Sunny vs Miyagi

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. Except Miyagi was never shown to counter someone of Sunny's skill and speed. After all, Miyagi never launched a counter attack after catching that arrow yes?

2. Who said anything about last minute? I'm talking changing angles in mid attack, which can be done as long as you don't over commit.

1. Skill of attacker is irrelevant to countering his thrown attack. Sunny can't attack as fast as an arrow. And it takes less speed to defend than the attack itself.

2. You said "last minute" in your post. This is impossible. You can't change the trajectory of a true attack once it's launched.

Originally posted by h1a8
1. Skill of attacker is irrelevant to countering his thrown attack. Sunny can't attack as fast as an arrow. And it takes less speed to defend than the attack itself.

2. You said "last minute" in your post. This is impossible. You can't change the trajectory of a true attack once it's launched.

1. Except Miyagi never counter attacked an arrow. He simply caught it, no counter attack. So your point is moot.

2. You're right, I guess I did say that. I still stand by it. Fighters can change attacks last minute especially if they had planned to do it in the first place. A right cross can be turned into an elbow hit. A knee strike can turn into a front kick or teep, or even a short kick to the knee. A jab can be tucked in last minute and turned into a headbutt, etc. Arrows do not do these things.

Originally posted by FrothByte
2. You're right, I guess I did say that. I still stand by it. Fighters can change attacks last minute especially if they had planned to do it in the first place. A right cross can be turned into an elbow hit. A knee strike can turn into a front kick or teep, or even a short kick to the knee. A jab can be tucked in last minute and turned into a headbutt, etc. Arrows do not do these things.

A teep can even be used as a fake-out to go for a spinning elbow. Instead of actually carrying through with the teep, step past and spin into a strike. Some Thai fighters do this to great effect, because their opponent drops a hand to fend off the thrust kick, and takes an elbow to the jaw instead.

Guys, I have a solution.

OP for every match simply must put a rule that states "Only screen feats count"

h1 will either stop posting altogether or be unequivocably wrong every time...again.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
A teep can even be used as a fake-out to go for a spinning elbow. Instead of actually carrying through with the teep, step past and spin into a strike. Some Thai fighters do this to great effect, because their opponent drops a hand to fend off the thrust kick, and takes an elbow to the jaw instead.

Yes, I've seen that done before. Even with roundhouse kicks that turn into spinning back fists or elbows. And we're not even including feints.

Originally posted by h1a8
1. Skill of attacker is irrelevant to countering his thrown attack. Sunny can't attack as fast as an arrow. And it takes less speed to defend than the attack itself.

2. You said "last minute" in your post. This is impossible. You can't change the trajectory of a true attack once it's launched.

1) What is stopping Sunny from countering Miyagi's counter?

2) I see, you've never been in a fight or had any fight training.

Originally posted by KingD19
Guys, I have a solution.

OP for every match simply must put a rule that states "Only screen feats count"

h1 will either stop posting altogether or be unequivocably wrong every time...again.

"Only screen feats count" is already a forum rule, it hasn't stopped h1 from trolling.

Originally posted by Silent Master
1) What is stopping Sunny from countering Miyagi's counter?

2) I see, you've never been in a fight or had any fight training.

"Only screen feats count" is already a forum rule, it hasn't stopped h1 from trolling.

Originally posted by h1a8
He won't be recovered. He will still be extended going forward.

I've studied MA for several years.

Everything I used for Miyagi was on screen feats. His arrow catching, his breaking the bottles, his shown ability to counter.

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. Except Miyagi never counter attacked an arrow. He simply caught it, no counter attack. So your point is moot.

2. You're right, I guess I did say that. I still stand by it. Fighters can change attacks last minute especially if they had planned to do it in the first place. A right cross can be turned into an elbow hit. A knee strike can turn into a front kick or teep, or even a short kick to the knee. A jab can be tucked in last minute and turned into a headbutt, etc. Arrows do not do these things.

So you mean feints and fakes? Miyagi should deal with those. But Sunny didn't fight like this for the most part. He was straight forward in nearly all of his fights.

Originally posted by h1a8
But he countered attacks though.

So you mean feints and fakes? Miyagi should deal with those. But Sunny didn't fight like this for the most part. He was straight forward in nearly all of his fights.

1. He never countered any attacks as fast or as strong as Sunny's strikes.

2. No, I haven't even gotten to feints and fakes, though we could add those too. I'm talking about full, legitimate attacks that fighters can't change or redirect midway through.

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. He never countered any attacks as fast or as strong as Sunny's strikes.

2. No, I haven't even gotten to feints and fakes, though we could add those too. I'm talking about full, legitimate attacks that fighters can't change or redirect midway through.

Sorry, correction on 2:

No, I haven't even gotten to feints and fakes, though we could add those too. I'm talking about full, legitimate attacks that fighters can change or redirect midway through.

Originally posted by h1a8
I posted the reason on the other page.

I've studied MA for several years.

Everything I used for Miyagi was on screen feats. His arrow catching, his breaking the bottles, his shown ability to counter.

As I can post dozens of clips where Sunny counters attacks your reason basically boils down to, because I said so. No, everything you used is your massively biased interpretation of what is shown.

BTW, nobody believes you had any training.

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. He never countered any attacks as fast or as strong as Sunny's strikes.

2. No, I haven't even gotten to feints and fakes, though we could add those too. I'm talking about full, legitimate attacks that fighters can't change or redirect midway through.

1. He has proven super handspeed. He has proven reflexes. He has proven skill to know how to counter. These prove that he can.

2. Although I can still rebut this, Sunny doesn't fight like that. So this argument is irrelevant.

Originally posted by Silent Master
As I can post dozens of clips where Sunny counters attacks your reason basically boils down to, because I said so. No, everything you used is your massively biased interpretation of what is shown.

BTW, nobody believes you had any training.

I'm using deductive arguments based off screen feats.
Miyagi has super hand speed, reflexes, and know how to counter.
This proves he can counter Sunny.
The problem you are still facing is that you are still imagining Miyagi not being fast enough because of acting speed.

Are there no mods here or do they just allow blatant trolling because they're bored?

Originally posted by h1a8
1. He has proven super handspeed. He has proven reflexes. He has proven skill to know how to counter. These prove that he can.

2. Although I can still rebut this, Sunny doesn't fight like that. So this argument is irrelevant.

I'm using deductive arguments based off screen feats.
Miyagi has super hand speed, reflexes, and know how to counter.
This proves he can counter Sunny.
The problem you are still facing is that you are still imagining Miyagi not being fast enough because of acting speed.

The problem you are still facing is that you somehow believe that Sunny, despite being both faster and more skilled will be unable to counter Miyagi. If the slower and less skilled Miyagi can counter Sunny, then the faster and more skilled Sunny will have an even easier time countering Miyagi.

Originally posted by Nevan
Are there no mods here or do they just allow blatant trolling because they're bored?

Originally posted by Silent Master
The problem you are still facing is that you somehow believe that Sunny, despite being both faster and more skilled will be unable to counter Miyagi. If the slower and less skilled Miyagi can counter Sunny, then the faster and more skilled Sunny will have an even easier time countering Miyagi.

Originally posted by h1a8
1. He has proven super handspeed. He has proven reflexes. He has proven skill to know how to counter. These prove that he can.

2. Although I can still rebut this, Sunny doesn't fight like that. So this argument is irrelevant.

1. You need more than handspeed to do a proper counter, and again, Miyagi has no feat to prove he can counter someone as fast and strong as Sunny.

2. You must not have watched the shows at all.

Originally posted by h1a8
Sunny can definitely counter Miyagi if Miyagi attacks first. Miyagi would surely lose too.

So if Sunny attacks first, he isn't allowed to defend himself? IOW, he'll just stand there and let Miyagi do whatever he wants?

Originally posted by Silent Master
So if Sunny attacks first, he isn't allowed to defend himself? IOW, he'll just stand there and let Miyagi do whatever he wants?

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. You need more than handspeed to do a proper counter, and again, Miyagi has no feat to prove he can counter someone as fast and strong as Sunny.

2. You must not have watched the shows at all.

You need handspeed, reflexes, and know how (skill).

I've seen all of the shows.