I think there's a cognitive bias here: "17 BBY" draws your focus to Vader's weaker showings from that era, but you may forget to look to Deceived Malgus's feats and realize that he has a lot of the same silly lowballing as well. (e.g. also struggles against Aryn Leneer who's just as "random" as the Jedi Vader struggles against).
At least Vader's lower end showings are balanced by really high-end ones like being put above Kar Vastor, being described by people who have met Yoda as being the most powerful person they've ever met, etc.
Originally posted by The EllimistOf that much, you are absolutely correct. It's a shame you have no idea who's suffering from it.
I think there's a cognitive bias here:
Spoiler:
Your pseudo-intellectual psychoanalysis is pants on head retarded, btw.
"17 BBY" draws your focus to Vader's weaker showings from that era,Nobody with a brain needs to lowball Vader this early in his career to give Malgus the nod.
but you may forget to look to Deceived Malgus's feats and realize that he has a lot of the same silly lowballing as well. (e.g. also struggles against Aryn Leneer who's just as "random" as the Jedi Vader struggles against).Elm, do put on a show for us, and cite the specific names of the Jedi that are "just as random" as Aryn Leneer.
Originally posted by ILS
Of that much, you are absolutely correct. It's a shame you have no idea who's suffering from it.
LMFAO
I like this new ILS, we could use someone volunteering as tribute to keep things spicy around here. 🙂
Nobody with a brain needs to lowball Vader this early in his career to give Malgus the nod.
mmm You mean ILS one-two months ago didn't have a brain when he agreed that 19 BBY Vader > Mace/Dooku and > Karness Muur?
Anyway, no idea how you went from pointing out that there is a variance of the distributions of Vader's feats from this era to "I don't need to lowball".
Elm, do put on a show for us, and cite the specific names of the Jedi that are "just as random" as Aryn Leneer.
😕 I suppose you're trying to put on a rhetorical device here, but you don't actually make an argument. The burden of proof would be on you to explain these Jedi, since I'm not using them as an active argument, lol.
In either case, you didn't actually respond to the good accolades/feats I brought up from this time period, or bring up anything positive on Malgus's end, so I don't see anything substantive that came out of it. 10/10 troll, literally 0/10 argument, so mission accomplished. 👆
Originally posted by The EllimistI can't tell you how glad I am. You basically offered yourself to new!ILS on a platter. Time to make some spicy curry out of you.
LMFAOI like this new ILS, we could use someone volunteering as tribute to keep things spicy around here. 🙂
mmm You mean ILS one-two months ago didn't have a brain when he agreed that 19 BBY Vader > Mace/Dooku and > Karness Muur?Even if that is true, anyone going by the name of ILS one-two months ago is an unrecognisable, putrid, festering husk of a debater that would not even be fit to lick my toilet seat clean. Lucky for you, however, we have a job opening.
Anyway, no idea how you went from pointing out that there is a variance of the distributions of Vader's feats from this era to "I don't need to lowball".You posited that the reason people were giving Malgus the nod is because "their focus" was drawn to Vader's lowliest showings. I was simply pointing out that this is symptomatic of brain injury on your part, and I think you're better than that.
😕 I suppose you're trying to put on a rhetorical device here, but you don't actually make an argument. The burden of proof would be on you to explain these Jedi, since I'm not using them as an active argument, lol.No, you said that the "Jedi Vader struggles against" are "just as random" as Aryn Leneer. Tell me who they are, seeing as you are the one who started your posting in this thread by hurling pseudo-intellectual psychoanalytical accusations of cognitive bias at the other fine denizens of KMC.
In either case, you didn't actually respond to the good accolades/feats I brought up from this time period, or bring up anything positive on Malgus's end, so I don't see anything substantive that came out of it. 10/10 troll, literally 0/10 argument, so mission accomplished. 👆 [/B]Your stupid scaling related to Vastor and Yoda nonwithstanding, Malgus' feats are just better at this point. The Jedi Malgus has defeated are in excess of any Vader has beaten, to my current knowledge, and his lightning is not an inconsiderable asset with it's ability to casually harvest three Jedi in one blast, and totally annihilate Aryn Leneer's prepared defences by the end of the book.
This being in stark contrast to their first fight, where she handled Malgus' lightning just fine while flipping through the air, with her also being distinctly inferior in focus, clarity and thus power than she is by the end.
In addition, this is Vader merely two years after Revenge of the Sith, where he has suffered an immense loss in Force connection but has not yet attained the indispensable experience and knowledge he is going to acquire over the next couple of decades. In contrast, Malgus is about 40 around Deceived, and has been in constant warfare against the Jedi since he was 20, where already he was accoladed as one of the greatest warriors in the Empire. By Deceived, he is one of if not the foremost warrior's in Vitiate's army, leading an elite squad of Sith to destroy the Jedi temple, and is still yet to undergo a life-changing epiphany which exponentially increases his connection to the dark side.
Now, go ahead, and with a straight face, tell me that "this doesn't necessarily prove Malgus is better", and give the nod to 17BBY Vader, who at best by this stage in time has been given Malgus' war journal as a source of inspiration for his own nascent powers.
Originally posted by carthageNot feeling trolly today?
Not sure
Vader should decimate if he used TK though
@ILS bro, you need to pop chill pill. There's no need to get this motherf*cking heated in a casual thread like this. Am I the only one who gets a "I'm going to pop through this computer screen and beat your ass boi" vibe any time ILS responds to someone?
Seriously, take one:
Originally posted by Kurk
Not feeling trolly today?@ILS bro, you need to pop chill pill. There's no need to get this motherf*cking heated in a casual thread like this. Am I the only one who gets a "I'm going to pop through this computer screen and beat your ass boi" vibe any time ILS responds to someone?
Seriously, take one:
Kurk can’t take the heat.
WTf's up between ILS and Elim?
Well, whatever, should be fun. I'll side with Elim 4 now. Vader is fam after all.
I like how he thinks I'm not enjoying myself, or all the attention he gives me.
Kurk can’t take the heat.
I like this troll-ILS. Sadly, much like Anakin, he appears to have lost much of his abilities - perhaps he sees a little bit of 17BBY Vader in himself? mmm
Originally posted by ILS
Even if that is true, anyone going by the name of ILS one-two months ago is an unrecognisable, putrid, festering husk of a debater that would not even be fit to lick my toilet seat clean. Lucky for you, however, we have a job opening.
You realize that this implies that Eillimist > January ILS, right? 🙂
Your stupid scaling related to Vastor and Yoda nonwithstanding,
The Jedi Malgus has defeated are in excess of any Vader has beaten, to my current knowledge,
😕
Ferus Olin was considered by Obi Wan to be the second most gifted apprentice in the entire Order after Anakin - and when he later fights Vader (not as an apprentice), not only loses but says he moved faster than any Jedi he's ever seen, sans Yoda.
Aryn Leneer received no such accolades or recognition - she was considered above average, maybe even significantly so, but certainly not second to the Chosen One of her apprentice class lol.
and his lightning is not an inconsiderable asset with it's ability to casually harvest three Jedi in one blast,
Impressive but insufficient without knowing the capabilities of those Jedi.
and totally annihilate Aryn Leneer's prepared defences by the end of the book.This being in stark contrast to their first fight, where she handled Malgus' lightning just fine while flipping through the air, with her also being distinctly inferior in focus, clarity and thus power than she is by the end.
Aryn Leneer struggled to shield herself from a terminal velocity fall and ended up injuring herself in the process. Anakin casually does this while also timing himself to land on a specific airspeeder out of the traffic of Coruscant with no injuries...
in Attack of the Clones. As a padawan.
In addition, this is Vader merely two years after Revenge of the Sith, where he has suffered an immense loss in Force connection but has not yet attained the indispensable experience and knowledge he is going to acquire over the next couple of decades.
Sure, 17BBY Vader is significantly weaker than Anakin Skywalker. So is Malgus, so what's your point?
In contrast, Malgus is about 40 around Deceived, and has been in constant warfare against the Jedi since he was 20, where already he was accoladed as one of the greatest warriors in the Empire. By Deceived, he is one of if not the foremost warrior's in Vitiate's army, leading an elite squad of Sith to destroy the Jedi temple, and is still yet to undergo a life-changing epiphany which exponentially increases his connection to the dark side.
Funny that Pax Javan, who has met Yoda, padawan Anakin, and likely many other Jedi like Mace Windu and Obi Wan, thought this era's Vader was the most powerful being he'd ever met. Was Javan utterly delusional about these legendary Jedi's abilities? He was no scrub - he was a full Jedi Knight whose abilities were considered noticeably above average, so he's more than qualified enough to have a faint grasp of how powerful people in the Order are.
What about Ferus Olin, one of the most gifted Jedi in the entire Order? Was he just delusional when he thought Vader moved faster than anyone he'd seen other than Yoda? Was the second most gifted Jedi of his generation utterly clueless about his comrades' power levels?
To be clear, I agree that 17BBY Vader would not actually stand a chance against, say, Yoda or peak Mace Windu in a fight. He emanates an enormous level of raw power that multiple credible sources agree is incredible, but he still hasn't regained his former self's confidence and practical power - but against Malgus, whose innate talents with the Force by Deceived are paltry in comparison, the clunkiness of Vader's suit still isn't enough to give Malgus the victory, not when Malgus needs some sort of epiphany to beat someone who can't do something padawan Anakin does in his sleep.
Now, go ahead, and with a straight face, tell me that "this doesn't necessarily prove Malgus is better", and give the nod to 17BBY Vader, who at best by this stage in time has been given Malgus' war journal as a source of inspiration for his own nascent powers.
Lmfao, the Tenebrous-era Banite Sith also considered Darth Bane's power to be "legendary", and Sidious himself praised Malgus's battlefield exploits, so I suppose this means Bane and Malgus > Palpatine now? 🙄
That retarded speeder feat is still getting thrown around? Jesus.
I'm pretty sure that literally stopping yourself in in mid-air from terminal velocity while carrying someone is slightly different from just cushioning your impact. Later on Malgus jumps from above the Jedi temple and smashes into the ground hard enough to shatter the stone around them while unleashing a two-handed power attack on Leneer, who blocks it as well as his force wave while also deflecting the shrapnel from the impact.
But no, Anakin jumped onto a speeder.