The Battle for the Title: Jane Thor vs Thor

Originally posted by celeyhyga17

For phucks sake this tale is as old as time. I shouldn't even be repeating this.
“Whosoever holds this hammer, if he(she) be worthy, shall possess the power of Thor.”_
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-LyxPXX8jw...7_21%2Bcopy.jpg

Uru is naturally mystical and is "virtually unbreakable".
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-5TWuYvJR...600/066_007.jpg

Thor has molded ure into a hammer.
http://imgur.com/ltJfkMy.jpg
http://imgur.com/wdv0YKk.jpg

He's crumbled "ultra-powerful" uru manacles into dust.
http://imgur.com/Hh6pGM7.jpg
http://imgur.com/a0Tub2E.jpg

I don't know if they were secondary, but I did mention they were called adamantium alloy. The scan made it know clearly known they were incredibly strong. "Strongest metal known to man".
http://imgur.com/jFzmVum.jpg
http://imgur.com/zqNffNg.jpg

He pushed against the "will" of the World Tree. To lowball such a feat is flat out absurd._

The Midgard Serpent's natural size is such that its coils can encircle the earth. Sometimes depicted in such a way that it can encircle it many times over. Even in ethereal form, its enormous size/mass was considerable enough to cause gravitational disturbances throughout the planet as evidenced by countless natural disasters. It has also been said that it retains its full "weight and power" no matter what form or size it takes due to its ability to shape shift. And just for your information, the wordethereal_also means unearthly or heavenly.

Feats with Mjolnir can also strength feats. You're good at math right? Use it.
For example... During the godbomb, how much strength was Thor exerting when he was cracking planets while pounding on Gorr vs to how much strength he was using when he pounding on Gorr earlier in the arc, but was not cracking planets?? Get me now. An attempt to dismiss such feats is an attempt to be ignorant.

Read some Jane Thor because even she is not invulnerable to the all powerful low showing. Believe me... She has them just like any top tier. Think on that before you proclaim to know what her average is.

That does not mean Mjolnir didn't grant Jane strength greater than Odinson. Remember it was beyond Odin himself. And her being stronger is supported by her feat against Odin and the adamantium doors.

UnInchanted Uru is fairly weak in comparison to adamantium. It has been broken and damaged many times by power under Skyfather level.

Uru durability Is dependent upon the magical force in it. For example, Destroyer is typically more durable than Mjolnir. Yet KT made Mjolnir decapitate the destroyer.

So no magical force = fairly weak metal (in comparison to true adamantium).

The mountain contained Uru (it wasn't completely made out of Uru).
Remember Mjolnir was fashioned out of Uru. If it was indestructible then it couldn't be shaped.

An alloy of adamantium is not adamantium itself. Plus you see that the majority of the weave was made of some other material (a small portion was adamantium).

We simply do not know how much forcd it took to turn the wheels. How is that lowballing? It's the truth. We do not know the mechanics of the whole magical system.

Ethereal means light and airy. It was believed that angels and God and spirits were immaterial beings. So heavenly implies airy and spirit like.

Anyway the serpent was intangible to everyone on earth. No one bumped into it. It was magically crushing the Earth. Also the boat helped.

We simply do not know how much strength Thor supplied in the God butcher feat. We can assume a minimum amount though. My point is that Thor's strength did not achieve 100% of the feat but a fraction of it.
But I stand corrected, it can be used as a strength feat. But an unquantifiable one.

Finally, you are using very old feats. Thor's beginning appearances, Although Canon, hold very little weight to Thor's average strength. Current showings hold more weight than old showings. Thus Thor, currently isn't as strong as his top feats in the distant past.

The nail in the coffin is the fact that Jane did something that Odinson failed to do with significant help. This single fact proves that she is stronger.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Is this a bait thread? Odinson is his last name. Thor is his title he chose not to lift Ult Mjolnir and Fury/Gorr mindphucked him. Jane is a fill in just like Masterson, Norvell, Tarene. Every title character has their title usurped Cap, Batman, Spiderman, Superman, Wonder Woman there are a million Laterns (well lanterns dont count) but at the end of the day it always comes back to the OG.

Are you asking who jas the best average? Odinson. Best highs? Odinson. Better fighter, more durable, better damage soak? Odinson. Who has fought a beaten a higher pedigree of opponents? Odinson. Just because Marvel did a soft retcon and made the hammer sentient, moody and sexist doesnt cast aside decades of feats. Nor does it "flying for her better than him" prove anything. I recently read an article where its stated Cho has the potential to be a stronger Hulk than Banner. Does that make Cho a better Hulk than Banner? No. Hes just the flavor of the month.

Originally posted by h1a8
That does not mean Mjolnir didn't grant Jane strength greater than Odinson. Remember it was beyond Odin himself. And her being stronger is supported by her feat against Odin and the adamantium doors.

UnInchanted Uru is fairly weak in comparison to adamantium. It has been broken and damaged many times by power under Skyfather level.

Uru durability Is dependent upon the magical force in it. For example, Destroyer is typically more durable than Mjolnir. Yet KT made Mjolnir decapitate the destroyer.

So no magical force = fairly weak metal (in comparison to true adamantium).

The mountain contained Uru (it wasn't completely made out of Uru).
Remember Mjolnir was fashioned out of Uru. If it was indestructible then it couldn't be shaped.

An alloy of adamantium is not adamantium itself. Plus you see that the majority of the weave was made of some other material (a small portion was adamantium).

You can make all kinds of claims regarding unenchanted uru, but I already posted a scan of how highly Marvel thinks of plain uru. "Virtually unbreakable" as per Marvel. In fact, Cap's shield has been stated to be even better than before when it received its uru upgrade after Fear Itself.

And no one disputing that fashioned uru is generally more durable. Not sure why u keep repeating it. And those uru manacles that he easily ground to dust was forged by Thor himself. It's no surprise that you completely ignored the uru manacles which was stated to be ultra-powerful.

Like I said it was adamantium alloy, but still strong as hell judging by how the comic emphasized that bit of info. Also it's a little comical how u came up with "small portion of adamantium".
😂

Originally posted by h1a8

We simply do not know how much forcd it took to turn the wheels. How is that lowballing? It's the truth. We do not know the mechanics of the whole magical system.

Ethereal means light and airy. It was believed that angels and God and spirits were immaterial beings. So heavenly implies airy and spirit like.

Anyway the serpent was intangible to everyone on earth. No one bumped into it. It was magically crushing the Earth. Also the boat helped.

We simply do not know how much strength Thor supplied in the God butcher feat. We can assume a minimum amount though. My point is that Thor's strength did not achieve 100% of the feat but a fraction of it.
But I stand corrected, it can be used as a strength feat. But an unquantifiable one.

Finally, you are using very old feats. Thor's beginning appearances, Although Canon, hold very little weight to Thor's average strength. Current showings hold more weight than old showings. Thus Thor, currently isn't as strong as his top feats in the distant past.

The nail in the coffin is the fact that Jane did something that Odinson failed to do with significant help. This single fact proves that she is stronger.

The Serpent being ethereal is inconsequential in regards to the magnitude of the feat. It has been stated in multiple comics and various bios that Jormugand's true size is such that its coils can encircle the earth.

Here in Thor 272.
http://imgur.com/MCi4wRH.jpg

Here in Thor 380.
http://imgur.com/p82FYCo.jpg
http://imgur.com/pqNxWpP.jpg

Jormugand causes natural disasters.
http://imgur.com/X9e07Oe.jpg
Official Bio corroborates Jormugand's sheer size even in ethereal form, to be substantial enough to cause all kinds of natural disasters. It also shows that he keeps his "full weight and power" no matter what form he takes.
http://imgur.com/zJ0kiCe.jpg
http://imgur.com/bxXqjaN.jpg

I can go on with more proof of his size, but I think you get the picture.

No one is denying that the hammer contributes to his striking power. But it's really simple to explain the scene. He supplied enough strength to indirectly shatter planets to the point that he was cracking a far off world. Planets don't simply start breaking apart when he hammers opponents. The hammer didn't all of a sudden receive a massive upgrade. What was dynamic is the amount of strength he was supplying.
Hell the writer himself(Jason Aaron) made no secret that Thor being incredibly strong was pretty much the main factor in the "world shattering scenes".
😂
http://imgur.com/3VVTtCQ.jpg

Some feats may be old, but it's still his feats. They are canon to him. You can't just dismiss feats because you don't like them. Plus you just finished accepted him indirectly cracking planets as a strength feat. That's modern day stuff. 😬

Odinson will bury Jane in strength feats. It's a simple fact. Hell it was stated that he was in a severely weakened state after he lost Mjolnir to Jane. In their one and only fight, he was not outclassed. Far from it to be honest. They seemed in equal footing.

Originally posted by Horrificus
thank you

Wow!!! Long time no see.

Originally posted by h1a8
That does not mean Mjolnir didn't grant Jane strength greater than Odinson. Remember it was beyond Odin himself. And her being stronger is supported by her feat against Odin and the adamantium doors.

UnInchanted Uru is fairly weak in comparison to adamantium. It has been broken and damaged many times by power under Skyfather level.

Uru durability Is dependent upon the magical force in it. For example, Destroyer is typically more durable than Mjolnir. Yet KT made Mjolnir decapitate the destroyer.

So no magical force = fairly weak metal (in comparison to true adamantium).

The mountain contained Uru (it wasn't completely made out of Uru).
Remember Mjolnir was fashioned out of Uru. If it was indestructible then it couldn't be shaped.

An alloy of adamantium is not adamantium itself. Plus you see that the majority of the weave was made of some other material (a small portion was adamantium).

We simply do not know how much forcd it took to turn the wheels. How is that lowballing? It's the truth. We do not know the mechanics of the whole magical system.

Ethereal means light and airy. It was believed that angels and God and spirits were immaterial beings. So heavenly implies airy and spirit like.

Anyway the serpent was intangible to everyone on earth. No one bumped into it. It was magically crushing the Earth. Also the boat helped.

We simply do not know how much strength Thor supplied in the God butcher feat. We can assume a minimum amount though. My point is that Thor's strength did not achieve 100% of the feat but a fraction of it.
But I stand corrected, it can be used as a strength feat. But an unquantifiable one.

Finally, you are using very old feats. Thor's beginning appearances, Although Canon, hold very little weight to Thor's average strength. Current showings hold more weight than old showings. Thus Thor, currently isn't as strong as his top feats in the distant past.

The nail in the coffin is the fact that Jane did something that Odinson failed to do with significant help. This single fact proves that she is stronger.

Hulk crushed enchanted Uru that was said to be equal to Mjlonir.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/7/79470/2866151-hulk_break_nul_hammer.jpg

Nul*.

And where did it say that it was equal to Mjolnir.

No one said it was equal to Mjolnir, and given its a serpent enchanted hammer vs an Odin enchanted hammer, there's a difference in quality. Not to mention Hulk was amped to the teeth.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Nul*.

And where did it say that it was equal to Mjolnir.

Hulk was said to be as strong as hulk, not stronger than hulk.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
The hammer like all those before her, grants the power of Thor. It is the platform from which she performs her superhuman feats. If u have proof that no longer provides the power of Thor please go ahead and show us.
Mjolnir(Mother Storm) is not beyond Odin. He imprison the damned thing for crying out loud. If u can provide proof that it is > Odin, be my guest. You best believe that stance will only make you look more foolish.

You can make all kinds of claims regarding unenchanted uru, but I already posted a scan of how highly Marvel thinks of plain uru. "Virtually unbreakable" as per Marvel. In fact, Cap's shield has been stated to be even better than before when it received its uru upgrade after Fear Itself.

And no one disputing that fashioned uru is generally more durable. Not sure why u keep repeating it. And those uru manacles that he easily ground to dust was forged by Thor himself. It's no surprise that you completely ignored the uru manacles which was stated to be ultra-powerful.

Like I said it was adamantium alloy, but still strong as hell judging by how the comic emphasized that bit of info. Also it's a little comical how u came up with "small portion of adamantium".
😂

The World Tree is the cosmological centerpiece of the Asgardian mythos. It governs the nine(ten) realms and makes them go round. To assign such trivial figures like 200 tons smacks of ignorance. In fact didn't u once say the engine was human made technology? 😂

The Serpent being ethereal is inconsequential in regards to the magnitude of the feat. It has been stated in multiple comics and various bios that Jormugand's true size is such that its coils can encircle the earth.

Here in Thor 272.
http://imgur.com/MCi4wRH.jpg

Here in Thor 380.
http://imgur.com/p82FYCo.jpg
http://imgur.com/pqNxWpP.jpg

Jormugand causes natural disasters.
http://imgur.com/X9e07Oe.jpg
Official Bio corroborates Jormugand's sheer size even in ethereal form, to be substantial enough to cause all kinds of natural disasters. It also shows that he keeps his "full weight and power" no matter what form he takes.
http://imgur.com/zJ0kiCe.jpg
http://imgur.com/bxXqjaN.jpg

I can go on with more proof of his size, but I think you get the picture.

No one is denying that the hammer contributes to his striking power. But it's really simple to explain the scene. He supplied enough strength to indirectly shatter planets to the point that he was cracking a far off world. Planets don't simply start breaking apart when he hammers opponents. The hammer didn't all of a sudden receive a massive upgrade. What was dynamic is the amount of strength he was supplying.
Hell the writer himself(Jason Aaron) made no secret that Thor being incredibly strong was pretty much the main factor in the "world shattering scenes".
😂
http://imgur.com/3VVTtCQ.jpg

Some feats may be old, but it's still his feats. They are canon to him. You can't just dismiss feats because you don't like them. Plus you just finished accepted him indirectly cracking planets as a strength feat. That's modern day stuff. 😬

Odinson will bury Jane in strength feats. It's a simple fact. Hell it was stated that he was in a severely weakened state after he lost Mjolnir to Jane. In their one and only fight, he was not outclassed. Far from it to be honest. They seemed in equal footing.

You forgot to mention Serpent had her dead to rights. But good post 😉

Originally posted by carver9
Hulk was said to be as strong as hulk, not stronger than hulk.

Meant to say Nul.

Originally posted by Damborgson
No one said it was equal to Mjolnir, and given its a serpent enchanted hammer vs an Odin enchanted hammer, there's a difference in quality. Not to mention Hulk was amped to the teeth.

the strength of uru is dependent on the enchantments. the more enchantments, the harder the metal. if you look back at thor's feats with the hammer, the sheer number of enchantments on it are ludicrous, hence why it is so hard. by comparison, the serpent hammers would have no where NEAR the number of enchantments--at least that we saw--so one can only assume the uru wouldn't be nearly as hard. unenchanted uru is pretty soft and easily scratched and molded. /shrug

iow--the 2 hammers shouldn't really have been close in terms of indestructibility. or more to the point--hulk's being able to crush the serpent hammer=/=him being able to crush mjolnir. not even close, tbh.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
The hammer like all those before her, grants the power of Thor. It is the platform from which she performs her superhuman feats. If u have proof that no longer provides the power of Thor please go ahead and show us.
Mjolnir(Mother Storm) is not beyond Odin. He imprison the damned thing for crying out loud. If u can provide proof that it is > Odin, be my guest. You best believe that stance will only make you look more foolish.

You can make all kinds of claims regarding unenchanted uru, but I already posted a scan of how highly Marvel thinks of plain uru. "Virtually unbreakable" as per Marvel. In fact, Cap's shield has been stated to be even better than before when it received its uru upgrade after Fear Itself.

And no one disputing that fashioned uru is generally more durable. Not sure why u keep repeating it. And those uru manacles that he easily ground to dust was forged by Thor himself. It's no surprise that you completely ignored the uru manacles which was stated to be ultra-powerful.

Like I said it was adamantium alloy, but still strong as hell judging by how the comic emphasized that bit of info. Also it's a little comical how u came up with "small portion of adamantium".
😂

The World Tree is the cosmological centerpiece of the Asgardian mythos. It governs the nine(ten) realms and makes them go round. To assign such trivial figures like 200 tons smacks of ignorance. In fact didn't u once say the engine was human made technology? 😂

The Serpent being ethereal is inconsequential in regards to the magnitude of the feat. It has been stated in multiple comics and various bios that Jormugand's true size is such that its coils can encircle the earth.

Here in Thor 272.
http://imgur.com/MCi4wRH.jpg

Here in Thor 380.
http://imgur.com/p82FYCo.jpg
http://imgur.com/pqNxWpP.jpg

Jormugand causes natural disasters.
http://imgur.com/X9e07Oe.jpg
Official Bio corroborates Jormugand's sheer size even in ethereal form, to be substantial enough to cause all kinds of natural disasters. It also shows that he keeps his "full weight and power" no matter what form he takes.
http://imgur.com/zJ0kiCe.jpg
http://imgur.com/bxXqjaN.jpg

I can go on with more proof of his size, but I think you get the picture.

No one is denying that the hammer contributes to his striking power. But it's really simple to explain the scene. He supplied enough strength to indirectly shatter planets to the point that he was cracking a far off world. Planets don't simply start breaking apart when he hammers opponents. The hammer didn't all of a sudden receive a massive upgrade. What was dynamic is the amount of strength he was supplying.
Hell the writer himself(Jason Aaron) made no secret that Thor being incredibly strong was pretty much the main factor in the "world shattering scenes".
😂
http://imgur.com/3VVTtCQ.jpg

Some feats may be old, but it's still his feats. They are canon to him. You can't just dismiss feats because you don't like them. Plus you just finished accepted him indirectly cracking planets as a strength feat. That's modern day stuff. 😬

Odinson will bury Jane in strength feats. It's a simple fact. Hell it was stated that he was in a severely weakened state after he lost Mjolnir to Jane. In their one and only fight, he was not outclassed. Far from it to be honest. They seemed in equal footing.

The hammer does not follow Odin's enchantment anymore. It does what it wants. It has the power to grant strength stronger than Thor.
Being able to physically beat down Odin is proof that she is stronger.

Marvel is made of many writers with different opinions.
Steel is virtually indestructible. So is titanium. So is carbonanium, etc.
Those statements means absolutely nothing. That's why we go by feats to prove durability.

The fact that Uru can be easily shaped and fashioned means it is not nearly indestructible as you believe. Thor himself has broken Mjolnir with strength. Yet Odin was stronger and Jane beat him down.

I never dismissed his older feats. They just don't add much weight as his current feats. The Godbutcher feat is a good feat. No doubt about it.
But it's not as great as you think. Thor hit Gorr many times. The totality of all hits created the feat.

Anyway I say Jane beating down Odin is a greater strength feat.

Of course the Serpent is huge. I'm not debating its size. Just that is was mostly in ghostly form. I read somewhere (I think a bio) that only the head materialized. It's been a long time.

Thor will bury Jane in strength feats? Name one strength feat that's superior to physically beating down Odin or ripping adamantium/vibranium.

Jane did not beat Odin, and Odin was not in his peak power of full odinforce. The fight dont mean she is stronger than Thor.

Can you prove that Odin was at skyfather level in that fight?

Originally posted by h1a8
The hammer does not follow Odin's enchantment anymore. It does what it wants. It has the power to grant strength stronger than Thor.
Being able to physically beat down Odin is proof that she is stronger.

Marvel is made of many writers with different opinions.
Steel is virtually indestructible. So is titanium. So is carbonanium, etc.
Those statements means absolutely nothing. That's why we go by feats to prove durability.

The fact that Uru can be easily shaped and fashioned means it is not nearly indestructible as you believe. Thor himself has broken Mjolnir with strength. Yet Odin was stronger and Jane beat him down.

I never dismissed his older feats. They just don't add much weight as his current feats. The Godbutcher feat is a good feat. No doubt about it.
But it's not as great as you think. Thor hit Gorr many times. The totality of all hits created the feat.

Anyway I say Jane beating down Odin is a greater strength feat.

Of course the Serpent is huge. I'm not debating its size. Just that is was mostly in ghostly form. I read somewhere (I think a bio) that only the head materialized. It's been a long time.

Thor will bury Jane in strength feats? Name one strength feat that's superior to physically beating down Odin or ripping adamantium/vibranium.

I don't blame you for not having read any of the new Thor, but it's been heavily implied that Mjolnir doesn't obey Odin anymore because he no longer has the Odin Force, not because it's superseded him or something. And, the god tempest doesn't give strength, Jane still has Thor's physical stats.

Originally posted by eaebiakuya
Jane did not beat Odin, and Odin was not in his peak power of full odinforce. The fight dont mean she is stronger than Thor.

Can you prove that Odin was at skyfather level in that fight?

Originally posted by Khazra Reborn
I don't blame you for not having read any of the new Thor, but it's been heavily implied that Mjolnir doesn't obey Odin anymore because he no longer has the Odin Force, not because it's superseded him or something. And, the god tempest doesn't give strength, Jane still has Thor's physical stats.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Where is it shown that Odin is not at full power?

It hasn't been explicitly stated yet, just implied.

Where?

He also failed to lift Mjolnir and heal his wife (old king thor was able to revive a Death Thor with Odin force, same writer).

Also, in Loki Agent of Asgard(just before Secret Wars), he was without Odinforce:

http://imgur.com/a/bUOgc

After that he never show any sign or feat that require Odin force.

Originally posted by eaebiakuya

He also failed to lift Mjolnir and heal his wife (old king thor was able to revive a Death Thor with Odin force, same writer).

Also, in Loki Agent of Asgard, he was without Odinforce:

http://imgur.com/a/bUOgc

King Thor had better mastery of Odinforce seeing how he had it for longer than Odin.

Agent of Asgard was a specific scenario. Not that Odin was permanently Depowered.

It mean he was stronger than he is now. If that is not weakened, it is what?

What specific scenario?

And who said it is permanently? It just dont comeback yet. After this issue was never said the he had it again (or, again, he never did any feat that require full odinforce).

Old King Thor, for example, was without it for 900 years.