I'm starting to wonder if the arrogant president of the United States speech on the consequences of us leaving the union. I can't help but draw parallels. The man came and told us this. Then the polls said it was going to be a stay vote. But still we left. I can only thank the president at this point, his arrogance and trying to swap opinion while threading trade deals and putting Britian last. This was a rebuke. That we won't be told what to do by anyone. Today Cameron announced he's out, and the president is looking for words.
Hopefully it works out. I am curious though..what about getting back into the EU? I don't know all of their rules, I assume it's probably not possible to get back in once you leave?
Originally posted by BlackJackal
I'm starting to wonder if the arrogant president of the United States speech on the consequences of us leaving the union. I can't help but draw parallels. The man came and told us this. Then the polls said it was going to be a stay vote. But still we left. I can only thank the president at this point, his arrogance and trying to swap opinion while threading trade deals and putting Britian last. This was a rebuke. That we won't be told what to do by anyone. Today Cameron announced he's out, and the president is looking for words.
You have to realize that Obama seems to think he is above the law and above the constitution. He naively believes a majority of people in this country share his views.
Originally posted by Surtur
Hopefully it works out. I am curious though..what about getting back into the EU? I don't know all of their rules, I assume it's probably not possible to get back in once you leave?
There's something like 35 different criteria a country must match to join. To give an example, Turkey set the ball rolling to join in 1987 and so far has only met 1 of the 35 criteria.
If Britain were to apply to rejoin it would likely have to adopt the EURO and join the shengen travel zone which it wouldn't be willing to do. Britain also spent the least money per GDP on the EU of any country due to the rebate Margaret Thatcher got when she was in office therefore it would have to handover much more than it did before.
Originally posted by One_Angry_ScotAnd yet interestingly the majority of London voted remain, seems those who understand immigration best are in favour of it.
I don't think it's necessarily true that that's why everyone voted Leave and even if they did there isn't anything bad about voting out of the E.U because of Immigrants. It just depends how you display your position.You must live in a rural Hertforshire village or somesuch right (or just the country in general). Because in London and where I live that certainly isn't the case.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
And yet interestingly the majority of London voted remain, seems those who understand immigration best are in favour of it.
That's most likely because it is the majority of immigrants that did vote to Remain. All of the people who I know who are immigrants or non white British Born all voted Remain. Not saying that is the case for everywhere but I think that is why the results show what they show.
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
That's most likely because it is the majority of immigrants that did vote to Remain. All of the people who I know who are immigrants or non white British Born all voted Remain. Not saying that is the case for everywhere but I think that is why the results show what they show.
Meanwhile the Leave Campaigners are already back-pedaling on some of the promises made during the campaign. I feel sorry for the British working class who've been sold on the lies of Johnson and Farage. In the end the main culprit is Cameron, of course. http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/25/leave-campaign-rows-back-key-pledges-immigration-nhs-spending?CMP=fb_gu
I've also been hearing stories from some of my British friends who are expats here in Prague that did not receive their ballot papers to vote for the referendum. I'd be interested to find out how much this has happened to British expats throughout Europe...
Originally posted by One_Angry_ScotCertainly London is a very multi-cultural city, but again that only gives them the greatest understanding of what immigration and internationalism means. Whereas the rest of the country for the most part is just buying into propaganda.
That's most likely because it is the majority of immigrants that did vote to Remain. All of the people who I know who are immigrants or non white British Born all voted Remain. Not saying that is the case for everywhere but I think that is why the results show what they show.
Originally posted by Slay
So all the immigrants live in Scotland and Northern Ireland, then?Meanwhile the Leave Campaigners are already back-pedaling on some of the promises made during the campaign. I feel sorry for the British working class who've been sold on the lies of Johnson and Farage. In the end the main culprit is Cameron, of course. http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/25/leave-campaign-rows-back-key-pledges-immigration-nhs-spending?CMP=fb_gu
I've also been hearing stories from some of my British friends who are expats here in Prague that did not receive their ballot papers to vote for the referendum. I'd be interested to find out how much this has happened to British expats throughout Europe...
It's no use attempting to generalise what I said. Hopefully you know the amount of immigrants on a percentage that are in Scotland so I don't need to answer that question. No point being sarcastic with me.
And none of the Leave campaigners lied? Funny how you act as if the Remain side were pure angels. And Farage didn't backpedal. He said the £350 Milllion was a mistake. And if anything you'd have to actually find me proof of Farage saying it. Or endorsing it, which then of course I will concede. I know Boris specifically spoke on this. And you act like because of just that one issue we should have stayed in.
If they're expats in the Czech Republic they don't deserve a vote at all. Why should British people living in the Czech Republic decide the future of the people who actually live in Britain?
Your British friends waived their rights to complain when they left the UK.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Certainly London is a very multi-cultural city, but again that only gives them the greatest understanding of what immigration and internationalism means. Whereas the rest of the country for the most part is just buying into propaganda.
Again that's your opinion. Just because they are immigrants doesn't give them an esoteric glance on the 2 things you suggested. That's not really a good argument to propose that that gives immigrants the greatest understanding. Which isn't true.
People of all ethnicities have both an equal and lesser understanding. It's not only white people who wanted to leave. There were plenty of non whites who came over to Britain from another country decades ago who have worked their fingers to the bone who wanted to Leave.
And I'd note just because you disagree with it doesn't make it propaganda. And also just because non-whites or the majority of immigrants didn't want it doesn't mean everyone outside was into propaganda.
Are you suggesting I was too then?
Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
It's no use attempting to generalise what I said. Hopefully you know the amount of immigrants on a percentage that are in Scotland so I don't need to answer that question. No point being sarcastic with me.And none of the Leave campaigners lied? Funny how you act as if the Remain side were pure angels. And Farage didn't backpedal. He said the £350 Milllion was a mistake. And if anything you'd have to actually find me proof of Farage saying it. Or endorsing it, which then of course I will concede. I know Boris specifically spoke on this. And you act like because of just that one issue we should have stayed in.
If they're expats in the Czech Republic they don't deserve a vote at all. Why should British people living in the Czech Republic decide the future of the people who actually live in Britain?
Your British friends waived their rights to complain when they left the UK.
Nigel £350 Milllion claim might have started as a mistake, but he's known for much longer than yesterday that it wasn't true, yet he withheld this information until after the referendum and continued to plaster it on his campaign buses. That's at the very least lying by omission.
Excuse me, but am I expected to take this seriously? I said they're expats. Most of them work for British companies and will spend an average amount of around 5 years of their careers abroad, before returning to the UK where they were born and raised and will live and work for several decades after they've returned from being expats.
Also, how am I acting as if the Remain campaigners are angels? I said in the exact same post that the main culprit was Cameron, who campaigned for Remain.
Here's your proof of Nigel referring to his lies as a 'mistake':
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-result-nigel-farage-nhs-pledge-disowns-350-million-pounds-a7099906.html
Additionally, if you truly are of the absurd opinion that British citizens who just happen to work abroad, in most cases for British companies, should not have to right to vote for British referenda, the fact is that according to the British government they DO have that right and as such should have received ballot papers.
@Slay (since it won't let me quote you)
Do you know the percentage of immigrants in Scotland without looking it up first?
Now for my answer: I shouldn't have to explain this again but you must know of the political opinions in Northern Ireland and Scotland. You should surely know what the SNP's and DUP's (and Sinn Fein) opinions are. The countries political makeup. Knowing the results of the general election would also help here. I don't need to wax lyrical on something you can find the answer to yourself easily (this isn't meant rudely) - but you should really be able to find this out yourself without asking me.
You didn't answer my question.
Are you implying that because of all the research you've done into the Remain campaign that they were completely pure and done absolutely nothing wrong?
And yes you are meant to take it seriously. I don't say things that I don't advocate or mean. If you as a Czech (if I am correct). If you were an expat living in say Pierre and St Miquelon for a year for work and just as you left a vote was started to oust Milos Zeman. I don't think you deserve any right to vote. You've elft the country for a certain amount fo time and won't face the immediate impact of a decision.
In fact it's very similar to the E.U imposing it's rules on England that it wants us to abide by and we can't make a decision on it. Mr Johnson living in Prague wants to vote on something that effects England and the UK. While he isn't living in the UK he has absolutely no right to vote. I'm not letting someone who lives abroad temporarily for no matter how long have a single chance of getting a vote in.
And there isn't a need for you to bold and underline expats. I fully read every message that is sent to me. And I am aware of what an expat is. And not just from knowing it. But my Dad has been an expat many a time for multiple European countries.
Originally posted by One_Angry_ScotYeah that's not my point, my point is that as a very multi-cultural city, people in London have first hand experience of what immigration means for the UK and it's benefits. Through personal experience or otherwise. As opposed to some white guy living in the countryside with a bunch of other white guys being told migrants are taking their jobs.
Again that's your opinion. Just because they are immigrants doesn't give them an esoteric glance on the 2 things you suggested. That's not really a good argument to propose that that gives immigrants the greatest understanding. Which isn't true.People of all ethnicities have both an equal and lesser understanding. It's not only white people who wanted to leave. There were plenty of non whites who came over to Britain from another country decades ago who have worked their fingers to the bone who wanted to Leave.
And I'd note just because you disagree with it doesn't make it propaganda. And also just because non-whites or the majority of immigrants didn't want it doesn't mean everyone outside was into propaganda.
Are you suggesting I was too then?
But yeah you're right, the colour of your skin or the country of your origin doesn't define your opinion, so why are you assuming all "immigrants" are biased?
And it is propaganda friend, we've been told by many that immigrants are bad for the longest time now. Perhaps you bought in to that rhetoric too, I can't say.
Originally posted by Slay
Also, how am I acting as if the Remain campaigners are angels? I said in the exact same post that the main culprit was Cameron, who campaigned for Remain.Here's your proof of Nigel referring to his lies as a 'mistake':
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-result-nigel-farage-nhs-pledge-disowns-350-million-pounds-a7099906.htmlAdditionally, if you truly are of the absurd opinion that British citizens who just happen to work abroad, in most cases for British companies, should not have to right to vote for British referenda, the fact is that according to the British government they DO have that right and as such should have received ballot papers.
Not his lies. He said himself that the Leave campaign made the promise not him.
I had already seen this video on my local news multiple times. I thought you meant you were going to show me something else.
I implied you were acting like they were angels because you criticise Farage and Johnson and only bring up Cameron and no one else for remain. Might be a bit picky of me to say so but you haven't included another member for Remain who lied.
Always good to use an ab absurdo in a debate. Always makes your point come across very clearly.
Yeah and I disagree with what the British Government.
And again, tell me why when someone decides to leave their home country for a few weeks or years. Why they should be allowed to make a decision that they wont feel the impact of immediately?
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Yeah that's not my point, my point is that as a very multi-cultural city, people in London have first hand experience of what immigration means for the UK and it's benefits. Through personal experience or otherwise. As opposed to some white guy living in the countryside with a bunch of other white guys being told migrants are taking their jobs.But yeah you're right, the colour of your skin or the country of your origin doesn't define your opinion, so why are you assuming all "immigrants" are biased?
And it is propaganda friend, we've been told by many that immigrants are bad for the longest time now. Perhaps you bought in to that rhetoric too, I can't say.
Care to point out where I said all immigrants are biased?
I said that immigrants will tend to be more likely to vote for Remain.
And no I didn't buy into propaganda at all. Your arguments seem to be based on a lot of hot air.
Accusing me of alleging Immigrants are biased (which I clearly didn't).
And slyly suggesting I may have bought into propaganda. I could just easily say you've been shaped to believe that there is absolutely nothing wrong with immigrants. But I wont because that isn't the case.
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Right I understand your first point a bit better now. I thought you meant that immigrants had the best understanding of the 2 things you mentioned so I unequivocally apologise for mistaking you there. That was entirely my fault.
Do you believe that majority of White Britons in London voted Remain because they were worried about their families from Eastern Europe perhaps not being able to get in as easier? Or that their Muslim family in Afghanistan now might find it harder to cross over from Calais because of the possible repercussions of a Brexit?
The majority of White people won't care about any of that because it doesn't affect them. But of course the people who aren't indigenous Britons will be affected. So they will vote Remain for those particular issues. Which is why such a multicultural city like London has these different statistics.