Most people care about the speed at which he does it and the consistency
Originally posted by Trocity
Valkorion is a planet buster and lightsabers are like glowsticks to him and he can beat Jordan 1 on 1 in a game of pickup and teach Hawking about physics.
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Arguments being plausible doesn't necessitate them not being "retarded."
Using "retarded" as a perogative is always tasteless, no matter the terms, though.
Someone can argue Luke oneshots Sidious and Valkorion combined via fold space. It's a plausible argument that has evidence and precedent, but practically speaking it's pretty "retarded."
The word that you couldn't find in your limited dictionary was "unlikely".
Speaking of which, to make such an argument that Plagueis's MM can plausibly defeat Valkorion, one would need plausible evidence for such. So you saying the argument is plausible despite admitting to not have knowledge on the matter strikes me as
We are operating in a fictional realm, comparing opposing forces attacking eachother with attacks fueld by an mystical energy field and you talk about probability? 😉
We have absolutely no idea what Plagueis in the post balance shift state could do in a one on one confrontation, since we don't see him in such circumstances. But now imagine the force wave he used, while injured, to "almost atomize" armed combatants, focused on a single target while in top shape. And I may add: He himself at least believes, that he is more powerful than any Sith before him, while having knowledge about the Sith Emperor. So if we trust his own judgement, he is more powerful than Vitiate pre defeat by the HoT, which is already quite impressive.
As I mentioned earlier, an argument being theoretically plausible doesn't make it not "retarded" (In the context of how the term is being used.) Based on showings, Plagueis has legitimately not shown anything that I can imagine would lead someone to believe he cuts down Valkorion. A lot of this is due to circumstance, but in reality his feat against the strike team, Ziost, Arcann, and Arcann again convincingly beat out Plagueis's feats against Venamis and the Maladians.
While I don't necessarily disagree with your judgement, that doesn't make Neph's argument "retarded". Furthermore: If Plagueis is more powerful than "basic" Vitiate, this could be a hell of a fight.
Though, realistically, opting to quarrel was pretty foolish on my part, given that Plagueis beating Valkorion being retarded solely depends on how McP believes Plagueis beats Valkorion. I just don't really see any good, or, not "retarded" avenues, as far as raw feats are concerned. Add in implications and what not, then yeah, the argument can and has been made.
The aforementioned channeling of raw power against the Maladians directed towards a single target could do quite some damage. And if Plagueis would try to take down Valkorian with his lightsaber, his sheer brute force coupled with his speed may not proof too much for the Eternal Emperor - but it would perhabs be more of a challenge than Arcann's assault against his father.
Originally posted by Nai
Using "retarded" as a perogative is always tasteless, no matter the terms, though.The word that you couldn't find in your limited dictionary was "unlikely".
I was merely making reference to Sinious's term, hence the quotations surrounding the word. Your insult to my vocabulary was extremely and unnecessarily cruel tho
Originally posted by Nai
We are operating in a fictional realm, comparing opposing forces attacking eachother with attacks fueld by an mystical energy field and you talk about probability? 😉We have absolutely no idea what Plagueis in the post balance shift state could do in a one on one confrontation, since we don't see him in such circumstances. But now imagine the force wave he used, while injured, to "almost atomize" armed combatants, focused on a single target while in top shape. And I may add: He himself at least believes, that he is more powerful than any Sith before him, while having knowledge about the Sith Emperor. So if we trust his own judgement, he is more powerful than Vitiate pre defeat by the HoT, which is already quite impressive.
Well, I'm arguing in the context of feats only, aka what they have specifically shown, not what they're implied to be capable of doing. While I personally believe the feats-only paradigm is flawed, I was asking how, in terms of feats, Plagueis stacks up to the Immortal Emperor. And while his raw power showing against the Maladians was indeed incredible, The Immortal Emperor has honestly shown, in terms of feats, much greater ability in all areas other than telekinesis.
Originally posted by Nai
While I don't necessarily disagree with your judgement, that doesn't make Neph's argument "retarded". Furthermore: If Plagueis is more powerful than "basic" Vitiate, this could be a hell of a fight.The aforementioned channeling of raw power against the Maladians directed towards a single target could do quite some damage. And if Plagueis would try to take down Valkorian with his lightsaber, his sheer brute force coupled with his speed may not proof too much for the Eternal Emperor - but it would perhabs be more of a challenge than Arcann's assault against his father.
In the very part you quoted, I stated opting to quarrel was pretty "retarded" of me, given that McP's argument being "retarded" depends on how he presents it. I'm not arguing that Plagueis wouldn't realistically provide more of a challenge than Arcann, rather that if we literally take Plagueis's feats at face value and measure him using only those, that he falls decisively short to the Immortal Emperor overall. Then I went on to say that using Plagueis's implications of his capabilities, then yes, the argument that he can fight the Immortal Emperor excellently can and has been made.
Spoiler:
Like you, I'm playing Lucifer's Butt-Buddy. I've got Plagueis in my top 3-5 sith. It's just that I find the ways that I've seen others vouch for him to be pretty amusing.