Secret wars 2 Thing vs WBH

At the time he appeared to be relatively calm. But, let's recall that this version of the Hulk could amp in an instant instead of taking precious time to ramp up. This was a technique that he learned while he was on Sakaar. You see it on display during the HOTM arc, when he is in Vegas, and at the end of WW Hulk. I was also just using that as an example to show how much more powerful he had become when he was in the Dark Dimension with nothing holding him back from pouring it on. This was to show you that the version of the Thing that you are using would be a weakling in comparison to WB Hulk at the height of his power. I know that it's difficult to believe, but WB Hulk was well above the Herald level. One collision followed immediately with a punch is all that it took for Red She Hulk, and the Hulk to turn more than one planet into dust.

Originally posted by Rao Kal El
Let me put this easy for you

McDuffie says WW is overpowering for a few seconds Amazo with the power strength of Superman and herself staked.

Does it holds water? Or this is just an embellishment of the narration?

How is it possible that WW is overpowering herself and Superman's strength at the same time when she is just WW strong?

You have the premises now are you going to say that WW is stronger than WW and Superman stacked?

I don't think so and that happen in a comic and has the narration on it. One of the premises is wrong therefore to say that WW is stronger than WW and Superman together is the wrong logical conclusion.

Is just as simple as that. And like I said this whole gig of WBH is easily destroyed with all the contradictions Pak had in his own run.

But anyhow, that is all I am saying. We agree to disagree, the only way you could change my mind is if you can come up with an aceptable logical conclusion and I won't change your point of view with logical conclusions, so we agree to disagree on this matter.

Wonder Woman isn't stronger than herself and that's why Hulk can't withstand an attack 133 times Herc's max punch? What? You're talking about logical fallacies and you just tried to red herring me with a completely non comparable feat.

He didn't give it 133.5 Hulks. He gave it Hercs. He created a new character measured on a scale created almost specifically for that character. That was used for other things as well. He went out of his way to give it specific numbers. This wasn't a lapse in judgement, this was a calculated feat with thought process behind it. The only possible thing to point out is he forgot Herc hit him before, but that's easily explained by Hulk's dynamic strength, and a surprise attack.

Also turning into a rock isn't a great defense either. Your mind won't change, that's good. But just know that you are literally denying long explanations and lots of proof to come to your viewpoint. If Carver pulled the same shit on Superman you would have a meltdown. And I don't even like Hulk and I especially don't like Pak, but I can see an extreme problem with your stance here.
Pak's numbers aren't off. They can't be off. The character he created that was never used again was specifically at this level of power. She was a character created specifically to wank Hulk. Especially when backed by the measurement system created to wank Hulk. Especially by the character that was turned into a character to wank Hulk. Hell Pak even tried to up Cho's intelligence level to specifically wank Hulk. Pak didn't make a mistake, his only regret is not making it 233 hercs. If Pak had the chance he would have specifically had it overpower 120 Hercs throwing a punch at once. Because he wrote it to be stronger, because it was stronger.

And about the actual feat itself. It was a durability feat anyway. It wasn't a "Hulk is this much stronger than Herc" feat. It was a "Hulk can get his ass knocked out by this level of power" feat. And people getting knocked out by an attack that should kill them happens all the time. It's called not killing your main character but still taking them out. There's really no difference in comics anyway. If you can knock someone out, logically it wouldn't take more to kill them. Unless they had a healing factor like a giant real world logic green man.
Even if you don't accept my logic on the view of the feat, it's still a high feat. Of which happens all the time in comics. He did it. He got a better feat a couple issues later but he still did that one. It was written in a book, published, and sold to the general populance. Then pirates took it and scanned it so we could read it. Then we realized Pak did everything he could possible outside of it looking like 133.5 Hercs throwing a punch to make it believable. I'm willing to bet Carver could bring back 5 pages that reinforce the feat. A normal person 10.

I don't understand how this feat can even be disputed. It's not like he wrote some vague shit without explanations. He pulled down his pants and shit in your face while holding up two seperate signs that had a picture of him shitting in your face and one with words that said "There is fecalmatter being planted in your face from my rectum". There is no doubt as to what his intention is. There is no doubt he wrote it in a way that you have to accept it happened like this. Yet here you are saying "nope". And why the nope? Because a, and get this because this is hilarious, but you think a high feat is false because a low feat (iyo) goes against it. That's some Superman gas station shit right there. You're giving the Carve free reign to just go run amok in Superman threads with this. Which naturally you will say nothing about because you handed him the logic. As long as he repeats the mantra of "logic conclusions", he's untouchable.

Anyway, I probably won't care about this tomorrow, nor do I think this qualifies as a debate. More like an exercise in futility. Your platform would be a lot more respectable if you just started claiming "pis" though. 😬

Originally posted by Stoic
At the time he appeared to be relatively calm. But, let's recall that this version of the Hulk could amp in an instant instead of taking precious time to ramp up. This was a technique that he learned while he was on Sakaar. You see it on display during the HOTM arc, when he is in Vegas, and at the end of WW Hulk. I was also just using that as an example to show how much more powerful he had become when he was in the Dark Dimension with nothing holding him back from pouring it on. This was to show you that the version of the Thing that you are using would be a weakling in comparison to WB Hulk at the height of his power. I know that it's difficult to believe, but WB Hulk was well above the Herald level. One collision followed immediately with a punch is all that it took for Red She Hulk, and the Hulk to turn more than one planet into dust.

The shockwave was well above a couple hercs me thinks.

Originally posted by Stoic
At the time he appeared to be relatively calm. But, let's recall that this version of the Hulk could amp in an instant instead of taking precious time to ramp up. This was a technique that he learned while he was on Sakaar. You see it on display during the HOTM arc, when he is in Vegas, and at the end of WW Hulk. I was also just using that as an example to show how much more powerful he had become when he was in the Dark Dimension with nothing holding him back from pouring it on. This was to show you that the version of the Thing that you are using would be a weakling in comparison to WB Hulk at the height of his power. I know that it's difficult to believe, but WB Hulk was well above the Herald level. One collision followed immediately with a punch is all that it took for Red She Hulk, and the Hulk to turn more than one planet into dust.

Planet into "dust"? not really, talk about embelishment of a feat

And now it was a calm hulk and you assume he just ramp up to WBH levels with out displaying the green aura or did he display the green aura and this was WBH?

Easy green aura means critical mass for hulk no aura means no critical mass. 133.5 hercs with out a green aura means not a wbh that was more pissed than WWH?

It makes sense 👆

Originally posted by One Big Mob

Your platform would be a lot more respectable if you just started claiming "pis" though. 😬

It basically what it is but just using logical conclusions exercises to prove a point

Originally posted by One Big Mob
How do you figure that Wonder Woman overpowering herself times at least 2 is comparable to the literal numbers and system Pak created? And that's with just accepting your words.

Wonder Woman isn't stronger than herself and that's why Hulk can't withstand an attack 133 times Herc's max punch? What? You're talking about logical fallacies and you just tried to red herring me with a completely non comparable feat.

He didn't give it 133.5 Hulks. He gave it Hercs. He created a new character measured on a scale created almost specifically for that character. That was used for other things as well. He went out of his way to give it specific numbers. This wasn't a lapse in judgement, this was a calculated feat with thought process behind it. The only possible thing to point out is he forgot Herc hit him before, but that's easily explained by Hulk's dynamic strength, and a surprise attack.

Also turning into a rock isn't a great defense either. Your mind won't change, that's good. But just know that you are literally denying long explanations and lots of proof to come to your viewpoint. If Carver pulled the same shit on Superman you would have a meltdown. And I don't even like Hulk and I especially don't like Pak, but I can see an extreme problem with your stance here.
Pak's numbers aren't off. They can't be off. The character he created that was never used again was specifically at this level of power. She was a character created specifically to wank Hulk. Especially when backed by the measurement system created to wank Hulk. Especially by the character that was turned into a character to wank Hulk. Hell Pak even tried to up Cho's intelligence level to specifically wank Hulk. Pak didn't make a mistake, his only regret is not making it 233 hercs. If Pak had the chance he would have specifically had it overpower 120 Hercs throwing a punch at once. Because he wrote it to be stronger, because it was stronger.

And about the actual feat itself. It was a durability feat anyway. It wasn't a "Hulk is this much stronger than Herc" feat. It was a "Hulk can get his ass knocked out by this level of power" feat. And people getting knocked out by an attack that should kill them happens all the time. It's called not killing your main character but still taking them out. There's really no difference in comics anyway. If you can knock someone out, logically it wouldn't take more to kill them. Unless they had a healing factor like a giant real world logic green man.
Even if you don't accept my logic on the view of the feat, it's still a high feat. Of which happens all the time in comics. He did it. He got a better feat a couple issues later but he still did that one. It was written in a book, published, and sold to the general populance. Then pirates took it and scanned it so we could read it. Then we realized Pak did everything he could possible outside of it looking like 133.5 Hercs throwing a punch to make it believable. I'm willing to bet Carver could bring back 5 pages that reinforce the feat. A normal person 10.

I don't understand how this feat can even be disputed. It's not like he wrote some vague shit without explanations. He pulled down his pants and shit in your face while holding up two seperate signs that had a picture of him shitting in your face and one with words that said "There is fecalmatter being planted in your face from my rectum". There is no doubt as to what his intention is. There is no doubt he wrote it in a way that you have to accept it happened like this. Yet here you are saying "nope". And why the nope? Because a, and get this because this is hilarious, but you think a high feat is false because a low feat (iyo) goes against it. That's some Superman gas station shit right there. You're giving the Carve free reign to just go run amok in Superman threads with this. Which naturally you will say nothing about because you handed him the logic. As long as he repeats the mantra of "logic conclusions", he's untouchable.

Anyway, I probably won't care about this tomorrow, nor do I think this qualifies as a debate. More like an exercise in futility. Your platform would be a lot more respectable if you just started claiming "pis" though. 😬

Lol...you know me so well. I am going to use the hell out of what rao is doing.

Rao the only thing that you should have said after page 3 is drats, foiled again, because now you have OBM explaining Scatology to you.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
If Mephisto wanted to kill the hero's/villians on Marvel Earth (without caring about acquiring his victims soul), outside of Franklin, who is stopping him?

Originally posted by Magnon
Stephen & Illyana.

You do know that Mephisto has demonstrated (on panel) enough power to destroy Marvel Earth several times over?

If Mephisto just said screw it and nuked Marvel Earth, only Franklin would be capable of sensing what was about to happen and be powerful enough to stop it...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
You do know that Mephisto has demonstrated (on panel) enough power to destroy Marvel Earth several times over?

If Mephisto just said screw it and nuked Marvel Earth, only Franklin would be capable of sensing what was about to happen and be powerful enough to stop it...

Originally posted by Magnon
Mephisto isn't that hot outside his realm. Dr. Strange could most certainly sense any overt attack Mephisto was about to try, and fight to stop him. That's pretty much his job. And Magik, too, has a very good track record against Hell Lords. Ever since she traveled back in time to study further under Strange they've had no trouble working together, either.

No, Doctor Strange nor Magik are so in tuned with everything that they know Mephisto's every move and thought...thats ridiculous.

If, in the next 15 seconds, Mephisto decided to destroy Marvel Earth without regard to the billions of souls that he'd forfeit, neither of them would know about it until it was too late.

And just for the sake of argument, lets assume that they did some how know what Mephisto was planning to do 15 seconds before he did it, how are they gonna stop him?

Just will themselves to omniscience and automatically know his exact location? What if Mephisto doesnt want anyone to know what he's up to and uses his power to cloak his presence?

They can just "know" what he's up to, where he's at, and how to stop him anyway?

No, no, no...

Franklin is probably the only being on Marvel Earth that is intuned enough with the universe to know what was about to happen in enough to time to reasonably do something about it (if a cloaked Mephisto decided to destroy Marvel Earth in the next 15 seconds)...

And, as we have all seen, Franklin is definitely powerful enough to defeat Mephisto...

Originally posted by One Big Mob
How do you figure that Wonder Woman overpowering herself times at least 2 is comparable to the literal numbers and system Pak created? And that's with just accepting your words.

Wonder Woman isn't stronger than herself and that's why Hulk can't withstand an attack 133 times Herc's max punch? What? You're talking about logical fallacies and you just tried to red herring me with a completely non comparable feat.

He didn't give it 133.5 Hulks. He gave it Hercs. He created a new character measured on a scale created almost specifically for that character. That was used for other things as well. He went out of his way to give it specific numbers. This wasn't a lapse in judgement, this was a calculated feat with thought process behind it. The only possible thing to point out is he forgot Herc hit him before, but that's easily explained by Hulk's dynamic strength, and a surprise attack.

Also turning into a rock isn't a great defense either. Your mind won't change, that's good. But just know that you are literally denying long explanations and lots of proof to come to your viewpoint. If Carver pulled the same shit on Superman you would have a meltdown. And I don't even like Hulk and I especially don't like Pak, but I can see an extreme problem with your stance here.
Pak's numbers aren't off. They can't be off. The character he created that was never used again was specifically at this level of power. She was a character created specifically to wank Hulk. Especially when backed by the measurement system created to wank Hulk. Especially by the character that was turned into a character to wank Hulk. Hell Pak even tried to up Cho's intelligence level to specifically wank Hulk. Pak didn't make a mistake, his only regret is not making it 233 hercs. If Pak had the chance he would have specifically had it overpower 120 Hercs throwing a punch at once. Because he wrote it to be stronger, because it was stronger.

And about the actual feat itself. It was a durability feat anyway. It wasn't a "Hulk is this much stronger than Herc" feat. It was a "Hulk can get his ass knocked out by this level of power" feat. And people getting knocked out by an attack that should kill them happens all the time. It's called not killing your main character but still taking them out. There's really no difference in comics anyway. If you can knock someone out, logically it wouldn't take more to kill them. Unless they had a healing factor like a giant real world logic green man.
Even if you don't accept my logic on the view of the feat, it's still a high feat. Of which happens all the time in comics. He did it. He got a better feat a couple issues later but he still did that one. It was written in a book, published, and sold to the general populance. Then pirates took it and scanned it so we could read it. Then we realized Pak did everything he could possible outside of it looking like 133.5 Hercs throwing a punch to make it believable. I'm willing to bet Carver could bring back 5 pages that reinforce the feat. A normal person 10.

I don't understand how this feat can even be disputed. It's not like he wrote some vague shit without explanations. He pulled down his pants and shit in your face while holding up two seperate signs that had a picture of him shitting in your face and one with words that said "There is fecalmatter being planted in your face from my rectum". There is no doubt as to what his intention is. There is no doubt he wrote it in a way that you have to accept it happened like this. Yet here you are saying "nope". And why the nope? Because a, and get this because this is hilarious, but you think a high feat is false because a low feat (iyo) goes against it. That's some Superman gas station shit right there. You're giving the Carve free reign to just go run amok in Superman threads with this. Which naturally you will say nothing about because you handed him the logic. As long as he repeats the mantra of "logic conclusions", he's untouchable.

Anyway, I probably won't care about this tomorrow, nor do I think this qualifies as a debate. More like an exercise in futility. Your platform would be a lot more respectable if you just started claiming "pis" though. 😬

You're right, but still. Goddamn.

Originally posted by One Big Mob
Fun fact, but Wendigo and Bi Beast are both around Hercules level. Arm Cheddon above. Red Shulk and Green Grulk disintegrated them with the shockwave of a punch. You throw hundreds of Mindless Ones in there and you put them at Rhino level too.

The shockwave was well above a couple hercs me thinks.

Originally posted by Philosophía
I don't know what's worse, that you really like typing walls of text so much, or that I read all of it.

You're right, but still. Goddamn.

And then you have guys like ignored guy #6, saying that version is not much stronger than Thor based on feats.

Originally posted by Philosophía
I don't know what's worse, that you really like typing walls of text so much, or that I read all of it.

You're right, but still. Goddamn.

And then you have guys like ignored guy #6, saying that version is not much stronger than Thor based on feats.

Oh yeah, the Mindless Ones are garbage. I figure putting them around Rhino level is fair.