Originally posted by quanchi112
I didn't post the examples to prove Khan would do something similar I posted them to show his iditioic combat behavior. My claims are based off their behavior and I entered evidence as to suggest why I believe he wouldn't go for the kill ASAP. I believe I proved that.
...no, you haven't. If you restrict the analysis to the films, the only examples we have are Palpatine vs. Windu + the B team (where Palpatine actually goes for the kill quickly) and Palpatine vs. Yoda (where Palpatine goes for the FL, and then gloats against someone with whom he had a personal history with). Neither of these cases are analogous to his hypothetical performance against this random Khan guy, which means that we must defer to logic and reasonable predictions, .ie that Sidious would kill Khan using his abilities. Why would he gloat against this random guy with a gun?
This is made all the more ridiculous by your own claim that Sidious is a coward and likes to do whatever it takes to maximize his own chances of survival.
If we include TCW scenes as you have done, this isn't even a question; we have a clear analogy to an encounter with Khan when he faces the two guards, and what does he do? He chokes them. You say that he waits for them to speak; but he has precognition, so if they had thought to pull the trigger he would know and just start choking them a second earlier. Even against Maul and Oppress, his first move is to slam them against a wall.
Now you are free to disagree with the outcome what proud Sheev supporter wouldn't but one thing you have to agree with is Khan's larger phaser cannon strapped around his shoulder would leave Sheev in pieces. If Sheev chokes Khan he doesn't die immediately and he still has his gun strapped to his shoulder provided he drops his other phaser rifle. Coupled with his superior cellular regeneration he'd survive a lot longer than random schlub based off this undeniable Khan fact. He'd have a free shot.
Based on what? What makes you think his phaser cannon can overpower Sheev? What's Khan going to do? Hope the blasts can knock his saber out of his hands? Even Obi Wan can casually deflect Grievous's saber strikes, and Grievous can dent durasteel with kicks. Sidious and co. can easily deflect blaster bolts that can make hand-sized holes in concrete and blast apart droidekas. Where is your evidence that Khan's mighty phaser cannon would be so overwhelming?
Now claiming he would use precog and be one step ahead isn't something you can prove. You can claim it but I believe all of this comes down to reflexes and skills. I've already listed the examples precog failed him. A phaser blast from his gun travels much faster than a Windu kick or a Vader snatch and he wasn't aware of either slower attack before hand.
His precog has failed him exactly once, in a situation where Vader is standing right next to him and grabs him. This is not analogous to his ability to deflect shots from an enemy he's clearly aware of.
More importantly though, it's just a nonsensical argument to say that his precognition won't help him because it isn't perfect. Nothing is perfect - Khan might slip on some ice and drop his gun. But his precognition increases the probability that he'll beat Khan relative to not having it at all, and that's what matters. Weaker Force users have deflected blaster shots from multiple enemies simultaneously; why would Sidious be endangered by a single gunman?
You also don't have any examples of him snapping necks.
🙄 He can fling senate pods, I'm sure he can snap necks. Regardless, it's not necessary for him to win - he has choked people, and choking people works.
BTW, what is it with this ridiculous standard of yours, that you need to establish everything happening exactly like it'll happen in this hypothetical to argue it? Because you've never seen Khan firing at a Sith before, so I guess that means he can't fire at Sith Lords - never mind making predictions based on a reasonable catalog of evidence, right?
Sheev did know based off their numbers he had to get right down to brass tax. He decimated the weaker Jedi until the two peers remained. I have no problem in seeing Sheev trying to close down the distance between himself and Khan. I feel that's completely in character. Based off the evidence Khan is firing before Sheev attempts force lightning or to use his force powers.
Why? Sheev has faster reflexes, because he can see things before they happen.
Logically though wouldn't it make more sense to gloat over an enemy you have no fear of rather than someone he deemed a clear threat. In any event Khan is going to start firing ASAP but in no care does Palpatine strike faster than Khan does in any of his action sequences. Undeniable.
No, because Palpatine has precognition, so he's only going to gloat until his danger sense kicks in, which is still going to be before Khan can do anything.
And Sidious does like to show off...usually with his Force abilities! He uses Force lightning on Yoda, and ragdolls Maul/Oppress. Why wouldn't he show off his ability to disarm Khan with a gesture and then choke him?
**Khan has two guns. One is around his shoulder and one is in his other hand. We also don't have any examples of him at the start of battle ripping anyone's weapons out of their hands.
...seriously? Vader can do it, Dooku can rip bolted machinery, but apparently Sidious, who can ragdoll senate pods, can't pull a gun out of someone's hands?
Again, by your asinine standards of evidence, you can't argue anything, because we never explicitly see Khan firing his gun at a Sith Lord. Usually we are allowed to make reasonable extrapolations, because that's literally how we do things in real life, whether it be in science or just deciding which groceries to pick. There's no reason to assert that Sidious can't do things well within his power because he doesn't do it in grossly different situations.
**Sidious has never done so and this occurred after the other Star Wars films. We can't go back and retroactively apply feats since Kylo did something in the newest film. Food for thought he only stopped one bolt we don't know if these guys have the concentration to maintain multiple bolts frozen in mid air.
He actually freezes Poe at the same time. And Kylo is weaker than Vader, who is weaker than Sheev.
**Onus is on you since the bolts do greater damage to armored bodies as well as down Klingon ships in one blast.
Actually, you're making the argument, and no, Klingon ships can't be just equated with SW vessels or whatever. You aren't actually proving anything.
**It didn't incapacitate Luke or Windu. Only Yoda briefly but he's a geriatric fraggle with clear gait issues so no surprise there. Khan has superhuman cellular regeneration and took eight stun blasts consecutively after an extended fight and was still on his feet.
😂 WTF? Yoda after having fought Sidious for an extended period fell off a senate pod, hit the ground at terminal velocity, and wasn't hurt at all. Even padawan Anakin can do that casually. Yoda was likewise trying to deflect the bolts.
You also conveniently ignored the part where Sidious's lightning can fling Windu hundreds of feet out of a window. At the very least it incapacitates Khan long enough for Sheev to close the distance, at which point the fight is over, if it wasn't already.
**That wasn't combat speed that was sprinting speed to ironically avoid a fight not run towards it.
Lmao, so they can only use it when they're moving away from people? Why? We're talking about Sheev's ability to close the distance, not how fast he can sidestep or swing his lightsaber.
**Khan can shoot it out of the air. Khan had the battle awareness to take out 20 plus Klingons all converging as well as multiple ships with relative ease. Sheev is one target.
Which means he can shoot a lightsaber flying through the air now?
The evidence clearly shows Khan with his dual weapons would have Palpatine basically running for his life. One senate pod thrown at him at a much slower rate than the rapid fire Khan can unleash sent him jumping over to another pod with no awareness of Yoda. He looked all over the place and lost his sense of battle awareness after that one pod was launched at him. There's nowhere to hide from Khan. He can put multiple holes in him in less than a second.
😬 He got disoriented because he lost sight of Yoda. What does that have to do with anything?