Originally posted by Darth ThorMmm, I think it would have been cooler if Kylo was at full strength, and to have gotten a Dooku vs Anakin & Kenobi sort of scene.
Whatever.. Toying or not. It was a bad duel either way, because it was clearly forced into the movie just for the sake of having a duel.I would have preferred more natural and less PIS induced duels like the Finn vs Stormtrooper one.
A moment of focus from Rey + the destruction of Starkiller base bailing them out.
That said, I did enjoy the dynamic of the fight in the respect that it set Kylo and Rey up as rivals, and both in need of further training. So maybe I'm cool with it.
Originally posted by Rebel95
My interpretation of the fight was that Kylo was toying with Finn at first, and started taking it seriously after being struck. His performance against Rey was embarrassing considering she had never used a lightsaber before. Maybe that's just a sign of Rey's power rather than Kylo's weakness? Hard to know for sure. Plus he was injured.
“I perceive the problem,” Snoke intoned. “It isn’t her strength that is making you fail. It’s your weakness .” The rebuke hurt, but Ren didn’t show it. “Where is the droid?”
This was what Snoke said when he failed to interrogate her. So the same could likely be applied to their duel.
Originally posted by Lord StarkWe see after this that
“I perceive the problem,” Snoke intoned. “It isn’t her strength that is making you fail. It’s your weakness .” The rebuke hurt, but Ren didn’t show it. “Where is the droid?”This was what Snoke said when he failed to interrogate her. So the same could likely be applied to their duel.
Spoiler:
killed his own father. So when the time came he surpassed even Vader. It is also a possibility she has some training and we might find out about it with more of her backstory.
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZCircumstances were different. He felt Kenobi was the enemy and that he was turning his own wife against him. Kenobi also clearly states, I will do what I must. Indicating he will defend himself. Kylo's
Kenobi was a father figure to Vader tbh
Spoiler:
father was just there to take him home. He knew he didn't pose a threat to him whatsoever. Han didn't even attempt to defend himself after the impalement. He just touched his face. Kylo passed his test.
Originally posted by Lord StarkThat wasn't his biological father and he's the guy who maimed his body years back. You can act like its the same when it really isn't. Kenobi also implied his own death would benefit himself.
If you can't see the parallels between Vader's killing of Kenobi (who literally let his guard down and opened himself to decapitation) and Ren's killing of Han...well in the words of Obi-Wan.
Originally posted by Lord Stark
If you can't see the parallels between Vader's killing of Kenobi (who literally let his guard down and opened himself to decapitation) and Ren's killing of Han...
Yep. Han played the Old Ben role in this.
But the whole movie was ANH parallel. Don't see the point in anyone denying that.
Originally posted by quanchi112
That wasn't his biological father and he's the guy who maimed his body years back. You can act like its the same when it really isn't. Kenobi also implied his own death would benefit himself.
OBI-WAN
Why do I think you are going to be
the death of me?!
ANAKIN
Don't say that Master... You're
the closest thing I have to a
father... I love you. I don't want
to cause you pain.
PADME
Annie, are you just going to sit
here and let him die?? He's your
friend... your mentor...
ANAKIN
...He's like my father, but you
heard Master Windu. He gave me
strict orders to stay here.
Straight from the screenplay. We also have no idea what happened between Kylo and Han. If you were to have never watched the OT and started with the Prequels, Kenobi's death has a huge impact similar to that of Han's.
It does have a huge impact, but it's definitely different. When Kenobi dies, Vader already has an incredible amount of hatred towards him. There was always this sort of competitiveness between Anakin and Kenobi, even though their relationship was supposedly that of a father and a son.
Han simply feels completely abandoned by his biological son, he loves him and tries to redeem him. Kenobi fought Vader and knew he would be defeated, so he willingly became one with the Force. On the other hand,
Spoiler:
Han dies begging his son to come back to the light. It's a significantly different emotional scenario.
Sure, Han Solo is the Kenobi of the film but I feel the RotJ parallels are stronger, at least in terms of the character arcs. We have a father attempting to convert their son to the other side of the force. The son struggles with the other side of the force, but ultimately decides to do the "right" thing.
Originally posted by Col. Valerian
It does have a huge impact, but it's definitely different. When Kenobi dies, Vader already has an incredible amount of hatred towards him. There was always this sort of competitiveness between Anakin and Kenobi, even though their relationship was supposedly that of a father and a son.Han simply feels completely abandoned by his biological son, he loves him and tries to redeem him. Kenobi fought Vader and knew he would be defeated, so he willingly became one with the Force. On the other hand,
Spoiler:
Han dies begging his son to come back to the light. It's a significantly different emotional scenario.
I dunno, I disagree. I feel like Kenobi and Vader's second duel is so tragic because its really just an extension of their duel on Mustafar. We also don't know what happened between Han and Kylo.