Hulk vs. Kurse

Originally posted by h1a8
Kurse sent Thor flying more than a few hundred feet with a backhand (which is far weaker than any punch). Hulk never sent Thor flying that far with a punch.
So Kurse on average should be at least twice as strong as Hulk.

Sigh.

While Kurse DID send Thor flying away (that is true), it does NOT quantifiably establish that Kurse is at least twice as strong as Hulk. That is quite the leap of logic there.

I don't disagree that it is possible. But your methodology for determining it sucks.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. To me it seems like a rock, paper, scissors fight. Thor would be the paper.

Thor is too agile and cunning for Hulk.

Kurse is agile enough, cunning enough and strong enough to engage counter Thor.

Hulk is massively strong and durable.

The only way I see Kurse having the edge is if he out-dances Hulk the way Thor did.

Otherwise, i don't see Kurse actually blocking and taking Hulk's brute attacks

3. Hmmm... Idk, Kurse seems more versatile. Hulk is just a brute.

It's a matter of perception. To me it's harder to gauge based on Thor, since as I mentioned, Hulk =/= to Thor.

Hulk just has massive feats like moving Surtur or punching the Leviathan on his corner, whereas we don't know how well Thor was fighting.

Kurse never got a proper mjolnir strike like Hulk did because he managed to split them. (We don't know if he would be able to cope with such a levels of power).

I mean you pretty much admit Kurse is faster and a better fighter than Hulk.

Ergo this should go pretty similar to how Hulk vs Thanos went.

As for Hulks massive strength feats, Thanos doesnt have those either 😬

You and h1a8 both need to realise powerscaling Does Matter. Otherwise nothing makes sense going JUST by an individuals own feats.

Why is breaking an advanced alien forcefield less impressive than an advanced alien worm? Considering the bifrost was powering the field I find it more impressive. And Kurse did that casually.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Sigh.

While Kurse DID send Thor flying away (that is true), it does NOT quantifiably establish that Kurse is at least twice as strong as Hulk. That is quite the leap of logic there.

I don't disagree that it is possible. But your methodology for determining it sucks.

So we don't use direct comparisons against Thor?
Imagine Hulk trying to swat Mjolnir away instead of trying to catch it from the first Avengers movie. Would he be successful in just stopping it (not hitting it away)? My opinion says no.

Originally posted by h1a8
So we don't use direct comparisons against Thor?
Imagine Hulk trying to swat Mjolnir away instead of trying to catch it from the first Avengers movie. Would he be successful in just stopping it (not hitting it away)? My opinion says no.

🙄

Originally posted by h1a8
So we don't use direct comparisons against Thor?

Ironic statement given you dont wanna use direct comparisons against Hulk and Thor when it comes to bullets.

Kurse would put Hulk in a coma. It would go down almost exactly like his fight with Thanos. He's facing an opponent stronger, more durable and far more skilled.

Hulk needs to take self-defense classes if he doesn't want to keep getting beat up.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Destroying Sokovia is a massive power buff for instance, with Mjonir sure but a buff still.

This is fake news. Where do you get your conclusions from?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
This is fake news. Where do you get your conclusions from?

The truth is we have never seen the maximum output of any of these characters so to say it is a buff is faulty.

Thor had no reason to obliterate a city which is we haven't seen him do it. Jotunheim is a good indicator of what he was capable of.

In WW2 the British tried making some boats out of solid ice and they stood up to torpedoes better than metal. Melting was a problem though.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
2. Yeah, figured you saw it that way. I see your point, but Kurse doesn't need to dodge Hulk the way Thor does. He can simply block Hulk's punches. And seeing as he is skilled and powerful enough to deflect a returning Mjolnir while his back is turned, that won't be too hard. I can certainly see Kurse blocking most of Hulk's hits while Hulk would likely eat almost all the Kure's hits.

3. Well, I don't disagree. Hulk certainly has the better strength showings of the two. But, like I said, Kurse had a limited showing and very few strength "feats" to go on and has never had his max strength tested. While we can basically scale both off Thor's punches/face (w/c would be the most precise metric IMO).

2. Well that's the thing Nibedicus.

Can Kurse engage Hulk's brute attacks!? Beating Thor doesn't make him as strong as Hulk, or means he can replicate Thanos' feat.

3. There is also considering that per each strike Hulk gives Thor, Kurse gives 5.

If you check the fight between Kurse and Thor, Kurse was able to land more strikes in a shorter time than Hulk ever did.

Originally posted by h1a8
Kurse sent Thor flying more than a few hundred feet with a backhand (which is far weaker than any punch). Hulk never sent Thor flying that far with a punch.
So Kurse on average should be at least twice as strong as Hulk.

Are you looking for me to get a headache?

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. Well that's the thing Nibedicus.

Can Kurse engage Hulk's brute attacks!? Beating Thor doesn't make him as strong as Hulk, or means he can replicate Thanos' feat.

3. There is also considering that per each strike Hulk gives Thor, Kurse gives 5.

If you check the fight between Kurse and Thor, Kurse was able to land more strikes in a shorter time than Hulk ever did.

2. Blocking would be just about as effective as dodging at this point, seeing as Kurse is at least a peer+ of Hulk in physical stats.

3. I seem to remember actually counting all strikes between their fights back then (had to in one debate I had) and the single ground pound did on Thor had about the same number of hits as the total number of strikes Kurse had on Thor throughout their entire fight (IIRC) and this happened at a shorter time frame while Thor's had his head was flat against the ground (meaning he had to absorb the full impact of each strike). Of course, I'm doing this by memory so I can't say for certain. But go ahead and count all the punches Thor took vs Kurse in their fight and the number of hits Thor had vs Hulk in Ragnarok.

Searched it. Found it. The debate was actually with you, too! 😛

Here it is:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=653432&pagenumber=2

Originally posted by Nibedicus
That didn't happen on the ground and pound (GnP) tho. Basically every one of Hulk's GnP punches hit, Hulk also hit Thor more than twice the number of GnP hits Kurse had and even managed to land double arm strikes (w/c Kurse was unable to do due to Loki stopping him) as well as a jump-stomp at the start. In fact, on the GnP alone (w/c landed 20 seconds), he managed to basically match Kurse's overall total number of punches landed (Kurse landed a total of 14 hits including the rock throw, Hulk landed 13-14 GnP hits, 2 off screen including the ground stomp from my count).

Basically, Hulk landed as many direct, clean full power hits to a prone Thor as ALL of Kurse's hits combined and yet had much less of an effect on Thor.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
This is fake news. Where do you get your conclusions from?

AoU.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
2. Blocking would be just about as effective as dodging at this point, seeing as Kurse is at least a peer+ of Hulk in physical stats.

3. I seem to remember actually counting all strikes between their fights back then (had to in one debate I had) and the single ground pound did on Thor had about the same number of hits as the total number of strikes Kurse had on Thor throughout their entire fight (IIRC) and this happened at a shorter time frame while Thor's had his head was flat against the ground (meaning he had to absorb the full impact of each strike). Of course, I'm doing this by memory so I can't say for certain. But go ahead and count all the punches Thor took vs Kurse in their fight and the number of hits Thor had vs Hulk in Ragnarok.

Searched it. Found it. The debate was actually with you, too! 😛

Here it is:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=653432&pagenumber=2

2. How can Kurse be a peer to Hulk if we never see him replicate feats like stopping a Leviathan?

Speculation?

3. Yeah? And you realize that in the Kurse scene, just before Loki stabbed him, Thor was fine?

On the other hand, in Ragnarok, Hulk's punches resulted in Thor going unconsious and ultimately turning God-mode.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. How can Kurse be a peer to Hulk if we never see him replicate feats like stopping a Leviathan?

Speculation?

3. Yeah? And you realize that in the Kurse scene, just before Loki stabbed him, Thor was fine?

On the other hand, in Ragnarok, Hulk's punches resulted in Thor going unconsious and ultimately making God-mode.

2. Peer+, based on his performance against Thor (and his punches) thru powerscaling.

We already discussed this.

3. We certainly have different interpretations on that scene. I see a Thor all beaten up and unable to stand or defend himself against Kurse. Without Loki's interference, it is clear that he would have lost that fight.

On the Hulk fight, he clearly was able to stand up and was perfectly still able to fight on his own without interference after suffering a full ground and pound. And he was not unconscious, he was dazed. Biiiig difference there. He easily recovered, retaliated and had Hulk on the ropes.

Dude. We already covered all this in the last debate. It looks like we went back to page 2 on that very thread and we're rehashing the same arguments.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
2. Peer+, based on his performance against Thor (and his punches) thru powerscaling.

We already discussed this.

3. We certainly have different interpretations on that scene. I see a Thor all beaten up and unable to stand or defend himself against Kurse. Without Loki's interference, it is clear that he would have lost that fight.

On the Hulk fight, he clearly was able to stand up and was perfectly still able to fight on his own without interference after suffering a full ground and pound. And he was not unconscious, he was dazed. Biiiig difference there. He easily recovered, retaliated and had Hulk on the ropes.

Dude. We already covered all this in the last debate. It looks like we went back to page 2 on that very thread and we're rehashing the same arguments.

2. Again, how can you powerscale something like that when you don't actually know how much power they are applying? Specially when the attacks are different

(The only similar attack between both scenes is when Thor is lying on the ground getting punched.)

3. This is important

Thor was unable to stand up, and yet he didn't "dazed" (to me he was unconcious); he was staring back at Kurse just fine.

Now Thor stood up to Hulk because he entered God-mode! Thor hadn't unlock that power back in Dark World. The fact that Thor stood up to Hulk is the result of him boosting up due to the God-Mode ability, not because Hulk didn't defeat his Pre-Ragnarok form.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. Again, how can you powerscale something like that when you don't actually know how much power they are applying? Specially when the attacks are different

(The only similar attack between both scenes is when Thor is lying on the ground getting punched.)

3. [B]This is important

Thor was unable to stand up, and yet he didn't "dazed" (to me he was unconcious), he was staring just fine back at Kurse.

Now Thor stood up because he entered God-mode! Thor hadn't unlock that power back in Dark World. The fact that Thor stood up to Hulk is the result of him boosting up due to the God-Mode ability, not because Hulk didn't beat his Pre-Ragnarok form. [/B]

2. Because we can see the effect it is having on the character in question. Kurse's punches are provably shown to be more effective to Thor than Hulk's. Thus his punches are more effective.

3. Let me quote our last debate. Again, we already covered this man.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
He didn't "went unconscious", he was stunned (his eyes were clearly open as Hulk was punching him) but he recovered from it (in fact, we can see Thor slowly recovering from it as he unleashes his charged punch). There is really no indication that going God-mode that time made him recover from damage like he does when he touches his weapon and summons whatever healing power those things give him.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
2. Because we can see the effect it is having on the character in question. Kurse's punches are provably shown to be more effective to Thor than Hulk's. Thus his punches are more effective.

3. Let me quote our last debate. Again, we already covered this man.

Lets make this a single post since both lines of debate have merged now it seems.

Did Thor entered God-Mode after he was "stunned" by Hulk's punches?

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Lets make this a single post since both lines of debate have merged now it seems.

Did Thor entered God-Mode after he was "stunned" by Hulk's punches?

Well, you know the answer to that.

I have a better question. What is God-Mode?