Headbutt challenge: Superman vs. Captain Marvel

Originally posted by h1a8
That doesn't destroy my point at all. You are changing the argument.
Im telling you once a HEAVIER person pushes a lighter person with more than 1.5 times that persons weight then the heavier person will go back no matter how strong they are. They could have billion ton strength and still be pushed back. Newton’s third law.

Scrap my earlier answer, didn't see your 1.5 number. In any case, Newton's third law takes into consideration the pushing or pulling forces applied to an object. Assuming that a person's leg strength does not add to their "push" shows that you really shouldn't talk about things you don't understand.

Originally posted by h1a8
Hulk got pushed back by the leviathan. Which proves my point.

Wrong. Thanos can't leap like the Hulk, and therefore his legs aren't as strong.

How do you even know ? He never once even tries to jump. You are literally making shit up right now.

Superman never jumps as high as the hulk ergo hulk is stronger

Godzilla never jumps ergo hulk is stronger

Never saw Bruce almighty jump. What a ****in pussy.

You see what I am getting at?

Quit making shit up

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
How do you even know ? He never once even tries to jump. You are literally making shit up right now.

Superman never jumps as high as the hulk ergo hulk is stronger

Godzilla never jumps ergo hulk is stronger

Never saw Bruce almighty jump. What a ****in pussy.

You see what I am getting at?

Quit making shit up

We go by on screen feats here. So its a valid point.

Also Superman leaped very high in MOS, as did other Kryptonians.

Originally posted by FrothByte

As for Thor, we've seen him leap great distances during the escape from Sakaar. Maybe not as far as Hulk leaps but then I think it was clear that Thor was never quite as strong as Hulk.

Its Pretty evident neither Thor nor Valkyrie can leap anywhere close to the distances and speeds Hulk can.

And by your logic Thor would have completely folded against Hulks leg strength because his legs are not on the same level right?

Physics is useful but we also cant ignore the rules of the Universe we are debating. And Hulk has always been capable of leaping much higher than his strength peers. Not just in the movies, but also in the comics.

Originally posted by h1a8
Hulk got pushed back by the leviathan. Which proves my point.

Wrong. Thanos can't leap like the Hulk, and therefore his legs aren't as strong.

Hulk stopped it desptie the much heavier Leviathan having forward momentum while Hulk standing in one spot.

When have we seen Thanos try to leap like the Hulk?

Originally posted by Darth Thor
We go by on screen feats here. So its a valid point.

Also Superman leaped very high in MOS, as did other Kryptonians.

I don't agree with this. So your saying Hulks legs are stronger than Godzilla despite being vastly inferior just because Godzilla never jumped?

The simple act of Godzilla standing is thousands of times more weight than anything Hulk did in the MCU or the 2003 movie but simply because he didn't jump, he is weaker.

That's kinda trash.

Originally posted by Psychotron

When have we seen Thanos try to leap like the Hulk?

Thats Exactly the point! We havent seen him leap!

On screen feats only here. And although power scaling can be used, feats are not interchangeable.

Thanos punching up Hulk is not proof he can leap as far as Hulk. Especially when thats kinda Hulks Strong point.

Originally posted by ShadowFyre
I don't agree with this. So your saying Hulks legs are stronger than Godzilla despite being vastly inferior just because Godzilla never jumped?

The simple act of Godzilla standing is thousands of times more weight than anything Hulk did in the MCU or the 2003 movie but simply because he didn't jump, he is weaker.

That's kinda trash.

Well im pretty sure Godzilla weighs a heck of a lot more than Hulk. Plus different universes. So no, dont put words into my mouth that I never claimed.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Thats Exactly the point! We havent seen him leap!

On screen feats only here. And although power scaling can be used, feats are not interchangeable.

Thanos punching up Hulk is not proof he can leap as far as Hulk. Especially when thats kinda Hulks Strong point.

He actually did leap at Strange in the Titan battle in IW for what it's worth. Thanos is both lighter and stronger than Hulk, so there's no reason why he can't leap like Hulk. It's not like jumping is some kind of super power, it's just a matter of leg strength.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Its Pretty evident neither Thor nor Valkyrie can leap anywhere close to the distances and speeds Hulk can.

And by your logic Thor would have completely folded against Hulks leg strength because his legs are not on the same level right?

Physics is useful but we also cant ignore the rules of the Universe we are debating. And Hulk has always been capable of leaping much higher than his strength peers. Not just in the movies, but also in the comics.

You're making some false assumptions. Firstly, I never claimed Thor is as strong as Hulk, therefore I don't expect Thor to leap the same distances as Hulk. However, we do have feats of Thor leaping about, far above what the likes of Spiderman can achieve and we already know that Spiderman has a good deal of superstrength.

What this means is that Thor's superstrength is indeed seen in his jumping prowess. Not to the same degree as Hulk because he's not as strong as Hulk.

Furthermore, if you recall, the one time Thor tried to match his strength directly against Hulk he did indeed fold, back when he tried to block Hulk's overhand smash in their first fight. Since then we never saw Thor try to match Hulk's strength directly. He hurt Hulk by outfighting him and outmaneuvering him. If he ever tried to get into a shoving match against Hulk, I fully expect him to fold, with legs the first one to give way.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Well im pretty sure Godzilla weighs a heck of a lot more than Hulk. Plus different universes. So no, dont put words into my mouth that I never claimed.

Wasn't attacking you bro. Just questioning it

Originally posted by Psychotron
Hulk stopped it desptie the much heavier Leviathan having forward momentum while Hulk standing in one spot.

When have we seen Thanos try to leap like the Hulk?

People, don't let H1's red herring lead you astray. The main contention was whether or not Thanos was stronger than Hulk. We already know for a fact that he is because he overpowered Hulk. H1's diversionary tactics to jumping prowess is irrelevant because, contrary to what h1 would like you to believe, leg strength is not the only factor to consider for jumping capacity. There's technique, athleticism, nimbleness and flexibility, even height and length of limbs.

So let's stop talking about jumping height because h1 is only derailing the thread. We also all know that his equations are boulderdash. So it's not like he's proven credible about these things before.

Originally posted by FrothByte
People, don't let H1's red herring lead you astray. The main contention was whether or not Thanos was stronger than Hulk. We already know for a fact that he is because he overpowered Hulk. H1's diversionary tactics to jumping prowess is irrelevant because, contrary to what h1 would like you to believe, leg strength is not the only factor to consider for jumping capacity. There's technique, athleticism, nimbleness and flexibility, even height and length of limbs.

So let's stop talking about jumping height because h1 is only derailing the thread.

Leg strength is basically THE ONLY component of jumping distance when the margin of error is 10%. I told you that I studied the physics of jumping and can accurately predict ANYONE's jumping distance given a few known parameters (mass, height, leg strength, etc).

It's not a red herring since Hulk used his legs to jump towards Surtur.
If Hulks legs are stronger than Thanos legs then the Surtur feat is irrelevant in proving that Thanos can headbutt harder than WW or Superman. Especially when Thanos never overpowered Hulk leg strength (he only broke Hulks grip).

You even defeated your argument when you claim that technique, etc is a factor of shit. WW could have far better technique and speed (which created a shockwave).

Basically I'm entertaining people using a character's highest feat and equating it with the same force they used in all other scenes (including against Thanos). Thats like saying that anyone who survives a punch from Gladiator survived a planet destroying punch.

Here's the logic some are using
P1: Hulk leg feat against Surtur was greater than any of Superman's feats
P2: Thanos broke Hulks grip.

C: Therefore Thanos can headbutt harder than Superman or WW, although visually it shown that both headbutt harder than Thanos.
That's the shittiest faultiest logic ever.

Originally posted by h1a8
Hulk got pushed back which is my point. Hulk used the concrete breaking at angles less than 180 degrees to slow it down. In other words, the moment the ground broke it created a wall behind Hulk feet in order to push against. This means that it isn't a standard static friction problem anymore (the coefficient increases dramatically). It's a standard lifting/bracing feat.

Oh, so some concrete is strong enough to halt the momentum of a leviathan weighing thousands of tons... From what world do you come from, because it's not Earth.

As FrothByte said, Thanos is stronger than Hulk and that's that.

Originally posted by h1a8
Leg strength is basically THE ONLY component of jumping distance when the margin of error is 10%. I told you that I studied the physics of jumping and can accurately predict ANYONE's jumping distance given a few known parameters (mass, height, leg strength, etc).

It's not a red herring since Hulk used his legs to jump towards Surtur.
If Hulks legs are stronger than Thanos legs then the Surtur feat is irrelevant in proving that Thanos can headbutt harder than WW or Superman. Especially when Thanos never overpowered Hulk leg strength (he only broke Hulks grip).

You even defeated your argument when you claim that technique, etc is a factor of shit. WW could have far better technique and speed (which created a shockwave).

Basically I'm entertaining people using a character's highest feat and equating it with the same force they used in all other scenes (including against Thanos). Thats like saying that anyone who survives a punch from Gladiator survived a planet destroying punch.

Here's the logic some are using
P1: Hulk leg feat against Surtur was greater than any of Superman's feats
P2: Thanos broke Hulks grip.

C: Therefore Thanos can headbutt harder than Superman or WW, although visually it shown that both headbutt harder than Thanos.
That's the shittiest faultiest logic ever.

Again, false. You really should stop talking about things you don't know.

As a simple example about technique:
How low you squat in preparation for a jump will affect how high you can jump.
Pushing through your heels in a jump will provide vastly different results than if you push through the balls of your feet.

A few other factors to consider about jumping prowess:
A person's height will greatly affect their jumping height. Generally, assuming similar physical fitness, people with longer limbs can leverage those limbs to jump higher, whereas people with shorter limbs are able to lift heavier deadlifts or squats.

I could list a lot more, but even just these few already prove your argument wrong. So forget about your jumping red herring. Thanos is stronger than Hulk as proven by on screen feats. Deal with it.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Again, false. You really should stop talking about things you don't know.

As a simple example about technique:
How low you squat in preparation for a jump will affect how high you can jump.
Pushing through your heels in a jump will provide vastly different results than if you push through the balls of your feet.

A few other factors to consider about jumping prowess:
A person's height will greatly affect their jumping height. Generally, assuming similar strength, people with longer limbs can leverage those limbs to jump higher, whereas people with shorter limbs are able to lift heavier deadlifts or squats.

I could list a lot more, but even just these few already prove your argument wrong. So forget about your jumping red herring. Thanos is stronger than Hulk as proven by on screen feats. Deal with it.

So your argument is IRRELEVANT.
Jumping distance is strongly correlated with leg strength and weight of a person.

What about the other part of my post? That's far more relevant than this jumping nonsense. You don't want to address them because it defeats your stance to support marvel characters?

Originally posted by h1a8
I addressed this already. I said the margin of error is LESS than 10%. You can name all the variables in the universe and they will never amount more than 10% error in jumping distance.

So your argument is IRRELEVANT.
Jumping distance is strongly correlated with leg strength and weight of a person.

What about the other part of my post? That's far more relevant than this jumping nonsense. You don't want to address them because it defeats your stance to support marvel characters?

Yeah... no. I'm pretty sure you pulled that 10% number from your ass. You have not provided any proof that you can actually do what you said you would do. I could be 4x stronger than another guy, but if I only squat 2 inches lower in preparation for my jump and push through my heels never engaging my toes, I'm pretty sure he has a good chance at out-jumping me.

As for the rest of your argument, I didn't bother replying to it because it's irrelevant. You're comparing Hulk to Superman. Why? They're not the combatants in this fight.

If you want to compare characters in relation to this thread, then the characters you should be comparing are:

1. Superman - Captain Marvel (the combatants in this fight)
2. Wonder Woman - Thanos (the opponents that were out-headbutted by the combatants of this fight)
3. Luddendorf - Hulk (powerhouses that were overpowered by the characters in #2).

Originally posted by FrothByte
Yeah... no. I'm pretty sure you pulled that 10% number from your ass. You have not provided any proof that you can actually do what you said you would do. I could be 4x stronger than another guy, but if I only squat 2 inches lower in preparation for my jump and push through my heels never engaging my toes, I'm pretty sure he has a good chance at out-jumping me.

As for the rest of your argument, I didn't bother replying to it because it's irrelevant. You're comparing Hulk to Superman. Why? They're not the combatants in this fight.

If you want to compare characters in relation to this thread, then the characters you should be comparing are:

1. Superman - Captain Marvel (the combatants in this fight)
2. Wonder Woman - Thanos (the opponents that were out-headbutted by the combatants of this fight)
3. Luddendorf - Hulk (powerhouses that were overpowered by the characters in #2).

This proves that you are bias. No one jumps off their heels (not that it would matter much anyway). Normal people tend jump the same. There is no great difference in technique. You are making shit up. We are born knowing how to jump from a squatting position (all animals that jump). Better Technique (if that even exists) doesn't increase your jumping distance any significant amount. It's all about strength and mass.

In my first post I claimed I can predict anyone's jumping height to within 10% MOE based off
1) leg strength
2) mass
3) height difference from squat to standing in tippy toes

You are basically arguing a different point. You are claiming there will be a difference in jumping distance based off different variables. I claim the difference is less than 10%. I have done study on jumping years ago with peers and superiors.

CM is being compared to Thanos who is being compared to Hulk.

In other words, CM >Thanos >Hulk>Superman is being argued. That's why Hulk is relevant. You are supporting that connection (Josh's argument).

Originally posted by h1a8
This proves that you are bias. No one jumps off their heels (not that it would matter much anyway). Normal people tend jump the same. There is no great difference in technique. You are making shit up. We are born knowing how to jump from a squatting position (all animals that jump). Better Technique (if that even exists) doesn't increase your jumping distance any significant amount. It's all about strength and mass.

In my first post I claimed I can predict anyone's jumping height to within 10% MOE based off
1) leg strength
2) mass
3) height difference from squat to standing in tippy toes

You are basically arguing a different point. You are claiming there will be a difference in jumping distance based off different variables. I claim the difference is less than 10%. I have done study on jumping years ago with peers and superiors.

CM is being compared to Thanos who is being compared to Hulk.

In other words, CM >Thanos >Hulk>Superman is being argued. That's why Hulk is relevant. You are supporting that connection (Josh's argument).

And again, you prove how little you know about jumping, which is why I don't believe you when you say you actually studied this. Some people power their jumps from their heels and only follow through with their toes at the very end. Some people start their jump with their weight already on the balls of their feet. Some people lean forward more, engaging quads more, some people lean back more, engaging glutes more.

People who are more flexible and limber are able to drop into lower squats or open their legs more in preparation for a jump.

Also just like any explosive athletic activity, the effectiveness of the movement depends a lot on how well you coordinate your muscles to work together to accomplish the maneuver. Thinking that anyone that can do a heavy squat can immediately jump high without ever practicing how to jump high is just plain ignorant on your part.