Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
Tiers are not 'who has the highest feats? who can contain the big bang?'.Otherwise, Kyle would be in a tier above Galactus.
If he has better feats why couldn't he Phil? Ignoring crossovers where Venom is Superman Level and what not is there some Arbitrary Rule where company's scale to the same levels or is it just a battleboard terminology to level the playing field and make nice between franchises?
Also Galactus gets stronger the more he eats so he has a variable powerlevel too.
Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
But, fortunately if we read enough comics, we can eyeball an average, since we're so familiar with them. We can eyeball for example that Kyle isn't operating at levels that he contains Big Bangs, that Superman is not operating at infinite strength etc. We can eye ball how they do against each other, also. We can see that Kyle wouldn't wipe the floor with the entire mid-herald tier, for example, based on how he does against other singular mid-heralds. Kyle is not Raditz-ing them.
There is no average and there never was. There is no eyeball between two very different fictional continuties, you compare feats and statements, relative character portrayals and unfortunately sh*t posting on battle boards. You are once again ignoring feats you don't like. Kyle has low showings just like Goku say needing to put on a protective suit to survive the inner core of Earth in DBS yet I don't hold that against Goku nor would bring it up in a battle of best vs best.
Superman varies from literally comic to comic, arc to arc, so any version you present in any thread unless specified to be from a single writer is going to be a Frankenstein version of composite feats that is hardly any different from compiling a respect thread.
Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
We can eyeball that in general portrayals, Martian Manhunter, or Wonder Woman, or Thor, don't get moon-destroying blasts in the face and smile without moving.
In a general portrayal MM may have heat vision that reaches one trillion degrees celsius temperatures not found anywhere except in the Big Bang 😮💨
In a general portrayal WW may be at a level where her lasso is stopping Multiversal beings like the Phantom Stranger.
Or she maybe struggling against a single bullet shot by a kid with ak-47.
There is no average Phil and there never was.
Just everyone's seperate head cannon and cherry picked feats. Thats all.
Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
Do you agree that in average portrayals, Martian Manhunter, or Wonder Woman, or Thor or [*insert high-end herald beings*] don't get moon-destroying blasts in the face and smile without moving.You're the same guy saying Black Adam punches with big bang fists, so I want to make sure.
You seem to have a problem understanding what a baseline is, and what relative showings are.
There are no averages and I will continue to repeat this until the cows come home to you. You're entire argument is based on battle board terminology that doesn't exist. These characters exist to do the impossible or probable week after week and all we're doing here collectively is picking them out of their fictional universes and comparing them to one another. I honestly think it should be a case by case basis. And it wouldn't be crazy if Black Adam could do that if he scales near Superman class beings who have shattered reality, warped entire time lines, and made the universe go funky town like Superman vs Kal-L during Infinite Crisis.
Just recently Bendis had Superman contemplate destroying the Phantom Zone, an infinite dimension above the multiverse in the sphere of the gods. Something tells me Bendis would have probably made Superman use his fists just like he did on the World Forger and his creation mate.
Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
As a consequence, you try to shoe-in Dragon Ball and Goku "But what if they were in the comics?! The inconsistency would be there!!"Well, they're not in the comics. That's just something you'll have to cope with.
That is true and it goes both ways because the western comic heroes and villains aren't in manga either to get the benefit of less inconsistency.
Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
They're in a medium in which a character like Piccolo, who'd comfortably be placed in the herald tier, gets sodomized by Raditz without even trying. And Raditz, in turn, would be made to eat shit by Nappa. Who, also in turn, would get one-shotted by Vegeta.
What does herald level mean to you? I keep asking these questions and yet no one answers? what does this battle board terminology actually mean to you? Bran said planetary level and admitted that's his head cannon. I say it simply means characters that are top tier heroes and that feats can range from street level to universe level. How do you define these tiers?
Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
It's not the fault of Dragon Ball that within the rules of that Universe, once you're stronger you generally no-sell every other character that has come before you.In essence, you have in the Dragon Ball Universe somebody like Freeza, who can solo an almost untold number of Raditz(es), who'd all be around the mid-herald tier.
So, I dunno...
Can Kyle solo a million Wonder Women?
Probably not most of the time since she has been shown to take out Multiversal beings so the question is can Freeza? Namek Saga or Golden? Please back this up with Feats or Statements and not powerscaling please Phil.
Originally posted by Philosophía [/i]
You're completely ignoring relative portrayals [for obvious reasons], and using solely high-end feats, to justify a position that crashes anytime you see that the gap between somebody like Kyle [high herald] and somebody like Black Adam [mid-herald] is -- and I do mean in the most generous way -- thousands to millions of times smaller than somebody like Freeza and the Piccolo who blows up the moon with a casual blast.
I'm not ignoring anything. I'm bringing up low showing and high showings in the same example like I did with Flash and other characters like Thor. I still want to see where you place being like Flash in DBZ and other characters I've mentioned in this discussion like Krona with the emotional entities or the Upside Down Man.
And why is everyone ignoring the relative power escalation of Iron Man and how he is still held to just one tier and not allowed to progress up?
