Arcann vs. Darth Maul

Lmao @ Rivi Anu scaling.

"The way George explained it to me going in was that THE CLONE WARS micro-series was really an experiment to see what kind of audience there was for Star Wars in an animated form. So when we went into doing this, I think that, now that George is done with the prequels, he wanted to re-establish the rules a little bit more. Like; 'Mace Windu can't take out hundreds of battle droids by himself, otherwise the arena on Geonosis would've been a wipeout.'"

So no, my fine friend, I'm afraid your micro-series CW wank is probably one of the least reliable sources of actual information in the mythos.

Ignoring all of that, however, Rivi Anu's feat has been implied to be oneness.

As far as Vesh is concerned, how the **** did you read 'childhood' and assume adulthood? More importantly the devastation she unleashed burned down an entire city block.

I don't know what it is with you and Maul but whenever you wank him, you go one step forward and then perform epic mental gymnastics. If you're going to do it right, could you not use feats that involve Anakin level potential or at least not solely relying on feats from a series that Lucas himself said aren't even possible?

-

Characters can be wrong, but that doesn't mean we should assume they are. Whether or not Kenobi was accurate in his assessment regarding Yoda's ability to replicate Anakin's feat, his belief that someone vastly more powerful than him couldn't replicate something that an inferior in actualized power was able to petform implies Anakin wasn't operating at the level he normally perfoms at. This is supported by the text's description of the feat which goes along with what people consider oneness.

It's also worth pointing out the context of the showing, Anakin was protecting an entire city of people and the text describes Anakin pushing himself to his limits because he was protecting other people.

Anakin often performs well beyond his typival levels when pushed in such a way for such reasons.

For example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=groYO_51bwY

And while Kenobi's opinion may be fallible, the holistic intent is pretty clear here.

Anakin is using far more of his raw power than he typically was capable of using at this point. Hence scaling from this sort of feat should be taken with a grain of salt.

For once, we're in agreement Kbro.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Lmao @ Rivi Anu scaling.

So no, my fine friend, I'm afraid your micro-series CW wank is probably one of the least reliable sources of actual information in the mythos.

Ignoring all of that, however, Rivi Anu's feat has been implied to be oneness.

As far as Vesh is concerned, how the **** did you read 'childhood' and assume adulthood? More importantly the devastation she unleashed burned down an entire city block.

I don't know what it is with you and Maul but whenever you wank him, you go one step forward and then perform epic mental gymnastics. If you're going to do it right, could you not use feats that involve Anakin level potential or at least not solely relying on feats from a series that Lucas himself said aren't even possible?

Well there's kind of a difference between the Geonosian Arena and where Mace Windu was in the OCW.

But I mean what exactly is deemed exaggerated now? Are the comics/novels and all the games and their cutscenes exaggerated cause we didn't see anything like what they did in the movies?

Originally posted by AncientPower
Lmao @ Rivi Anu scaling.

So no, my fine friend, I'm afraid your micro-series CW wank is probably one of the least reliable sources of actual information in the mythos.

Ignoring all of that, however, Rivi Anu's feat has been implied to be oneness.

"I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world.

we decided that, like Star Trek, we would have two universes: My universe and then this other one. They try to make their universe as consistent with mine as possible, but obviously they get enthusiastic and want to go off in other directions.

The EU is a well of ideas, and there's what's on screen. They don't live in the same universe. Everyone wants to think so, I know. We just need to think of it all as a creative collection of fun ideas separate from what George Lucas has made.

"When it comes to absolute canon, the real story of Star Wars, you must turn to the films themselves—and only the films. Even novelizations are interpretations of the film, and while they are largely true to George Lucas' vision (he works quite closely with the novel authors), the method in which they are written does allow for some minor differences.

I'm not going to labour this point, the evidence speaks for itself; the entirety of the EU is in it's own continuity which is out of line with Lucas' vision.

Also, I love willing you and Neph are to throw out OCW because it's too "exaggerated" for Lucas, and yet you seem to think he would endorse a child burning down a city block, among the other things you argue for. Hypocritical as ever.

As far as Vesh is concerned, how the **** did you read 'childhood' and assume adulthood?

"Thana Vesh spent her childhood cultivating an explosive temper and destroying everything she laid eyes on."

It indicates her childhood had mostly passed by the time she discovered her Force powers, but it doesn't really matter either way.

More importantly the devastation she unleashed burned down an entire city block.

No, the "resulting devastation" burned down the city, and considering telekinesis doesn't cause things to catch fire, your case is finished.

I don't know what it is with you and Maul but whenever you wank him, you go one step forward and then perform epic mental gymnastics. If you're going to do it right, could you not use feats that involve Anakin level potential or at least not solely relying on feats from a series that Lucas himself said aren't even possible?

I mean really, I'm being criticised for "mental gymnastics" by someone who in this thread alone has struggled to make one legitimate argument or interpret one source correctly, not to mention someone who partakes in quote forgery. I advise you lick your wounds instead of dolling out insults which apply to yourself a thousand fold.

OCW related media is essentially junked by TCW, basically. Canon or Legends. TCW related Legends material always retcons OCW related material. I'm pretty sure Leland even said OCW was N-canon prior to the Disney buyout but I can't find the quote.

In your mind, perhaps.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Lmao @ Rivi Anu scaling.

Furthermore, the showing was a last resort, full-effort expression of potential, I don't think she can replicate that readily. That said, you can't use the latter point to discredit the feat if you're going to try to scale characters off Vash's feat where she "lashed out" and expressed her potential which she never actually achieved.

Not that starting a fire is that impressive of a showing.

"The way George explained it to me going in was that THE CLONE WARS micro-series was really an experiment to see what kind of audience there was for Star Wars in an animated form. So when we went into doing this, I think that, now that George is done with the prequels, he wanted to re-establish the rules a little bit more. Like; 'Mace Windu can't take out hundreds of battle droids by himself, otherwise the arena on Geonosis would've been a wipeout.'"

TBH, trying to disqualify the micro series showings basedon being exaggerated and then taking stwor feats as valid sounds to me like:

epic mental gymnastics.

Yeah, I'm sure someone who was just recently knighted and who gets taken out by blaster bolts which Ki-Adi-Mundi had no issues deflecting, is above Maul, Dooku, Kenobi etc. Makes so much sense.

https://imgur.com/a/6NYKD

"I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world.

we decided that, like Star Trek, we would have two universes: My universe and then this other one. They try to make their universe as consistent with mine as possible, but obviously they get enthusiastic and want to go off in other directions.

The EU is a well of ideas, and there's what's on screen. They don't live in the same universe. Everyone wants to think so, I know. We just need to think of it all as a creative collection of fun ideas separate from what George Lucas has made.

"When it comes to absolute canon, the real story of Star Wars, you must turn to the films themselves—and only the films. Even novelizations are interpretations of the film, and while they are largely true to George Lucas' vision (he works quite closely with the novel authors), the method in which they are written does allow for some minor differences.

epic mental gymnastics

Originally posted by ILS
@AP All your quote tells us is the same thing Lucas has told us about the entire EU: that it is a separate continuity that is not congruent with "his world", i.e canon. To quote:

[b]"I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world.

we decided that, like Star Trek, we would have two universes: My universe and then this other one. They try to make their universe as consistent with mine as possible, but obviously they get enthusiastic and want to go off in other directions.

The EU is a well of ideas, and there's what's on screen. They don't live in the same universe. Everyone wants to think so, I know. We just need to think of it all as a creative collection of fun ideas separate from what George Lucas has made.

"When it comes to absolute canon, the real story of Star Wars, you must turn to the films themselves—and only the films. Even novelizations are interpretations of the film, and while they are largely true to George Lucas' vision (he works quite closely with the novel authors), the method in which they are written does allow for some minor differences.

I'm not going to labour this point, the evidence speaks for itself; the entirety of the EU is in it's own continuity which is out of line with Lucas' vision.

Also, I love willing you and Neph are to throw out OCW because it's too "exaggerated" for Lucas, and yet you seem to think he would endorse a child burning down a city block, among the other things you argue for. Hypocritical as ever.

"Thana Vesh spent her childhood cultivating an explosive temper and destroying everything she laid eyes on."

It indicates her childhood had mostly passed by the time she discovered her Force powers, but it doesn't really matter either way.

Thana lashed out, and the resulting devastation burned an entire Kaas City block to the ground.

No, the "resulting devastation" burned down the city, and considering telekinesis doesn't cause things to catch fire, your case is finished.

Which translates to: arguments that make sense scare me, so I'm going to hide behind thinly veiled ad hominem to avoid having to make sense.

I mean really, I'm being criticised for "mental gymnastics" by someone who in this thread alone has struggled to make one legitimate argument or interpret one source correctly, not to mention someone who partakes in quote forgery. I advise you lick your wounds instead of dolling out insults which apply to yourself a thousand fold. [/B]

😂

Do you have any idea how the Legends system even works? I'd advise Force and Destiny. It might be educational. Essentially, Legends are myths in Canon. They're nerdy claims for historians to uphold or debunk at will. But some Legends are considered to have greater evidence than others. Anything that conflicts with actual Canon is low on that totem pole. Even worse for things actively contradicting higher sources that are also Legends. Mace army busting being an example.

Nobody even fvcking claimed Vesh as a child city block busts, all I said was exactly what've you been trying to correct me on this entire argument. The only discrepancy being that you're assuming Vesh magically grew older in the events of the codex, according to the codex when nothing remotely implies it.

You can fire off whatever manure you can concoct but using Rivi Anu and Anakin's oneness feats to wank Kenobi and Maul is genuinely atrocious logic.

Originally posted by ILS
No, sorry, it's not appealing to an exception, it's simply an observation that characters can be wrong about things; characters don't necessarily know their own limits when all the chips are down. Case-in-point, Windu thought Depa Billaba was his superior in lightsaber combat, he was wrong. At one point, Maul thought he could kill Sidious when previously he couldn't, just due to a change in circumstance, but it doesn't change the fact he was wrong.

All these circumtances presented feats that dispelled dubious notions. That's exactly why I originally asked the same for Obi Wan: if he's wrong, where's the evidence?

I think characters may be an authority about what they can do, to an extent, but their opinions are not limiting factors without evidence.

Oh, I completely agree with you. Except I consider the fact he never replicated the feat, in addition to the circumtances I explained in my previous post, enough evidence to conclude my point of view is, indeed, correct.

I don't accept that Obi-Wan can place an upper limit on himself he has never tried to exceed that upper limit.

I, too, don't accept Obi Wan can do something he never did and tought he couldn't do.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Do you have any idea how the Legends system even works? I'd advise Force and Destiny. It might be educational. Essentially, Legends are myths in Canon. . [/B]

@AP

Do you have any idea how the Legends system even works? I'd advise Force and Destiny. It might be educational. Essentially, Legends are myths in Canon. They're nerdy claims for historians to uphold or debunk at will. But some Legends are considered to have greater evidence than others. Anything that conflicts with actual Canon is low on that totem pole.

Even worse for things actively contradicting higher sources that are also Legends. Mace army busting being an example.

Nobody even fvcking claimed Vesh as a child city block busts, all I said was exactly what've you bern trying to correct me on this entire argument. The only decrepancy being that you're assuming Vesh magically grew older in the events of the codex, according to the codex when nothing remotely implies it.

You can fire off whatever manure you can concoct but using Rivi Anu and Anakin's oneness feats to wank Kenobi and Maul is genuinely atrocious logic.

You're starting to sound unhinged again. I'm really hoping skillz, Ant or Deronn can pick up your slack.

Originally posted by TenebrousWay
All these circumtances presented feats that dispelled dubious notions. That's exactly why I originally asked the same for Obi Wan: if he's wrong, where's the evidence?

Oh, I completely agree with you. Except I consider the fact he never replicated the feat, in addition to the circumtances I explained in my previous post, enough evidence to conclude my point of view is, indeed, correct.

I, too, don't accept Obi Wan can do something he never did and tought he couldn't do.

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
So stwor is a myth, yeah, you don't have an argument.

SWTOR's a far higher source you moron. Tons of SWTOR related material is actively placed in Canon. There are Revan references in TLJ. 😂

More importantly, Disney doesn't touch their era, the TOR era is a continuation of Legends of which they have free reign to retcon whatever they please. TOR is the primary Legends source now.

Disney doesn't touch any of legends, they use it as a resource for ideas. There is no hierarchy within the legends themselves, because all of it is non-canon.

The only moron we can positively identify in this thread, AP, is you.

Originally posted by ILS
I'm simply disputing the idea that Obi-Wan's opinions and dialogue are more important than what we actually see these characters do.

That's not the idea I defended at all although I admit it's easy to get lost with AP cluttering the thread.

Fair enough. 👆