I need to provide sources about Nihilus' hunger that are widely available in his RT and other places?
I love it when the brigade has to play ignorant when you know full well what I'm referring to.
Stop pretending that the entire point of Nihilus' character isn't that he's a Wound in the Force that aggressively feeds off of Force energy that isn't his own to sustain his utter lack of it.
Yeah, because she claims that the power rules him, not the other way around. She literally explains why in the sentence afterwards. And if you continue the conversation, she continues to talk about how powerful he is and how it's changed his perception of the universe.
That makes no sense. Nihilus has plenty of conventional power that has nothing to do with his hunger. Stunning the Exile's party, incapacitating Traya with TK, etc. — unless his vaunted Ravager resurrection feat isn't conventional power? lmfao
Originally posted by AncientPower
I need to provide sources about Nihilus' hunger that are widely available in his RT and other places?I love it when the brigade has to play ignorant when you know full well what I'm referring to.
Stop pretending that the entire point of Nihilus' character isn't that he's a Wound in the Force that aggressively feeds off of Force energy that isn't his own to sustain his utter lack of it.
Too bad sources objectively refer to characters being more powerful than Wounds in the Force like Traya being more powerful than the Exile. If you want to argue that Nihilus can beat a more powerful character, then by all means make the argument, but don't try to exclude him from quotes in which he's obviously included, lol.
Originally posted by AncientPowerOr in other words they don't exist. 😂
I need to provide sources about Nihilus' hunger that are widely available in his RT and other places?I love it when the brigade has to play ignorant when you know full well what I'm referring to.
Stop pretending that the entire point of Nihilus' character isn't that he's a Wound in the Force that aggressively feeds off of Force energy that isn't his own to sustain his utter lack of it.
He continues to get more powerful because he keeps feeding on the survivors of Malachor V before Kreia finds him and teaches him to use his Hunger to ever greater heights. This power he feeds on continues to fuel him until he's capable of devouring planets and ripping fleets out of gravity wells. But the more he does it the quicker the Hunger macerates and destroys him, so he transfers his essence and his hunger to his armor.
He becomes the literal embodiment of his Hunger, if his power was conventional then why does starving him weaken him? So much so that Meetra can kill him? It's temporary power drained from actual Force energy.
His power isn't personal power, it's his Hunger draining power from actual sources of Force energy which he can use to have massive effects on the universe around him.
This is the most basic aspect of his one-dimensional character
Assuming Nihilus applies to power in the way everybody else thinks he's powerful. Because there's a massive distinction between Nihilus' power and actual power in the Force.
That's true AncientPower.
Nihilus has two forms of power, Force Power, and Hunger Power. He metabolizes Force Energy into Hunger Power which has FAR greater yields than normal Force Energy.
Nihilus' Drain may have been different in origin to Apoc Krayt's Drain (although they might in fact be the same), but its effects are pretty similar and that would not have allowed Krayt to solo the more powerful Abeloth.
It is dissimilar in regard to what drives it. Krayt uses Force Energy to fuel his drain, Nihilus uses a different type of energy, Hunger Power.
The technique can be used in a variety of manners, true, but Nihilus' "drain" is a far different application than the Assassin. Who don't slowly drain btw, they just instantly grow relative to their opponents by all extents and purposes.
True Nephthys.
The fact that Nihilus' drain is a focused form of his own passive aura drain, and the Assassins use this form to kill much stronger Force users should be evidence that Nihilus' ability would naturally affect much stronger Force users as well. The fact of the matter is that it works because it is anti-Force, and consumes it. Not because of some made up power disparity dynamic.
You're assigning significance to Nihilus being more powerful than his opponents that isn't there. The technique has no defense, power is explicitly exempt from the techniques effectiveness.
No defense BECAUSE it is fueled by Force Energy. It's kinda silly to say a wall of black powder is going to defend against a blowtorch. Lol.
Then Nihilus would simply fail to sever Palpatine's connection ala Odan-Urr vs Exar Kun.
SunRazer it doesn't work the same. Odan-Urr wasn't using an ability against Exar Kun that flat out used Force Energy as fuel.
I mean, is Nihilus' ability ever even referred to as a drain by a canon source? You even have an ability (gameplay mechanics) named Force Drain in that very game, which is obviously not the same thing.
No. In fact the Sith Triumvirate Assassins aren't listed in the campaign guide as having a drain of any sort, and we know they have the passive aura form.
The only reason "Drain Force (drain's Force Energy) appears in the guide is because he uses it against Traya during the cut scene. The form of drain he uses on you in combat is Dark Healing / Dark Healing Field which drains life and siphons it to him. Sion has this ability as well as Traya but neither of them have normal drain forms. It is a non-classified drain type.
Well, he uses the Force Drain animation...
All Life Siphoning effects have the orange drain animation. It keeps in flavor with the different life drain effect in other sources (in example Force Powers for Star Wars pg 46, Drain Life animation). You will note that when he drains Traya's Force Energy, it is an invisible effect just like the in game mechanic (no orange pasta noodles lol)
Force Drain is an entire spectrum of powers, and in my blog on it I detail the difference between K2's Drain and the conventional Drain Life. That being said, as long as Drain involves affecting somebody's connection to the Force, my point stands.
Which is pretty specific in the guides. I'm not sure... you're on the up and up with drains.
And KotORCG identifies it as Drain, yes.
Untrue. The CG only describes it as a draining effect in the character bios, but when it comes to the ability itself, it is NOT classified as a skill. Drain Force is NOT Nihilus' unique drain.
Apparently, Force Sever looks like a glowing, orange beam.
That's an energy effect that shows life is being transferred. It appears during his special drain (In which he siphons life energy) as well as Dark Healing, Death Field, etc. Its not Force Sever.
It's been stated over and over again that he's "the most powerful Sith Lord who ever lived," and "the greatest master of evil ever to use Sith power."Pretty sure the intent there is that he's > than any prior Sith or former Sith.
Though Nihilus and Traya carried the title, neither of them were really Sith. Traya flat out says she isn't and it isn't what she believes (the Sith religion/code).
And Nihilus uses primarily Hunger Power, not Force Power.
Gotta stop here for a bit. Baby is needing some cuddle time. 😱
Originally posted by SunRazer
So his power is conventional power, just temporary...
No, it isn't. It is Hunger Power, metabolized Force Energy.
Are you familiar with how hypermatter reactors work? They take hypermatter and create enormous amounts of energy by destroying the matter (through various means). This allows for a near unlimited power source as hypermatter can be obtained easily closer to the Galactic Empire days.
The Force is also a similar power source which when used as fuel, can create tremendous amounts of energy. As we saw with Nihilus, the little energy he metabolized on Malachor V allowed him to raise a multi-million ton vessel from a gravity well that was nearly impossible to escape from (due to the gravity storms).
Originally posted by SunRazer
So his power is conventional power, just temporary...In what way does that change him falling under the jurisdiction of Palpatine's quotes?
He hasn't declined in power at all since joining the Trayus Academy, up until the Battle of Telos IV.
It's not actually his power though, it is power that sustains him for a limited time before fading. The catch is that he needs more and more to satiate his ever-growing Hunger, hence going from survivors on Malachor V to entire planets.
The Wound only gets larger and larger, with more and more drastic effects, each time he devours mass Force energy to satiate this he achieves greater and greater degrees of strength.
It is the basic difference between him and Vitiate, Vitiate's is a lasting power growth that doesn't rely on further feeding to sustain him. His is self sustaining. Nihilus on the other hand is a snowball effect.
His feats are capable due to whatever Force energy he has reserved from previous consumption but when he attempts to siphon the Exile, that decreases his remaining reservoir even further and reduces him to a beatable state.
Conventional Force power is personal self-sustaining power that grows naturally or through artificial growths such as a ritual. You need flesh and blood to sustain such power, but when you lack that, even the likes of Sidious, by his own admission, are extremely limited by such a state. Nihilus doesn't need flesh and blood to sustain his power because he is the embodiment of a Wound in the Force that lasts on feeding upon external power sources.
The Exile is different because her Wound is actually healing, her connection to the Force replenishing. She becomes a natural, conventional Force user again. Nihilus' polar opposite.
Originally posted by AncientPower
It's not actually his power though, it is power that sustains him for a limited time before fading. The catch is that he needs more and more to satiate his ever-growing Hunger, hence going from survivors on Malachor V to entire planets.The Wound only gets larger and larger, with more and more drastic effects, each time he devours mass Force energy to satiate this he achieves greater and greater degrees of strength.
It is the basic difference between him and Vitiate, Vitiate's is a lasting power growth that doesn't rely on further feeding to sustain him. His is self sustaining. Nihilus on the other hand is a snowball effect.
His feats are capable due to whatever Force energy he has reserved from previous consumption but when he attempts to siphon the Exile, that decreases his remaining reservoir even further and reduces him to a beatable state.
He metabolizes Force Energy into Hunger Power, at an alarming rate no less.
Imagine it this way. Say you have a camp fire, and you have a tube to pump gas through. If you have enough pressure in the gas being pumped out, the fire won't be able to climb up the stream and get you. But the more you pump into the fire, the more pressure you need to push the growing flames back. This requires more and more gas. When you run out, you're going to be consumed.
In the same way Nihilus would absorb Force Energy (and Life Energy) which would fan the flames of his Hunger Power. But he would require more and more to keep it at bey in order for it to not consume him (a Force Aberration that is pure Force Energy). During his duel with Meetra, the Hunger turned on him and started consuming HIM because his failed attempt. So his own energy was being metabolized into Hunger Power.
This is why Nihilus could never be truly immortal as he was, because at some point he wouldn't have enough to feed the fire. It's kinda like the Force's insurance policy lol.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Both Traya and Nihilus has been acknowledged as Sith by objective sources, regardless of their personal beliefs, just in the same way they have been regarded as powerful, regardless of where that power comes from.
I know, I'm just pointing out the in game content and the philosophical reality of the situation. 😉
Originally posted by Miko Hacksaw
No, it isn't. It is Hunger Power, metabolized Force Energy.Are you familiar with how hypermatter reactors work? They take hypermatter and create enormous amounts of energy by destroying the matter (through various means). This allows for a near unlimited power source as hypermatter can be obtained easily closer to the Galactic Empire days.
The Force is also a similar power source which when used as fuel, can create tremendous amounts of energy. As we saw with Nihilus, the little energy he metabolized on Malachor V allowed him to raise a multi-million ton vessel from a gravity well that was nearly impossible to escape from (due to the gravity storms).
Hey, I'm just following AncientPower's description.
SunRazer it doesn't work the same. Odan-Urr wasn't using an ability against Exar Kun that flat out used Force Energy as fuel.
Sever Force does use Force energy as fuel, like any Force power. The difference in effect is the only thing that's relevant here, and it's just that one blocks another's connection to the Force whilst the other devours it.
No. In fact the Sith Triumvirate Assassins aren't listed in the campaign guide as having a drain of any sort, and we know they have the passive aura form.The only reason "Drain Force (drain's Force Energy) appears in the guide is because he uses it against Traya during the cut scene. The form of drain he uses on you in combat is Dark Healing / Dark Healing Field which drains life and siphons it to him. Sion has this ability as well as Traya but neither of them have normal drain forms. It is a non-classified drain type.
That's down to game mechanics again. Nihilus' Drain is explicitly said to just be an advanced version of the Assassins, but stems from the same teachings.
All Life Siphoning effects have the orange drain animation. It keeps in flavor with the different life drain effect in other sources (in example Force Powers for Star Wars pg 46, Drain Life animation). You will note that when he drains Traya's Force Energy, it is an invisible effect just like the in game mechanic (no orange pasta noodles lol)
That's because his Drain is off-panel. He used the same technique on the Exile as he would've on other Jedi, and it manifested as Drain Life. I'm pretty sure that was just the game trying to depict it as such for lack of better animations.
Which is pretty specific in the guides. I'm not sure... you're on the up and up with drains.
No idea what you're talking about here.
Untrue. The CG only describes it as a draining effect in the character bios, but when it comes to the ability itself, it is NOT classified as a skill. Drain Force is NOT Nihilus' unique drain.
Nihilus doesn't have any unique drain. It's the same as the assassins. And there's no name for it, I just call it Drain. However, as you said, the CG does mention him draining people, so I'd say it's a valid term to describe it.
Though Nihilus and Traya carried the title, neither of them were really Sith. Traya flat out says she isn't and it isn't what she believes (the Sith religion/code).
Those are their personal claims, which are irrelevant to the fact that objective sources depict them as Sith Lords, and hence they fall under the jurisdiction of objective sources claiming that Palpatine is the most powerful Sith Lord of all time.
And indeed, deviating from Sith ideology doesn't exclude them from being Sith. Traya says Nihilus does not care for Sith teachings but still refers to him as a Lord of the Sith (and herself, for that matter).
And Nihilus uses primarily Hunger Power, not Force Power.
I'm assuming that this is a primarily fan-made denomination for the power, like Drain, rather than an official name.
Regardless, if we're trying to going to run off technicalities, half of Palpatine's quotes make no specific mention of Force power and simply say that he's the most powerful Force user or expression of the dark side or user of Sith power. Nihilus falls under the jurisdiction of all three.
...continuing...
They don't work in the same way in that one involves blocking somebody else from feeling the Force and the other revolves around outright damaging the Force connection, but that's much the same as saying telekinesis and Force Lightning don't work the same way. They don't, but if you're stronger in the Force than the caster, you can block the attacks all the same. In this case, you can resist the attacks all the same.
Well, the Force Ability "Force of Will" defends against direct TK, but it doesn't against Force Lightning, Force Storms, Pyrokinesis, or objects thrown by TK among other things.
Force of Will amps a defender's ability to defend against focused and direct internal attacks on the person, yet doesn't defend against other things. So just because skills are "force powers" doesn't mean they all have equal avenues of defense.
In regard to Nihilus' drain, it can't be blocked because the ability is fueled by Hunger Power which is FED by FORCE ENERGY. Trying to use the Force to defend against his drain is like coating yourself with gasoline to defend against a fireball.
Also, nowhere is it said that you instantly form a Bond to them and then exploit, lol. You Drain their connections to the Force. Draining through a Force Bond is a separate application of the power.
I agree with you here, there's no Force Bonding before the drain but Nihilus *can* form Force Bonds at will as exampled by Visas. Nihilus is supposed to be the Polar Opposite of Meetra so a lot of what he does is a shadow of her. The severing and forming Force Bonds are two of those things.
But since you want to bring up Kreia, Bond and Drain, I'll remind you that amongst KotOR II's cut content/script is Kreia using Drain on the Exile through their Bond, and that was not an instakill indeed. So your case falls flat once more.
Where is this? I don't remember her using the Nihilus drain on Meetra. I think I recall her using Drain Force (which drains Force Energy) on Meetra but not the Nihilus drain.
It's an instakill because Nihilus is so far above his enemies; the same goes for Traya vs the Masters. There's no evidence that Nihilus would instakill Sidious with it. Your claim has no legs to stand on, especially since Nihilus' use of it has been historically suspect to begin with, as Temp pointed out. He's always prepped/ambushed someone/incapacitated them before using Drain. Without any of those advantages and against someone stronger in the Force, we have reason to doubt Nihilus' capacity to instantly kill Sidious, and your case isn't strong enough to reverse that.
Temp is also under the impression that the ability is Force Power based, meaning it is governed by the laws of Force Power/Energy when that is in fact false. His Hunger Power is anti-force.
The idea that Sidious can "out-Force" Nihilus' attack is what is lacking legs, mainly because its an assertion in error. Nihilus's drain isn't Force Based, its anti-Force based. Its not like fighting an infection with white blood cells, its like fighting full blown AIDS with white blood cells.
On the other hand, I also recall it failing to kill lesser Force wielders as well; principally, Nihilus failing to kill Traya. Seems like there has to be a massive disparity in order for it to work. And one certainly doesn't exist here. Not in favour of Nihilus, anyway.
Still chewing on that bone? In all of the source texts we can find, the goal was exile, the plan was to drain her Force energy, and they succeeded. You really need to drop that because it is entirely false and misleading.
Anyway, you're wrong. Nowhere is the Exile permitted any sort of special resistance to the attack, bar against Nihilus. The KotORCG elaborates on this by saying that the Exile was Nihilus' polar opposite, which is the reason she repelled Nihilus' hunger completely. That means her resistance to Nihilus' Drain was specific to Nihilus alone, not other casters. Otherwise, as we've seen, Traya and the Assassins were perfectly capable of employing Drain on her. And indeed, Traya didn't kill her with the technique.
I don't remember the Assassins deploying direct drain on her, and if you're wanting to call the orange life siphoning power "drain" its actually Dark Healing. Nihilus uses it on her during their duel after his primary drain was nullified.
This is flat out proof that Nihilus' unique drain is NOT the same as other Life Siphoning abilities.
And indeed, Nihilus failed to completely sever Traya,
Negative, the CG says she was reconnected to the Force through her Nexus bond with Meetra:
What she finds is a ruined Jedi Order, and an enigmatic Jedi Master-Kreia, who also claims to have been stripped of her Force powers. Kreia's union with the Jedi Exile creates a vergence in the Force that reconnects them to the energy field surrounding all living things.
-SWKOTORCG, pg. 140
1) Vs Traya — Nihilus opts to join forces with Sion to divide Traya's attention, then exploits her divided attention by incapacitating her with telekinesis, rendering her defenseless. It's only then that he drains her. And she still survives.
No, his drain has TK effects and in that clip she was just sapped of her Force Energy. What you see with the artistic wiggle of the Saber is what is left of her Force Reserves after being severed (its meant to display her powerlessness). He is not aiming to kill her there.
2) Vs Katarr — Nihilus has the benefit of prep (not saying he necessarily did prep for it, but he could have) and ambushes the Jedi by attacking them before they can react. Again, we have a survivor.
A survivor he purposely left alive.
"I asked him why he had spared me. And though he said nothing, I suddenly knew the answer. It was because he wanted my people at last to see"
-Visas Marr, Unseen Unheard
3) Vs Exile — Nihilus stuns the Exile's party first, proving how much more powerful he is than them. Yet he still opts to stun them before attempting Drain on the Exile.
Which really establishes nothing. In the other versions of how this goes down, he doesn't immediate drain them first either. He lifts the whole party up in a Force Choke, he throws Visas around, he roars, etc. The intent of the writers was not to have him instant-drain right off the bat. There's dialogue to be had.
Even with Traya vs the Masters, she only used Drain after a prolonged monologue, which again, is an opportunity to gather power and prep (she also hid from the Council Chamber for a while beforehand). If we take the script as what it should be (since the final scene is littered with bugs), she telekinetically incapacitates the lot of them before using Drain as well, so the pattern here hasn't deviated at all — potential prep and only using it on defenseless opponents.
They're standing up ready to defend. I don't know why you're saying they're incapacitated during the attack.
(sorry if you've responded since this, still dealing with an energetic baby lol)
Sever Force does use Force energy as fuel, like any Force power. The difference in effect is the only thing that's relevant here, and it's just that one blocks another's connection to the Force whilst the other devours it.
Sever Force in regard to the normal Jedi ability, creates a wall of light. That's obviously not what's being done here. There's other abilities on the Dark Side that are "Sever Force" type, like in the NJO materials, and I think Vitiate as well. But those aren't what Nihilus does.
That hunger feeds on their reserves at such a rate that it destroys the connections as you know. This is not normal force energy, in fact the programming notes differentiate it by calling it "Vampiric Energy":
"[As Nihilus reaches out with his power, he drains the player with vampiric energy, and then suddenly reels back, collapsing on the ground.]"
-KOTOR 2, dialog.tlk file.
This is because it is Hunger Power that is being used to deploy the ability, not normal Force Power.
That's down to game mechanics again. Nihilus' Drain is explicitly said to just be an advanced version of the Assassins, but stems from the same teachings.
Down to game mechanics that never show them using the direct channeled form against Meetra or anyone else. We understand the Aura effect, but Meetra isn't effected by Nihilus' direct attack form, not even his Aura.
That's because his Drain is off-panel. He used the same technique on the Exile as he would've on other Jedi, and it manifested as Drain Life. I'm pretty sure that was just the game trying to depict it as such for lack of better animations.
Drain Force is invisible. Force Drain has the orange animation. All life siphoning abilities have this animation, unless you have evidence that there's a form of life siphoning that doesn't in this media?
No idea what you're talking about here.
You're mixing drains and failing to differentiate between them.
Nihilus doesn't have any unique drain. It's the same as the assassins. And there's no name for it, I just call it Drain. However, as you said, the CG does mention him draining people, so I'd say it's a valid term to describe it.
The drain is fueled by Hunger Power, and creates voids in the Force when deployed. Both he and the Assassins use this drain type that Kreia speaks about. I refer to it being "unique" because it is not like the other abilities that are purely Force Energy driven.
Those are their personal claims, which are irrelevant to the fact that objective sources depict them as Sith Lords, and hence they fall under the jurisdiction of objective sources claiming that Palpatine is the most powerful Sith Lord of all time.And indeed, deviating from Sith ideology doesn't exclude them from being Sith. Traya says Nihilus does not care for Sith teachings but still refers to him as a Lord of the Sith (and herself, for that matter).
As I clarified, just noting the in game philosophical workings. She's not a Sith, and does not believe what they believe, but she carries the title nonetheless.
I'm assuming that this is a primarily fan-made denomination for the power, like Drain, rather than an official name.
😕 Just kinda confused as to how you can write an entire article about his drain and not understand the Hunger Power that drives it. As we know, the Force can be used for different purposes:
Nothing is impossible with the Force. It is an energy that flows through all living things. And like energy, it may be harnessed, channeled, and consumed at times. It may even be a substance that can burn and ignite. ...The sect of assassins that chase you feed on the Force... what he does is simply the pinnacle of what they could achieve, in time. -Kreia
So Force Energy can be used in various forms, and the way Nihilus and the Sith Assassins use it is to consume it and metabolize it into an energy source. Nihilus uses this "Hunger based energy" (vampiric energy) to perform various feats, and really it is integral to who he is as you will see:
The Force, she explains, fuels his hunger, and she will show him how to devour worlds.
-Star Wars KOTOR Campaign Guide
As noted in the Kreia quote, he consumes the Force. In the quote above, Force Energy fuels his hunger. Is the Hunger a Power Source?
His power is great, and it comes from hunger. He is a wound in the Force, more presence than flesh, and in his wake, life dies... sacrificing itself to his hunger.
-KOTOR 2
His power is great, and it comes from Hunger. Life dies and ceases when it is given to his hunger (metabolized).
Nothing matters except his hunger. Before it devours him totally, Nihilus uses its power to displace his persona into his robes and armor.
-Star Wars KOTOR Campaign Guide
It is a tangible power that can and is used to perform feats of power. As I showed in the programming notes, the energy of this drain is different than Force Energy. The idea of Vampirism is to consume, which is associated with hunger.
Originally posted by Geistalt
Doesn't mean Palps can't slaughter him with a lightsaber.
Nihilus is shown shielding his entire vessel from dozens of Turbolaser shots (5+ per second to be exact). I doubt Sidious' light saber is going to be a threat to him when this is applied to just his person, with no ship to hold together, and no crew to mentally dominate.
Originally posted by Miko Hacksaw
...continuing...Well, the Force Ability "Force of Will" defends against direct TK, but it doesn't against Force Lightning, Force Storms, Pyrokinesis, or objects thrown by TK among other things.
Force of Will amps a defender's ability to defend against focused and direct internal attacks on the person, yet doesn't defend against other things. So just because skills are "force powers" doesn't mean they all have equal avenues of defense.
In regard to Nihilus' drain, it can't be blocked because the ability is fueled by Hunger Power which is FED by FORCE ENERGY. Trying to use the Force to defend against his drain is like coating yourself with gasoline to defend against a fireball.
Nowhere did I say it can be blocked. That doesn't mean it'll kill instantly or something to that effect, though.
Where is this? I don't remember her using the Nihilus drain on Meetra. I think I recall her using Drain Force (which drains Force Energy) on Meetra but not the Nihilus drain.
The in-game script defines it as Drain Force, but the game animation is the same as the one she uses to kill the Masters.
Temp is also under the impression that the ability is Force Power based, meaning it is governed by the laws of Force Power/Energy when that is in fact false. His Hunger Power is anti-force.The idea that Sidious can "out-Force" Nihilus' attack is what is lacking legs, mainly because its an assertion in error. Nihilus's drain isn't Force Based, its anti-Force based. Its not like fighting an infection with white blood cells, its like fighting full blown AIDS with white blood cells.
Well, no, that's not the assertion to begin with. There's two separate assertions; that Sidious can bring to bear enough power to defeat Nihilus and kill him, and that Nihilus' Drain won't serve to end the fight against Sidious for the reasons outlined already.
Nobody said anything about using the Force to defeat Nihilus' Drain.
Still chewing on that bone? In all of the source texts we can find, the goal was exile, the plan was to drain her Force energy, and they succeeded. You really need to drop that because it is entirely false and misleading.
Well, no, because I showed you the quotes in my blog where Sion claims that they wanted to kill her and was surprised that she survived. All you did was continue to repeat yourself in denial of those. I addressed the quote from KotORCG about conspiring to drain her powers.
I don't remember the Assassins deploying direct drain on her, and if you're wanting to call the orange life siphoning power "drain" its actually Dark Healing. Nihilus uses it on her during their duel after his primary drain was nullified.This is flat out proof that Nihilus' unique drain is NOT the same as other Life Siphoning abilities.
Dark Healing and the like are all solely game mechanic terms and not canon, unless I'm mistaken.
Negative, the CG says she was reconnected to the Force through her Nexus bond with Meetra:What she finds is a ruined Jedi Order, and an enigmatic Jedi Master-Kreia, who also claims to have been stripped of her Force powers. Kreia's union with the Jedi Exile creates a vergence in the Force that reconnects them to the energy field surrounding all living things.
-SWKOTORCG, pg. 140
That's blatantly wrong because she says at the end of the game that nobody bar the Exile has truly been severed from the Force (and survived, at any rate). She's only had the Force stripped from her; she hasn't had the actual ties severed. We see her using the Force prior to encountering the Exile and TCSWE also states that she sensed the Exile from across the galaxy to discern her location.
No, his drain has TK effects and in that clip she was just sapped of her Force Energy. What you see with the artistic wiggle of the Saber is what is left of her Force Reserves after being severed (its meant to display her powerlessness). He is not aiming to kill her there.
The lightsaber wiggling is her attempting to call it to her hand and failing because she's lost her powers. Also, is there a basis for his Drain having TK effects? That might explain the destruction of the buildings in Unseen, Unheard.
A survivor he purposely left alive."I asked him why he had spared me. And though he said nothing, I suddenly knew the answer. It was because he wanted my people at last to see"
-Visas Marr, Unseen Unheard
Fair enough. Unless that refers to him finding her on Katarr after the fact and then choosing to keep her alive instead of killing her, but it's not that important either way.
Which really establishes nothing. In the other versions of how this goes down, he doesn't immediate drain them first either. He lifts the whole party up in a Force Choke, he throws Visas around, he roars, etc. The intent of the writers was not to have him instant-drain right off the bat. There's dialogue to be had.
Well, it's obvious that he's far more powerful than them, but either way, this is simply another instance in a list of scenarios where Nihilus does attacks the defenseless with Drain.
They're standing up ready to defend. I don't know why you're saying they're incapacitated during the attack.(sorry if you've responded since this, still dealing with an energetic baby lol)
I said in the script, which mentions her Choking and Crushing the Jedi Masters, which would render them helpless. In the game, they just stand there, but the game depiction is filled with bugs and she still has "prep time" so to speak.
Drain Force is invisible. Force Drain has the orange animation. All life siphoning abilities have this animation, unless you have evidence that there's a form of life siphoning that doesn't in this media?
Right, but the Drain Force she uses on the Exile in the DS version is the orange spaghetti attack. Unless you think this is another programming error, but the bugs tend to be those of omission, not altered mechanics.
Down to game mechanics that never show them using the direct channeled form against Meetra or anyone else. We understand the Aura effect, but Meetra isn't effected by Nihilus' direct attack form, not even his Aura.
The KotORCG suggests that the Exile's immunity was specific to Nihilus alone. Kreia also suggests that the Assassins' techniques work on the Exile.
As I clarified, just noting the in game philosophical workings. She's not a Sith, and does not believe what they believe, but she carries the title nonetheless.
In either case, Palpatine's quotes apply to the both of them.
Sever Force in regard to the normal Jedi ability, creates a wall of light. That's obviously not what's being done here. There's other abilities on the Dark Side that are "Sever Force" type, like in the NJO materials, and I think Vitiate as well. But those aren't what Nihilus does.That hunger feeds on their reserves at such a rate that it destroys the connections as you know. This is not normal force energy, in fact the programming notes differentiate it by calling it "Vampiric Energy":
"[As Nihilus reaches out with his power, he drains the player with vampiric energy, and then suddenly reels back, collapsing on the ground.]"
-KOTOR 2, dialog.tlk file.This is because it is Hunger Power that is being used to deploy the ability, not normal Force Power.
You're mixing drains and failing to differentiate between them.
The drain is fueled by Hunger Power, and creates voids in the Force when deployed. Both he and the Assassins use this drain type that Kreia speaks about. I refer to it being "unique" because it is not like the other abilities that are purely Force Energy driven.As noted in the Kreia quote, he consumes the Force. In the quote above, Force Energy fuels his hunger. Is the Hunger a Power Source?
His power is great, and it comes from Hunger. Life dies and ceases when it is given to his hunger (metabolized).
It is a tangible power that can and is used to perform feats of power. As I showed in the programming notes, the energy of this drain is different than Force Energy. The idea of Vampirism is to consume, which is associated with hunger.
I think the problem here is that KotOR II is producing an unprecedented concept which is leading to differing interpretations. The thing is that the hunger is usually referred to separately from the Force, but you're making the mistake of assuming that the hunger is entirely absent of the Force. That's wrong. Just because the attack results in the consumption of Force energy doesn't mean that the attack doesn't originate from the Force itself. Just because the Force fuels it doesn't mean it's independent of the Force either. Sometimes "vampiric" and "hunger" are just used to describe the nature of the attack and don't actually exclude it from the Force altogether. Your analogies about fire and gasoline don't work because you can't use something like fire or gasoline to adequately represent the Force. I have to go now, so I don't have time to explain it properly (what I said might come off as absolute gibberish) but the point is that his hunger and the Force are not mutually exclusive.
She mentions that the technique is "touched by the dark side" and that "it is something of the dark side":
"You give others strength to act, but it is also possible to draw upon the strength of others to increase your own. It is similar to drawing upon the Force as Jedi do, but when it is touched by the power of the dark side... it is something else, something deadly. These Sith we face... they have learned how to do this. It is a technique that has been lost for some time, not seen in the days since the ancient Sith. They can use it to consume other Force Sensitives - and at the highest pinnacle of power, use it to consume anything that lives. They draw upon the connections in the Force, and devour it."-- Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords
"It is something the Sith, the assassins that stalk us, can do- it is of the dark side, the ability to feed on life, the Force, the closer one comes to it. It makes them stronger - for a time."-- Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords
And, of course, the attack which has no defense (the one he used on Traya) is of the Force:
"There are techniques within the Force against which there is no defense."-- Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords
I'm not sure if I said this in one of my previous posts, but it's supposed to be more ironic than something devoid of the Force altogether. Regardless, this is a technique and attack very much derived of and from within the Force; it simply results in the devouring of Force/life energy as well.