Originally posted by DeadpoolXXXThe Broly movie took place several arcs ago. Vegeta/Goku have trained extensively in that time, and have also battled some very strong opponents -- their powers have increased by orders of magnitude.
i read this issue but now i'm lost.in the movie base form broly was owning base and even super saiyan vegeta with no problem. it took vegeta using super saiyan god form to beat base broly definitively.
but now vegeta can casually pick broly apart in his base form? 😕
Flip side, Broly has been doing some minor training, but he is only just now starting to show any real progress/development -- and as mentioned above, he seems extremely reluctant to fight seriously, in fear of losing control and going berserker again(hence why he stays in his base form.)
That said, base Broly was still able to give SS1 Vegeta a decent fight(which is a great showing in its own right)... And even now the Saiyans(and even Beerus) sort of shit their pants at the thought of Broly raging out again.
Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
i read this issue but now i'm lost.in the movie base form broly was owning base and even super saiyan vegeta with no problem. it took vegeta using super saiyan god form to beat base broly definitively.
but now vegeta can casually pick broly apart in his base form? 😕
He was going full berserker in the movie, wasn't he? Broly smash and all that. Not the same thing as trying to keep your cool during a sparring session.
And keep in mind both Goku and Vegeta have made progress since then. Zenkais are on a whole different level in Super.
Originally posted by Galan007
The Broly movie took place several arcs ago. Vegeta/Goku have trained extensively in that time, and have also battled some very strong opponents -- their powers have increased by orders of magnitude.Flip side, Broly has been doing some minor training, but he is only just now starting to show any real progress/development -- and as mentioned above, he seems extremely reluctant to fight seriously, in fear of losing control and going berserker again(hence why he stays in his base form.)
That said, base Broly was still able to give SS1 Vegeta a decent fight(which is a great showing in its own right)... And even now the Saiyans(and even Beerus) sort of shit their pants at the thought of Broly raging out again.
Originally posted by StiltmanFTWmakes more sense now. my bad for having not kept up with the manga. didn't realize vegeta was that much stronger now.
He was going full berserker in the movie, wasn't he? Broly smash and all that. Not the same thing as trying to keep your cool during a sparring session.And keep in mind both Goku and Vegeta have made progress since then. Zenkais are on a whole different level in Super.
so what is the current pecking order in the manga? like where does beast gohan sit (because this issue confirmed that he surpassed goku and vegeta), where does broly sit (because goku said he might be stronger then beerus in the movie) etc?
Originally posted by DeadpoolXXXThe statement made about Beast Gohan surpassing Goku/Vegeta came from Bulma, who is: a.) not a fighter, and b.) can't sense ki. That said, I wouldn't at all be surprised if Gohan is indeed on par with(if not slightly above) Goku and Vegeta now, simply because of all the wank he's gotten since the movie's release.
so what is the current pecking order in the manga? like where does beast gohan sit (because this issue confirmed that he surpassed goku and vegeta), where does broly sit (because goku said he might be stronger then beerus in the movie) etc?
As for anyone being scaled to Beerus: you can take it all with a grain of salt. No matter how powerful the characters get, Beerus is always written to be supremely in the #1 spot, for no reason at all.
So current scaling would be something like:
Beerus > Black Freeza >> Beast Gohan ~/> TUI Goku ~ UE Vegeta > FP Broly
*Guys like Granolah, Gas, Moro, and SSB Gogeta would also fall somewhere in between Freeza and Broly(ie. less powerful than the former, but more powerful than the latter)... And for what it's worth, after Broly is when we start getting into the 'lower', Jiren-tiers of power. DBS is bonkers.
Originally posted by Galan007
The statement made about Beast Gohan surpassing Goku/Vegeta came from Bulma, who is: a.) not a fighter, and b.) can't sense ki. That said, I wouldn't at all be surprised if Gohan is indeed on par with(if not slightly above) Goku and Vegeta now, simply because of all the wank he's gotten since the movie's release.As for anyone being scaled to Beerus: you can take it all with a grain of salt. No matter how powerful the characters get, Beerus is always written to be supremely in the #1 spot, for no reason at all.
So current scaling would be something like:
Beerus > Black Freeza >> Beast Gohan ~/> TUI Goku ~ UE Vegeta > FP Broly*Guys like Granolah, Gas, Moro, and SSB Gogeta would also fall somewhere in between Freeza and Broly(ie. less powerful than the former, but more powerful than the latter)... And for what it's worth, after Broly is when we start getting into the 'lower', Jiren-tiers of power. DBS is bonkers.
gohan's power up felt so not earned. like dude went from a STEMcel to mui goku level in one movie. same with piccolo, but at least in piccolo case at least he was training
gohan was explicitly shown to gave up his training in his adult life.
goku and vegeta went through over a hundred episodes of DBS and several movies to get to their current level.
Gohan's gone back and forth with his training throughout DBS. However, he has always gotten these gargantuan powerups from out of nowhere -- that's been his thing since the Raditz saga. That's why I'm not exactly surprised that Gohan is on par with Goku and Vegeta now... But the design of his Beast form is laughably stupid. Looks like shitty DBAF fanart.
With Piccolo, he only got that powerful by wishing for the Dragon to draw out his potential or w/e... And iirc, the Dragon even threw in "a little extra" of a boost because he and Piccolo are homies or some shit.
Originally posted by Galan007The moment that happened I immediately asked myself why not everyone does that.
With Piccolo, he only got that powerful by wishing for the Dragon to draw out his potential or w/e... And iirc, the Dragon even threw in "a little extra" of a boost because he and Piccolo are homies or some shit.
True.
I guess if the stakes are high enough, and Goku/Vegeta cannot possibly hope to beat their opponent in the time they have, they're more open to powerups like that. Hence other 'cheats' like fusion and whatnot.
On that note, I'm pretty sure Elder Kai offered to unlock Goku's potential in the anime(just before the ToP), but they didn't have enough time to preform the ritual.
That's the crazy part. Goku was getting slaughtered during the tournament of power and at one point, he couldn't even stand, but moments later (literally), he was able to fight one of the most powerful beings in the anime H2H. The Saiyans power were rewritten and morphed by the writers to levels that doesn't even make sense.
Yeah. Even though the anime/manga milked the shit out of it, the entire ToP took place over the course of a mere 48 minutes.
In that time Goku, for example, went from being tiers below a suppressed Jiren, to surpassing an all-out/limit-breaker Jiren... And don't even get me started on Broly's power-creep during the movie.