Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So is Cap essentially like Superman of the streets then?
That's exactly what he is.
A Juggernaut fan by the name of Cain Marco on another board used to call it the "Cap factor". For example, someone like Spidey, who regularly tangles with 50-100 tonners, marvels at Cap's haymaker and compares it to an atom bomb: Cap factor. 😉
Originally posted by cdtm
That's exactly what he is.A Juggernaut fan by the name of Cain Marco on another board used to call it the "Cap factor". For example, someone like Spidey, who regularly tangles with 50-100 tonners, marvels at Cap's haymaker and compares it to an atom bomb: Cap factor. 😉
Nowadays Cap factor means CIS-white male factor. Which means he is an evil Nazi.
Phucking Marvel. What a shit company.
Originally posted by riv6672
You didnt negate my point.
His adaptation is due to the SS.
Taking out that guy is due to superior physical stats, the SS.Pure skill wise, he's not as technical as Dragon.
Thanks for responding after i egged you in a bit though. 👆
huh? that makes no sense. he isn't skilled because of the serum. he's faster and stronger but had learned the skills, same as any one has.
and you can't have it both ways then--he beat spidey who is faster and stronger than he is. not to mention namor, done well vs hulk via nerve strikes, etc...
and you MAY be right--he may not be as technical as dragon (who has precious few showings to own up to his rep) but the degree of difference wouldn't be as great as you think imo.
when he was skinny, sickly rogers, steve took out multiple super soldiers. as old man rogers he took out his son ian who'd made the avengers look like children. he's got plenty of showings that demonstrate his skills as being FAR beyond that basic comment that was made 40 years ago. /shrug
Originally posted by cdtm
Cassie was established as >>> Batman.Bruce himself admitted it.
"What would you have done if you fought her for real?"
"...I'd lose."
in some cases it appears that way, in others bats has done just fine against her though. and for that matter, bats admitted cap would beat him too, so there's that. /shrug
i've never understood the whole "cap isn't super skilled" thing. he's got plenty of showings that indicate otherwise.
Originally posted by leonidas
in some cases it appears that way, in others bats has done just fine against her though. and for that matter, bats admitted cap would beat him too, so there's that. /shrugi've never understood the whole "cap isn't super skilled" thing. he's got plenty of showings that indicate otherwise.
No one's saying he isn't skilled. Just that he's not the apex of skill.
It's the same reasoning T'challa gave comparing Danny to Shang Chi, with the former having far superior chi reserves, but lesser skill. Just substitite chi for super soldier serum enhanced stats..
Originally posted by CosmicComet
You can be super skilled and use more basic techniques too.Being a good fighter just means being a good fighter. It doesnt mean being flashy.
Early Ippo against the black guy. How many times did his coach say his opponent is more skilled then him?
Good thing Ippo can take a punch.
Originally posted by cdtm
No one's saying he isn't skilled. Just that he's not the apex of skill.It's the same reasoning T'challa gave comparing Danny to Shang Chi, with the former having far superior chi reserves, but lesser skill. Just substitite chi for super soldier serum enhanced stats..
i can get behind that sort of, though i'm not sure the danny/shang thing holds up under direct scrutiny. in that sense though, it's REALLY impossible to say danny is more skilled than cap since according to what you just said, BOTH have enhancements.
for that matter, cassie is also enhanced. people seem to want to credit the serum for rogers' showings, while at the same time ignoring enhancements in others that ALSO translate to increased perceived skill. matt has radar to aid him, a huge enhancement. bp has his suit and the herbs, plus whatever idiotic enhancements he has as kotd. even shang is chi enhanced. all of those things translate into increased speed and power for those guys, so why is rogers being dinged when none of the others are? at best we can then say they are all roughly equal, and at worst we have no idea how they would ACTUALLY fare against each other. they are ALL superhuman. and that superhumanity contributes to ALL their skill levels. taking that a step further, it would mean dc's ma guys really ARE far superior to marvel's since people like bats and shiva and dragon and bronze tiger and dick really have NO enhancements to speak of at all....
Originally posted by leonidas
cool scene. sounds like a thanos-esque retcon where we assume any loss she had was because she was "playing some roll". by that reasoning do we assume she is >>>cassie and dragon too? definitely a good showing but i'd love to see the rematch. bats has had his a$$ handed to him several times, but usually makes up for it in the next showing. not enough for me to say she is TWICE as good as cap/bats, at least not without more proof. /shrug
Originally posted by leonidas
i can get behind that sort of, though i'm not sure the danny/shang thing holds up under direct scrutiny. in that sense though, it's REALLY impossible to say danny is more skilled than cap since according to what you just said, BOTH have enhancements.for that matter, cassie is also enhanced. people seem to want to credit the serum for rogers' showings, while at the same time ignoring enhancements in others that ALSO translate to increased perceived skill. matt has radar to aid him, a huge enhancement. bp has his suit and the herbs, plus whatever idiotic enhancements he has as kotd. even shang is chi enhanced. all of those things translate into increased speed and power for those guys, so why is rogers being dinged when none of the others are? at best we can then say they are all roughly equal, and at worst we have no idea how they would ACTUALLY fare against each other. they are ALL superhuman. and that superhumanity contributes to ALL their skill levels. taking that a step further, it would mean dc's ma guys really ARE far superior to marvel's since people like bats and shiva and dragon and bronze tiger and dick really have NO enhancements to speak of at all....
Cassandra Cain enhanced?
Has she been reclassified or something? Her original solo series took pain to claim biologically, she's normal. It's the bizarre training that accounts for her skills, which could be said of any hardcore martial artist..
And spot on about Danny. I was using T'challa's quote by way of explanation, but that doesn't mean I believe it.. 😉
The recent Iron Fist match with a possessed Shang Chi actually had them locked in a borderline stalemate for awhile, until the villain got impatient and yelled at Shang that he's supposed to kill Iron Fist, not play with him..
Originally posted by leonidas
huh? that makes no sense. he isn't skilled because of the serum. he's faster and stronger but had learned the skills, same as any one has.and you can't have it both ways then--he beat spidey who is faster and stronger than he is. not to mention namor, done well vs hulk via nerve strikes, etc...
and you MAY be right--he may not be as technical as dragon (who has precious few showings to own up to his rep) but the degree of difference wouldn't be as great as you think imo.
when he was skinny, sickly rogers, steve took out multiple super soldiers. as old man rogers he took out his son ian who'd made the avengers look like children. he's got plenty of showings that demonstrate his skills as being FAR beyond that basic comment that was made 40 years ago. /shrug
I just wanted to make sure my point was clear to you, and you hadnt ignored it without understanding it. 👆
Originally posted by cdtm
No one's saying he isn't skilled. Just that he's not the apex of skill.It's the same reasoning T'challa gave comparing Danny to Shang Chi, with the former having far superior chi reserves, but lesser skill. Just substitite chi for super soldier serum enhanced stats..
Originally posted by darthgoober
Cap's been specifically noted as being more skilled than Shang on at least one occasion. Just sayin...
Hah.
That may be true, but doesn't make much sense when you consider Shangs been literally training all his life, while Cap spent a good amount of time on ice.
Anyways, when they sparred last, Cap made mention of suffering broken bones..