Anakin Skywalker & Obi-Wan Kenobi vs Exar Kun & Ulic Qel-Droma

Started by AncientPower5 pages

That isn't what occurred at all, but it is nice to see you are exceedingly desperate given your evident grasping at straws, very, very short straws.

He creates the Terentateks and the Battle Hydras after fighting Ulic, as the Massassi, after being turned into abominations, show him the Corsair, and he goes straight to Cinnagar afterwards. But it wouldn't be one of your posts if you actually understood context to any degree.

The Dark Reaper is an alchemical super weapon that Kun created to drain thousands of enemy troops, just like, you know, the Golden Globe. You wouldn't have heard of the Force Harvester though, that doesn't surprise me in the least.

'Flounder' is a funny term, a better anology would be describing color to a blind man.

The point being that your claim that he can't effect Ulic with the Force, despite being evidently his far superior, is folly.

So he continued to rise in power and got even stronger due to the Dark holocron... but he didn't grow drastically more powerful? Your logic is quickly collapsing in on itself.

As far as Dooku is concerned, him using the dark holocron hasn't been canon since 2009, do keep up dear:

Records do not reveal the fate of the Sith Holocrons used by Exar Kun and Count Dooku.
- Jedi VS. Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force

Just for clarification, this is the 'fate' of Exar Kun's Dark holocron:

Since when did Exar Kun create the Dark Reaper? I thought that thing had been around since Sadow's time.

He created the Dark Reaper but there are in-universe rumors that he merely uncovered it. Actual sources credit Kun with the creation of the Dark Reaper.

Originally posted by AncientPower
That isn't what occurred at all, but it is nice to see you are exceedingly desperate given your evident grasping at straws, very, very short straws.

He creates the Terentateks and the Battle Hydras after fighting Ulic, as the Massassi, after being turned into abominations, show him the Corsair, and he goes straight to Cinnagar afterwards. But it wouldn't be one of your posts if you actually understood context to any degree.

The New Essential Chronology and the SWTOR codex plainly state otherwise, are you blind?
The Dark Reaper is an alchemical super weapon that Kun created to drain thousands of enemy troops, just like, you know, the Golden Globe. You wouldn't have heard of the Force Harvester though, that doesn't surprise me in the least.
Quite aware hon, Wookieepedia is an easily accessible resource. However Sith alchemy is that which alters living beings so no, but it's irrelevant regardless; and as you say considering he invented the golden globe prior to facing Ulic (as the Essential Chronology states) he's evidently attained a level of mastery over this technique already.
'Flounder' is a funny term, a better anology would be describing color to a blind man.
Even more ironic than your last accusation considering the above.
The point being that your claim that he can't effect Ulic with the Force, despite being evidently his far superior, is folly.
Than a Jedi, Ulic hardly qualifies as of his duel with Kun. And there is a difference between unable to effect and unable to dominate.
So he continued to rise in power and got even stronger due to the Dark holocron... but he didn't grow drastically more powerful? Your logic is quickly collapsing in on itself.
No friend, and it's baffling that I must explain why the former doesn't necessitate the latter.
As far as Dooku is concerned, him using the dark holocron hasn't been canon since 2009, do keep up dear:

Just for clarification, this is the 'fate' of Exar Kun's Dark holocron:

So you're saying the same source that claims the Dark Holocron to be the most powerful of them all is... outdated? Well I suppose it makes little sense Kun would promptly destroy the greatest repository of dark side knowledge he had in his possession. Perhaps it wasn't so special after all. mmm.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Hurricane winds that turned TIE's to molten slag? Lol you'll have to cite that one.

If you'd paid attention recently, you need not ask:

Streen, however, did not pick up rocks or other weapons with the Force. He used the air itself, moving molecules in the atmosphere to summon storm currents and scramble the air attack line with a wall of wind that achieved hurricane strength. The gusting currents buffeted the TIE fighters right and left, forcing the pilots to concentrate on simply flying and not allowing them to fire a single shot.
Streen looked up into the sky, his eyes wide and bloodshot, his hair wafting about his head. He held his trembling fingers outstretched and then brought his hands together symbolically, slamming his hands of wind so that the heavy crosscurrents smashed the four TIE fighters together. They crashed into a single knot of molten wreckage that tumbled out of the air.
- Star Wars: Darksaber
Kam Solusar stood on the other side of the clearing and, using the Force, he, too, began hurling rocks at the remaining two TIE fighters. The boulders battered the Imperial ships, smashing through the cockpits.
-_Star Wars: Darksaber
A wall of invisible force(from Dorsk 81) slammed into the AT-ST, flattening its cockpit and crushing the walker back into a tree. Kyp whirled to gawk back at the smash scout walker. Everything had happened in only a second.
-_Star Wars: Darksaber
The warrior woman Kirana Ti stood out in the open near the piles of rubble the Jedi trainees had so meticulously removed from the ruins. The TIE fighters saw her and fired. Ignoring her own danger, she gestured with her hand and, using the Force as a sling, she snatched one of the squarish boulders cut by Massassi slaves thousands of years before--and hurled it with all her Jedi strength.
The stone flew through the air and smashed one of the TIE fighter's flat power arrays. It careened to one side, and the pilot could not regain control. The ship exploded in the trees on the far side of the temple.
-_Star Wars: Darksaber

Whilst Darksaber begins ten months to the end of Jedi Academy, there is no stated drastic increase in power for anybody besides Kyp Durron, who isn't relevant here.

Whilst logically the Knights did infact achieve some level of growth in that time, it is irrelevant in the face of the fact that when facing Exar Kun they were in a prepared state of mind and joined in meld. Said meld afforded them all powers far greater than they'd imagined themselves capable of:

As his eyes adjusted, Streen saw that all twelve of the Jedi candidates were limned with the faintest sheen of an iridescent blue glow that grew brighter as the new Jedi converged around Exar Kun.
-_Jedi Academy Trilogy Volume 3: Champions of the Force
"I felt empowered by the arrival of my fellow trainees, who included Kirana Ti, Kam Solusar, Tionne, Cilghal, Dorsk 81, and Brakiss. They’d been waiting for the right moment to enter the chamber and catch Exar Kun off guard. Present, too, were Jacen and Jaina, who stayed close to Cilghal’s side."
- Streen,_Jedi vs Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force
"Some of you were there when we finally defeated Exar Kun. We pooled our strengths, we joined as one, as champions of the Force--and, united, we unlocked a greater reservoir of strength than any of us could have imagined."
- Dorsk 81,_Star Wars: Darksaber

Not to mention the eight other Jedi present, including Brakiss:

He was one of the few handful of Imperials who tried to infiltrate Luke Skywalker's Jedi Academy on Yavin 4. Unlike the others, Brakiss had a true talent for The Force.
- The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia
Brakiss gave a rich chuckle. "Of course. I have no need for reinforcements-and I know you are true to your word." Luke paused to reassure himself that the Force was indeed guiding his actions. Both he and Brakiss were strong enough in the Force to sense any betrayal by the other.
- Young Jedi Knights: Jedi Under Siege
Brakiss was no match for Luke, but he was a good, strong fighter, and they would both be exhausted before this match ended.
- The New Rebellion

NOTE: Whilst all of these feats take place well after Jedi Academy, these are the only feats Brakiss possesses, as we only see him partake in the fight against Exar Kun. Though I'd point out that Brakiss is heavily amped as well as the others are.

As well as the vital presence of Vodo:

During the Jedi academy’s battle with the spirit of Exar Kun, an apparition of Jedi Master Vodo-Siosk Baas—who was slain by Exar Kun on Coruscant—materialized on Yavin 4 and aided the Jedi in bringing an end to the ancient Sith Lord.
-_Jedi vs Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force

Luke Skywalker's spirit was also there in the meld:

Then yet another apparition appeared, that of Master Skywalker, whose physical body remained inert. His apparition said, “The way to extinguish a shadow is to increase the light.”
- Jedi VS. Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force
Originally posted by Beniboybling
But yeah having potent Force powers doesn't preclude being inept in defending against dark side powers, as they evidently where.

Because Luke is just going to forget to teach them how to block it, when he shows Kam Solusar how to, all the way back in Dark Empire:

Master Skywalker was proud of them. He said that the trainees were reaching the limits of the techniques he himself could teach them.
-_Jedi Academy Trilogy Volume 3: Champions of the Force

Originally posted by Beniboybling
The New Essential Chronology and the SWTOR codex plainly state otherwise, are you blind?

Quite aware hon, Wookieepedia is an easily accessible resource. However Sith alchemy is that which alters living beings so no, but it's irrelevant regardless; and as you say considering he invented the golden globe prior to facing Ulic (as the Essential Chronology states) he's evidently attained a level of mastery over this technique already.

Even more ironic than your last accusation considering the above.

Than a Jedi, Ulic hardly qualifies as of his duel with Kun. And there is a difference between unable to effect and unable to dominate.

No friend, and it's baffling that I must explain why the former doesn't necessitate the latter.

So you're saying the same source that claims the Dark Holocron to be the most powerful of them all is... outdated? Well I suppose it makes little sense Kun would promptly destroy the greatest repository of dark side knowledge he had in his possession. Perhaps it wasn't so special after all. mmm.

The New Essential Chronology and the SWTOR Codex Entry are paraphrasing the events. The actual source material, if you've ever bothered to read it, show Kun leaving after ordering the construction of Massassi temples and his creation of Massassi Abominations. Then he has years after dueling Ulic Qel-Droma to continue his advancements.

The sphere of alchemy also includes the creation of amulets, Force-imbued Sith swords, and so on. But we can all ignore that for your benefit.

The only irony here, is that you are baffled by anything I've posted and not the hilarious logic that because he didn't attempt to defeat Ulic via the Force, means he can't.

Neither does Exar Kun, yet it states Kun is far more powerful than any other Jedi of his day, evidently Kun and Droma as Dark Jedi are both subject to the statement.

It is baffling that your entire argument is based on something that didn't even happen.

It is outdated in terms of Dooku having used the Dark holocron, which contains a hundred thousand years of knowledge. It calling the holocron the most powerful in the mythos, isn't subject to that discrepancy. He smashed it well after having obtained it, and as sources state, having learned many forbidden Sith secrets from it, and becoming more powerful, more quickly, due to it.