Hulk vs. Kurse

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. How can Kurse be a peer to Hulk if we never see him replicate feats like stopping a Leviathan?

Speculation?

3. Yeah? And you realize that in the Kurse scene, just before Loki stabbed him, Thor was fine?

On the other hand, in Ragnarok, Hulk's punches resulted in Thor going unconsious and ultimately turning God-mode.

The boulder throw is higher than the leviathan feat.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Ironic statement given you dont wanna use direct comparisons against Hulk and Thor when it comes to bullets.

Originally posted by h1a8

Because it's not possible and also goes against the writer's intent.

Of course its possible. Hulk has taken aircraft fire, and Thor has consistently proved himself as durable as Hulk.

You know your trolling of writers intentions is getting pretty annoying. I might have to get a mod to shut you down on that.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Of course its possible. Hulk has taken aircraft fire, and Thor has consistently proved himself as durable as Hulk.

You know your trolling of writers intentions is getting pretty annoying. I might have to get a mod to shut you down on that.

How has Thor proved this when he is not aircraft bullet proof?

Thor ran from the bullets. If Thor was resistant in the writer's mind then he wouldn't had Thor do such things.

In other words, writer thinks, "aircraft bullets will hurt Thor, so I will have him run from them."

You are saying that the writer is thinking, "Thor is resistant against aircraft bullets. But I'm going to have him run from the bullets to trick the audience."

Do what you like.

Originally posted by h1a8
The boulder throw is higher than the leviathan feat.
Because it's not possible and also goes against the writer's intent.

Let me guess, based on your numbers?

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Well, you know the answer to that.

Did Thor enter God-Mode with Kurse?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I have a better question. What is God-Mode?

Have you entered full troll now?

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Did Thor enter God-Mode with Kurse?

Dude, just straight debate man. This question-thing is kinda disrespectful. Let's not go that way.

You know the answers to those questions so present your argument.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Dude, just straight debate man. This question-thing is kinda disrespectful. Let's not go that way.

You know the answers to those questions so present your argument.

Just to make things clear.

Its evident then that Thor unlocked an ability never seen before. He was stunned by Hulk whereas Kurse didnt. Then he stood up with his eyes glowing blue and with a fist covered with electricity.

There is no evidence to suggest that without this ability Thor would have recovered from Hulk's beating. He was already stunned (To me he was going onconcious).

Kurse beat a pre-Ragnarok Thor whereas Hulk defeated Pre-Ragnarok Thor. From the moment Thor stood up with his eyes glowing he is another level from what we saw before.

So using Thor as a power scale isnt as viable.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Just to make things clear.

Its evident then that Thor unlocked an ability never seen before. He was stunned by Hulk whereas Kurse didnt. Then he stood up with his eyes glowing blue and with a fist covered with electricity.

There is no evidence to suggest that without this ability Thor would have recovered from Hulk's beating. He was already stunned (To me he was going onconcious).

Kurse beat a pre-Ragnarok Thor whereas Hulk defeated Pre-Ragnarok Thor. From the moment Thor stood up with his eyes glowing he is another level from what we saw before.

So using Thor as a power scale isnt as viable.

I don't remember the god-mode as ever being alluded as being able to heal Thor. Most damning evidence would be during the Neutron star "feat". He needed Stormbreaker to recover from it, else he'd have died. Had he the ability to to heal just by simply going God-mode, he would have while he was smoking on the floor (since he had no idea how much longer the axe would have taken).

Burden of proof is onto you if you want to show that god-mode somehow healed up all the damage Thor took from the beatdown.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcLmyi46VYA

Also, Thor was not unconscious. He was dazed. His eyes were clearly open, his fists clenched after a hit (3:14) and all it did was make him think about Odin for a few seconds. If anything, from his expression (3:19), it actually looked like the ground and pound pissed him off and he just lightning-punched his way out of it. Kinda the same as how Hulk got pissed off and grabbed the hammer prior to the ground and pound.

It is very possible for Thor to simply fight out of and recover from a GnP. As it actually happens (albeit not too common) for people (happens in MMA) to be able to fight out of and recover from ground and pounds (even after being dazed).

Originally posted by Nibedicus
I don't remember the god-mode as ever being alluded as being able to heal Thor. Most damning evidence would be during the Neutron star "feat". He needed Stormbreaker to recover from it, else he'd have died. Had he the ability to to heal just by simply going God-mode, he would have while he was smoking on the floor (since he had no idea how much longer the axe would have taken).

Burden of proof is onto you if you want to show that god-mode somehow healed up all the damage Thor took from the beatdown.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcLmyi46VYA

Also, Thor was not unconscious. He was dazed. His eyes were clearly open, his fists clenched after a hit (3:14) and all it did was make him think about Odin for a few seconds. If anything, from his expression (3:19), it actually looked like the ground and pound pissed him off and he just lightning-punched his way out of it. Kinda the same as how Hulk got pissed off and grabbed the hammer prior to the ground and pound.

It is very possible for Thor to simply fight out of and recover from a GnP. As it actually happens (albeit not too common) for people (happens in MMA) to be able to fight out of and recover from ground and pounds (even after being dazed).

Depends on your definition of healing. Also, who said anything about curing? The fact that God-Mode can for instance recover the stamina of Thor and enhance his durability doesnt mean it cures injuries.

And still, the fact that Thor used God Mode already makes the Hulk feat different from the one with Kurse.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
1) Depends on your definition of healing. Also, who said anything about curing? The fact that God-Mode can for instance recover the stamina of Thor and enhance his durability doesnt mean it cures injuries.

2) And still, the fact that Thor used God Mode already makes the Hulk feat different from the one with Kurse.

1) Those are some very specific very not-alluded-to conditions for your argument to make sense, though.

2) It doesn't, as Thor recovering has nothing to do with the god-mode ability until proof is provided. Burden of proof and all that.

And he didn't "use" god-mode moreso than those powers were already within him from the very beginning (see also: avengers 2 also see: below), he just got dependent on the hammer.

Here is the script of the fight between Thor and Hulk that I found via google:

https://waltdisneystudiosawards.com/media/scripts/thor_ragnarok.pdf

Looks like he instinctively punched up as a defense mechanism (many fighters demonstrate this when they instinctively cover up after getting dazed/stunned).

Nothing in the script even mentions Thor being healed or getting stronger or getting new levels of durability. Personally, I don't see anything in the fight that alludes to that as well. And since it is very possible to recover from getting dazed, I will have to re-state my interpretation that it was simply Thor recovering and throwing off Hulk with a lightning punch.

Why is the leviathan more impressive than shutting down a forcefield powered by the bifrost?

Originally posted by Nibedicus
1) Those are some very specific very not-alluded-to conditions for your argument to make sense, though.

2) It doesn't, as Thor recovering has nothing to do with the god-mode ability until proof is provided. Burden of proof and all that.

And he didn't "use" god-mode moreso than those powers were already within him from the very beginning (see also: avengers 2 also see: below), he just got dependent on the hammer.

Here is the script of the fight between Thor and Hulk that I found via google:

https://waltdisneystudiosawards.com/media/scripts/thor_ragnarok.pdf

Looks like he instinctively punched up as a defense mechanism (many fighters demonstrate this when they instinctively cover up after getting dazed/stunned).

Nothing in the script even mentions Thor being healed or getting stronger or getting new levels of durability. Personally, I don't see anything in the fight that alludes to that as well. And since it is very possible to recover from getting dazed, I will have to re-state my interpretation that it was simply Thor recovering and throwing off Hulk with a lightning punch.

Doesnt matter how you want to dance this arround Nibe.

Fact is Thor used a new ability against Hulk whereas he didnt with Kurse.

That very fact makes both fights VERY DIFFERENT and ergo not to be compared.

He punched up with a charged fist product of the God Mode ability. He didnt used that ability against Kurse, therefore there is no evidence to suggest that the samething wouldnt have happened with Kurse.

It dissent matter because we have direct comparisons of the attacks he did do.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
It dissent matter because we have direct comparisons of the attacks he did do.

Thor uses God Mode in one scene whereas in the other he didnt.

Do you call that a direct comparison?

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
Why is the leviathan more impressive than shutting down a forcefield powered by the bifrost?

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Doesnt matter how you want to dance this arround Nibe.

Fact is Thor used a new ability against Hulk whereas he didnt with Kurse.

That very fact makes both fights VERY DIFFERENT and ergo not to be compared.

He punched up with a charged fist product of the God Mode ability. He didnt used that ability against Kurse, therefore there is no evidence to suggest that the samething wouldnt have happened with Kurse.

It's not "dancing around" to ask for proof. "Dancing around" is what happens when you are asked to provide proof and you do not do so.

The new ability is hammerless lightning. We are not using his lightning to guage anything. We are using his (non-enhanced) punches and his durability. None of w/c were changed during the god-mode.

That's not the point. But I can see where the misunderstanding is now. I never meant/alluded to Thor being unable to bust out of Kurse's beatdown if he didn't have god-mode. He may very well have been able to.

The point is actually: recovery time after each separate beatdown and how long it took for Thor to get back on his feet. It took far longer to recover from Kurse's beatdown than Hulk. We covered this in our last debate:

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Bottom line is in the results (few seconds recovery vs half a minute).

A few seconds to recover from Hulk, half a minute to recover from Kurse's beatdown.

Kurse barely moving after receiving body shots from Thor @00:35:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJneSSYTZFo&t=100s

Hulk visibly wincing and clearly pained after receiving body shots from Thor @2:48:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u40lpOr07Vo

And that's really all we need to know that Kurse wins this.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
It's not "dancing around" to ask for proof. "Dancing around" is what happens when you are asked to provide proof and you do not do so.

The new ability is hammerless lightning. We are not using his lightning to guage anything. We are using his (non-enhanced) punches and his durability. None of w/c were changed during the god-mode.

That's not the point. But I can see where the misunderstanding is now. I never meant/alluded to Thor being unable to bust out of Kurse's beatdown if he didn't have god-mode. He may very well have been able to.

The point is actually: recovery time after each separate beatdown and how long it took for Thor to get back on his feet. It took far longer to recover from Kurse's beatdown than Hulk. We covered this in our last debate:

A few seconds to recover from Hulk, half a minute to recover from Kurse's beatdown.

There is no official description of the God-Mode attributes, at least i havent been able to find any. Therefore i cant bring evidence just like you cant.

All we know is that God-Mode seems to boost Thor's power.

So am not dancing arround anything. Am being objective.

Thor used a new ability against Hulk, which he didnt against Kurse. That alone is enough to make both feats different.

He used God-mode. That alters the feat and makes posible to attribute Thor's faster recovery to the new ability.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
Why is the leviathan more impressive than shutting down a forcefield powered by the bifrost?

Because we can calculate the weight of the animal based on his proportions. The prison's shield strength on the other hand is an unknown.

One is a solid feat the other an assumption.