite Line. But in terms of feats, There's no way in hell Plagueis is closing in on Valkorion. [/B]

"Well, I disagree."

I don't care if you think Vitiate has better feats or not. He can still lose. All that you asked me was if I think, based on showings, Plagueis beating Valkorion isn't retarded. I just gave you a plausible scenario, as well as the midichlorian argument. Based on showings, it can be argued that Plagueis has the tools to beat him.

Plagueis's physicals are ****ing nuts too.

He can punch through a solid door of Transparisteel, punch through armored torsos, and can fight through failing hearts.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Frankly, I don't know and I don't care. It's not as if it suits me to try to prove that. I'd rather it wasn't. However, it's a plausible argument someone could make.

Arguments being plausible doesn't necessitate them not being "retarded." Someone can argue Luke oneshots Sidious and Valkorion combined via fold space. It's a plausible argument that has evidence and precedent, but practically speaking it's pretty "retarded." Speaking of which, to make such an argument that Plagueis's MM can plausibly defeat Valkorion, one would need plausible evidence for such. So you saying the argument is plausible despite admitting to not have knowledge on the matter strikes me as

Originally posted by Nephthys
"Well, I disagree."

I don't care if you think Vitiate has better feats or not. He can still lose. All that you asked me was if I think, based on showings, Plagueis beating Valkorion isn't retarded. I just gave you a plausible scenario, as well as the midichlorian argument. Based on showings, it can be argued that Plagueis has the tools to beat him.

As I mentioned earlier, an argument being theoretically plausible doesn't make it not "retarded" (In the context of how the term is being used.) Based on showings, Plagueis has legitimately not shown anything that I can imagine would lead someone to believe he cuts down Valkorion. A lot of this is due to circumstance, but in reality his feat against the strike team, Ziost, Arcann, and Arcann again convincingly beat out Plagueis's feats against Venamis and the Maladians.

Though, realistically, opting to quarrel was pretty foolish on my part, given that Plagueis beating Valkorion being retarded solely depends on how McP believes Plagueis beats Valkorion. I just don't really see any good, or, not "retarded" avenues, as far as raw feats are concerned. Add in implications and what not, then yeah, the argument can and has been made.

@ Skillz,

F*** Nai, you're my new hero tbh

This ain't no place for an hero 🙂

Even Neph's betrayal will not halt what must be done.

won't halt. *

My phone is stupid, but yeah. Valkorion and his brood have risen above us mere mortals.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Even Neph's betrayal will not halt what must be done.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Even Neph's betrayal will not halt what must be done.

The team eats him for lunch. Palpatine at this point was already an absolute monster - and according to Luceno - Plagueis is above TPM Palpatine, before his death at least.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
*won't stop (assuming you're going with the Revan quote)

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
The team eats him for lunch. Palpatine at this point was already an absolute monster - and according to Luceno - Plagueis is above TPM Palpatine, before his death at least.

Tanking Valkorion powers is not an easy thing. Valkorion wrecked Revan in a span of 2 seconds(?) when he became serious; bombardment was so intense that Revan's body reaching boiling-point and pain was astounding. Now keep in mind that Revan is a Yoda-tier Force-user and his defensive abilities are among the best we have seen yet.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Even Neph's betrayal will not halt what must be done.

There is no betrayal. I indicated at the start that I personally lean Valkorion. I'm just not saying it's impossible for Plagueis to win, or for someone to believe so with good cause.

^
For those TOR fanboys any person who will disagree that Vitiate can stomp anybody, will be a traitor.

Valkorion is a planet buster and lightsabers are like glowsticks to him and he can beat Jordan 1 on 1 in a game of pickup and teach Hawking about physics.

What's so impressive about him blocking lightsaber strikes with barrier?

That's just his Hierro tbh.

Originally posted by carthage
What's so impressive about him blocking lightsaber strikes with barrier?