Mass Shootings in America Thread

Originally posted by Surtur
It seems more his issue is the selective opening of your mouth when it comes to lack of context.

And I'm not searching back through all 100 pages of this topic, but we have had people "herp derp Australia did good tee hee!" without a single mention of how they accomplished it, etc. These same imbeciles will sit there and act flabbergasted that any American could think Dems want to take their guns. Even as these people praise Australia for what they did.

If you are referring to me, Surter, then allow me to clear up a misconception. We here in Australia didn't take away guns. We simply made them harder to obtain under false pretenses (You need a gun license to purchase a firearm, which requires several checks including police checks, and mental health assessment, along with membership to a gun club), and you need to register any firearm you purchase. Keep the weapons and ammo locked in separate safes, that kind of thing. Common sense stuff.

You can still obtain all the guns you need here, we are simply more rigorously regulated, and since the Port arthur massacre, when the laws were introduced, we can say that our gun crime in general has fallen a lot. Although the impact of the gun reform laws could be debatable in their direct effectiveness.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-28/fact-check-gun-homicides-and-suicides-john-howard-port-arthur/7254880

I won't pretend that the laws themselves are the only factor, but they did have an impact.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
If you are referring to me, Surter, then allow me to clear up a misconception. We here in Australia didn't take away guns. We simply made them harder to obtain under false pretenses (You need a gun license to purchase a firearm, which requires several checks including police checks, and mental health assessment, along with membership to a gun club), and you need to register any firearm you purchase. Keep the weapons and ammo locked in separate safes, that kind of thing. Common sense stuff.

You can still obtain all the guns you need here, we are simply more rigorously regulated, and since the Port arthur massacre, when the laws were introduced, we can say that our gun crime in general has fallen a lot. Although the impact of the gun reform laws could be debatable in their direct effectiveness.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-28/fact-check-gun-homicides-and-suicides-john-howard-port-arthur/7254880

I won't pretend that the laws themselves are the only factor, but they did have an impact.

It wasn't just to you, tons of people cite it.

What was the main way you accomplished what you did? You know it, I know it, just say it lol. You went from 13 shootings to 1. Name the biggest factor you feel played a role in that.

Originally posted by Surtur
It wasn't just to you, tons of people cite it.

What was the main way you accomplished what you did? You know it, I know it, just say it lol. You went from 13 shootings to 1. Name the biggest factor you feel played a role in that.

Why don't you elaborate for me Surt? Because now I have no idea what you are talking about... 😕

EDIT: Because you edited in an additional question - I feel that our PM at the time, John Howard made some good calls with regards to the gun regulation laws. People with legit business owning a weapon could still obtain the guns with some effort, while people with no reason to own such a weapon or were clearly unsuitable could not. It's that simple. And since we are an isolated island nation, we can more tightly control the illegal imports of guns and gun parts that crims could black market their way into possessing.

Perhaps that is part of the issue? You guys in the US actually MAKE a lot of arms over there, and some of those can go missing from the factories ending up in unsavory hands.

At the end of the day though, it's not possible to completely eliminate gun crime. As long as the weapons exist, stupid people will use them for stupid purposes. Good people will not, but that doesn't stop the tragedies from occurring, and when they do, people will always ask the ever present question "How can we improve things to try and stop this from happening yet again?" Trying to stop people from asking that question is akin to trying to stop a tidal wave with a water pistol.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Why don't you elaborate for me Surt? Because now I have no idea what you are talking about... 😕

Lol just clear up a misconception. You say guns weren't taken away. So, there wasn't essentially a mandatory buy back program?

I'm not even asking if the government itself used the word mandatory. Weasels can get around it by saying it's not mandatory, but imposing heavy fines if you don't do it, etc.

So did something like that occur in any way, shape, or form?

Originally posted by Surtur
Lol just clear up a misconception. You say guns weren't taken away. So, there wasn't essentially a mandatory buy back program?

I'm not even asking if the government itself used the word mandatory. Weasels can get around it by saying it's not mandatory, but imposing heavy fines if you don't do it, etc.

So did something like that occur in any way, shape, or form?

We had a buyback program for NON REGISTERED firearms. There's a difference between a registered firearm and a non-registered firearm.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
We had a buyback program for NON REGISTERED firearms. There's a difference between a registered forearm and a non-registered firearm.

And what were the penalties for not participating?

And just for fun, remove that completely from the equation, keep everything else you guys did the same. Do you still think you go from 13 school shootings to 1?

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
We had a buyback program for NON REGISTERED firearms. There's a difference between a registered forearm and a non-registered firearm.

i refuse to register my forearms.

Can't remember if I mentioned this the other day: the father of one of the parkland students who died was on MSNBC and essentially whined that Marco Rubio hadn't called to give condolences.

Guess I'm confused because I thought that thoughts and prayers were meaningless?

Given the vitriol these people have spewed at him....why would Rubio call them?

Originally posted by Surtur
And what were the penalties for not participating?

If you didn't register or sell the weapon? Well then the law at that point is, possession of an unregistered firearm is an offense. Usually that entails a 3 and 6 months suspended sentence, and a conviction on record.

Edit: Bloody hell Surt....

Originally posted by Surtur
And just for fun, remove that completely from the equation, keep everything else you guys did the same. Do you still think you go from 13 school shootings to 1?

But why? Thats not what we did, and I have no idea how that would affect the outcome because I'm not omnisient

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
If you didn't register or sell the weapon? Well then the law at that point is, possession of an unregistered firearm is an offense. Usually that entails a 3 and 6 months suspended sentence, and a conviction on record.

And lets say you remove that from the equation. But you implement the other changes. Do you still think you'd see the same dip in shootings?

Originally posted by Surtur
And lets say you remove that from the equation. But you implement the other changes. Do you still think you'd see the same dip in shootings?

See my edits above... You keep editing things in after posting... I did it twice.

So you don't think that doing what they did with the buy back had any impact? Seems like getting a f*ckton of guns off the street would have more of an impact than making it harder to get guns.

Originally posted by Surtur
So you don't think that doing what they did with the buy back had any impact? Seems like getting a f*ckton of guns off the street would have more of an impact than making it harder to get guns.

Your the one who originally went off about compensation for gun ownership. I don't understand why you have a problem with this. Nor why you would raise this as a point against it. The Amnesty was a way to motivate people to get rid of the weapons of their own volition. The laws kept the number of weapons on the street low.

I'm not sure such a thing would work in the US, of course, but we have shown that it can work well enough. Would you be willing to try it?

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Your the one who originally went off about compensation for gun ownership. I don't understand why you have a problem with this. Nor why you would raise this as a point against it. The Amnesty was a way to motivate people to get rid of the weapons of their own volition. The laws kept the number of weapons on the street low.

I'm not sure such a thing would work in the US, of course, but we have shown that it can work well enough. Would you be willing to try it?

The point is that we have morons here who constantly say they don't wanna take away your guns, etc.

These same folk point to your country as some bastion of gun control, despite a major factor in how they accomplished it being the SAME thing gun owners fear. This is the same program Obama praised(another thing that worried gun owners).

Originally posted by Surtur
The point is that we have morons here who constantly say they don't wanna take away your guns, etc.

These same folk point to your country as some bastion of gun control, despite a major factor in how they accomplished it being the SAME thing gun owners fear. This is the same program Obama praised(another thing that worried gun owners).

We didn't TAKE the guns away though Surter. We gave people the option of registering them for legit purposes, or SELLING them back to the government. That is a whole different thing that having armed cops come into your home, and confiscating your guns with nothing you can do about it. Why do you people constantly get this fact wrong?

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
We didn't TAKE the guns away though Surter. We gave people the option of registering them for legit purposes, or SELLING them back to the government. That is a whole different thing that having armed cops come into your home, and confiscating your guns with nothing you can do about it. Why do you people constantly get this fact wrong?

Lol so you see, you need to live in America to get this. You might not get why people here wouldn't want the government knowing exactly what weapons they have.

The option of "register with the government or sell it" is no option at all. So when people see moronic politicians point to this with glee? They worry.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Why do you people constantly get this fact wrong?

stategy

Zero haven't you...in this very thread...gotten gun facts wrong? Lol, I believe Silent Master called you on it.

So I mean...okay, cool.

But if you can't get how what your government pulled would disturb people here I don't know what to tell you.

Originally posted by Surtur
Lol so you see, you need to live in America to get this. You might not get why people here wouldn't want the government knowing exactly what weapons they have.

The option of "register with the government or sell it" is no option at all. So when people see moronic politicians point to this with glee? They worry.

Yeah, ok, so people have something to hide....

But as you said, I don't get it. I don't understand that level of apparent paranoia. I normally associate that with those tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy nutters.

You call them morons, but maybe they simply see the common sense of such a system.

Also wait, so the options were register or sell it.

And if a citizen refuses to do either...what happens? The government just goes "meh, no biggie" and moves on?