Old Master Maul vs. Emperors Wrath II (Lightsabers only)

Also I'm not even sure what difference the time period would make if he honestly meant Maul's no match for her, and only Vader or Palpatine could fight/best her.

I mean if she was that powerful surely it would hold true for almost any time period. We're yet to see any other villain greater than Rebels Maul in another time period save perhaps Snoke (whose actually alive in this time period so Ahsoka > Snoke confirmed). Even Dooku's not much ahead of Maul tbh.

So why even bring up the time period?

Because he was obviously talking in the context of S2 Rebels. And how the available villains (the Inquisitors) are simply no match for her. Hence why they couldn't have her showing up and fighting every other episode.

But again, it really wouldn't surprise me if he personally rated Ahsoka above Maul, cause you know he's slightly biased.

Does this even matter? People are acting as if the Wrath couldn't stand up to Ahsoka on a nexus, which is pretty damn loltastic.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Also I'm not even sure what difference the time period would make if he honestly meant Maul's no match for her, and only Vader or Palpatine could fight/best her.

I mean if she was that powerful surely it would hold true for almost any time period. We're yet to see any other villain greater than Rebels Maul in another time period save perhaps Snoke (whose actually alive in this time period so Ahsoka > Snoke confirmed). Even Dooku's not much ahead of Maul tbh.

So why even bring up the time period?

Because he was obviously talking in the context of S2 Rebels. And how the available villains (the Inquisitors) are simply no match for her. Hence why they couldn't have her showing up and fighting every other episode.

But again, it really wouldn't surprise me if he personally rated Ahsoka above Maul, cause you know he's slightly biased.

He tried to get Maul killed in season 5 of TCW but GL stopped him and he originally was going to kill him in Twilight of the Apprentice yet decided against it since he only appaered in two episodes. Perhaps now Ahsoka is out of the picture he will promote Maul 😄

Originally posted by Darth Thor
What, you mean about less chance of the Emperor showing up than Maul? Yeah fair enough. Except I still don't think that's what he means. He was talking about why Ahsoka wasn't showing up much in Season 2. Now you really think he meant Maul isn't a good enough foe for Ahsoka?

And again... When Maul does show up, he does match Ahsoka blow for blow, so taking his words literally makes no sense.

He was just pointing out there's not much competition for Ahsoka in this time period. He only wants Ahsoka being challenged by the top tiers.

??

Yeah so he claims. I mean you realise that whole team works for him right?

And that gives him authority over the entire time period?

The good thing about Lucas being gone now, is that there is no one person who has absolute say and authority on everything.

Unless you believe ROTJ Luke is basically useless and would get his butt kicked by any Council Member?

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Perhaps now Ahsoka is out of the picture he will promote Maul 😄

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Oh the wishful naive thinking. 🙂

Naah I actually put my hopes on the new executive producer of Rebels.

Originally posted by Beniboybling

If Filoni is an authority on a particular episode, why he wouldn't be over a breadth of episodes makes little sense yeah.

He does, but Canon comes down to more than just him. There's novels, games and comics from that time period. He can't just give final say on power levels. Not that I'm aware of anyway.

And end of the day, he says all that, yet Maul and Ahsoka do fight in his series, and they still don't show us Ahsoka to be his clear superior.

Originally posted by Beniboybling

Flioni never had authority over RotJ.

Bingo!

He doesn't just have final say on power levels in the OT period. He's not Lucas. Without a Lucas we go by showings and canon source books. Episode/Film commentary to an extent as well, but no one person just has control over an entire time period and everyone's power levels, as far as I'm aware.

Now if it's not a vague statement but a clear cut statement in and out of Universe with confirmation from several people e.g. Vader > Maul then that'd be different.

Just wondering, but does the majority of the forum subscribe to the assertion that Maul didn't degrade from SoD to Rebels? Because if we were operating under the assumption that Maul retained his skills ever since the beginning of his training to TCW to Rebels, then I think Maul takes the saber only contest.

Btw, that Maul vs Ahsoka stuff looks like something I don't want to touch with a 10 ft pole tbh. 🙂

Originally posted by Solar Power
Just wondering, but does the majority of the forum subscribe to the assertion that Maul didn't degrade from SoD to Rebels? Because if we were operating under the assumption that Maul retained his skills ever since the beginning of his training to TCW to Rebels, then I think Maul takes the saber only contest.

Not seen enough of him to say for sure. But given he regained his skill back fairly quickly in TCW, he should be able to do the same in Rebels. However he might have been out of touch on Malachor as we don't know how long he was stranded there doing nothing.

He has to at some point stagnate...every character does as they get older. Yoda did, Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon etc

Originally posted by Zenwolf
He has to at some point stagnate...every character does as they get older. Yoda did, Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon etc

Didn't to Windu, Dooku or Palpatine though. In most cases the elite get more powerful with age.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Didn't to Windu, Dooku or Palpatine though. In most cases the elite get more powerful with age.

Yet Yoda declined and he was more powerful than the former 2. But I'm talking about from a physical standpoint.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Do you have the full quote on hand?

-- Dave Filoni (http://www.starwars.com/news/dave-f...ason-two-part-1)

Originally posted by Zenwolf
Yet Yoda declined and he was more powerful than the former 2. But I'm talking about from a physical standpoint.

It's unclear when Yoda finally declined though. Force Mastery over time seems to compensate for physical degradation over time.

@ Joker's quote: Reading that again it does seem like he's strongly implying Maul can't match Ahsoka.

But Lol @ "they all felt". Given there's no previous benchmark for how powerful she must be and they were just making that up for this series.

In any case without seeing that in action or without confirmation from Canon sources (or at least the Story Group), his statement isn't canon.

Ahsoka's better than Maul, get over it, lmao.

Originally posted by |King Joker|
Ahsoka's better than Maul, get over it, lmao.

All hail Filoni

Ahsoka being better than Maul is simply logical, tbh. Do you truly believe Maul would've given Vader the same trouble Ahsoka gave him during their fight at Malachor? It's clear that the gap between Ahsoka and Vader, although existent and noticeable, isn't as big as many previously thought. Ahsoka being close enough to Vader to actually give him a hard time is more than Maul has to his name, and assuming or believing Maul = or > Vader is frankly ridiculous. Maul stating his inferiority to Vader speaks for itself, and for those that say he was attempting to deceive or manipulate the Jedi, your argument would make some sense if everything we've seen from Maul so far didn't point to him being the inferior combatant. But that's certainly not the case.

Originally posted by Petrus
Ahsoka being better than Maul is simply logical, tbh. Do you truly believe Maul would've given Vader the same trouble Ahsoka gave him during their fight at Malachor? It's clear that the gap between Ahsoka and Vader, although existent and noticeable, isn't as big as many previously thought. Ahsoka being close enough to Vader to actually give him a hard time is more than Maul has to his name, and assuming or believing Maul = or > Vader is frankly ridiculous. Maul stating his inferiority to Vader speaks for itself, and for those that say he was attempting to deceive or manipulate the Jedi, your argument would make some sense if everything we've seen from Maul so far didn't point to him being the inferior combatant. But that's certainly not the case.

Regardless, two things seem pretty clear to me which make the discussion of character dialogue a little redundant, to me. 1. Ahsoka and Maul fought as relative equals, and have roughly equal showings against common opponents. Thematically they're two sides of the same coin; Force users who have abandoned/been abandoned by their respective orders. If they were meant to be anything other than relatively equal then it's been an incredibly well kept secret up to this point. 2. Regardless of what anyone says, it's plain as shit on your face that Vader is the top dog in Rebels, sans Sidious. Neither Ahsoka or Maul are going to be able to defeat him in a fair fight, as Vader already demonstrated with Ahsoka. The only point of contention now is how Maul would do against him. With Maul and Ahsoka being relative equals, it seems reasonable to me that Maul would put a respectable fight but ultimately lose.

Originally posted by ILS
The issue I have with Maul conceding inferiority is 1. This is the same guy who willingly throws himself at the likes of Sidious and Mace Windu,

I understand where you're coming from, but Maul throwing himself at those two doesn't necessarily mean he believes he's without a doubt coming out on top, at least against Sidious. Maul obviously knows he's not more powerful than his former master, yet he still throws himself at him, as you put it. Arrogant or not, I doubt he believes he can take Sidious and win.

and 2. When Maul was discussing how he needed help to defeat Vader, it wasn't strictly in a personal combat sense. Maul was at Malachor to unlock a superweapon, presumably to use for his own agenda. Vader has the entire empire's resources at his back, which includes a crew of Jedi hunting inquisitors who Maul had had several run-ins with. Him saying that he can't take Vader alone is more reasonable in terms of resources considering who Maul is as a character; massively self-confident, stepping into arrogant and pretty much fearless (aside from Sidious), I guess.

hmm Tbh, I would need to re-watch that part of the episode to analyze its context better, but it's a fair assumption.

Regardless, two things seem pretty clear to me which make the discussion of character dialogue a little redundant, to me. 1. Ahsoka and Maul fought as relative equals, and have roughly equal showings against common opponents.

I think we did not see enough of Maul and Ahsoka's duel to definitely acknowledge combative equity between the two, and I was operating under the assumption that Malachor was a DS nexus, although I'm not sure about that anymore.

Regarding their showings, it's debatable. Can you provide some examples?

2. Regardless of what anyone says, it's plain as shit on your face that Vader is the top dog in Rebels, sans Sidious. Neither Ahsoka or Maul are going to be able to defeat him in a fair fight, as Vader already demonstrated with Ahsoka. The only point of contention now is how Maul would do against him. With Maul and Ahsoka being relative equals, it seems reasonable to me that Maul would put a respectable fight but ultimately lose.

I'm glad to see you are objective enough to accept that Vader is clearly depicted as the most powerful Force user in Rebels. 👆