No, it's not a pocket Universe: https://i.imgur.com/LtfKJT3.jpg
Still, this is only 1 Multiversal showing. Literally everything else it has ever done is Uni or Uni+ max.
Originally posted by GenghisJuan
No, it's not a pocket Universe: https://i.imgur.com/LtfKJT3.jpgStill, this is only 1 Multiversal showing. Literally everything else it has ever done is Uni or Uni+ max.
I said pocket universes. Plural. Said pocket universes would make up the multiverse referred to in that scan.
Marvel realms that aren't part of the main multiversal hierarchy (i.e 616 and its divergent timelines, with all the associated Abstracts we know) are either megaverses (Such as the Ultraverse and Shadowline)or pocket universes/realms.
The soul gem contains pocket universes which lack the structure of a proper marvel universe.
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I said pocket universes. Plural. Said pocket universes would make up the multiverse referred to in that scan.Marvel realms that aren't part of the main multiversal hierarchy (i.e 616 and its divergent timelines, with all the associated Abstracts we know) are either megaverses (Such as the Ultraverse and Shadowline)or pocket universes/realms.
The soul gem contains pocket universes which lack the structure of a proper marvel universe.
Where are you getting any of that from? The scan just says it contains pocket universe and has enough space for an ENTIRE Multiverse. Saying they're just pocket universes makes no sense based off of the scan from Secret Wars: Soldier Supreme Annual that I showed. Regardless, we both agree that it's only Universal (as I've said, it being Multiversal is a pretty big outlier all things considered), so I think this is rather pointless. IG Users struggle with Universal beings and perform feats limited to one reality, so they're clearly there most of the time.
Originally posted by GenghisJuan
Where are you getting any of that from? The scan just says it contains pocket universe and has enough space for an ENTIRE Multiverse. Saying they're just pocket universes makes no sense based off of the scan from Secret Wars: Soldier Supreme Annual that I showed. Regardless, we both agree that it's only Universal (as I've said, it being Multiversal is a pretty big outlier all things considered), so I think this is rather pointless. IG Users struggle with Universal beings and perform feats limited to one reality, so they're clearly there most of the time.
Where im getting it from is Marvel canon.
I dont put myself out there like that without having evidence to back it up. Thats something you'll soon get to know about me.
Below you'll see a scan from Marvels Handbook on realities and alternate universes.
Read the section titled omniverse: a glossary of terms:
In Marvel canon, you have the main universes such as 616 and its divergent realities, with their complex structures and cosmological hierarchies (LT and the Abstracts), anything else is either a megaverse (realms that lack the structure of of a main reality but are more closely tied to Marvel than any other comic book company) or are pocket universes/realms.
I wasnt basing my comment just off of the scan you provided, it was based off of my insight into these matters which allowed me to put things into perspective.
With those official parameters in mind, said universes within the soul stone, would be deemed pocket universes.
As a universal power, that makes sense within the defined scope of its capabilities....universal
Good discussion bro 👆
Originally posted by GenghisJuanJust as the other Norse realms are often called Universes in Marvel, but they are pocket dimensions, and each numbered universe has a set.
I see. So pretty much, the Universes it contains have to be pocket Universes because there aren't any regular Universes outside of the 616 Multiverse, of which it can't contain? Gotcha.
Or Dr Fate's trinkets containing pocket universes in DC.
Impressive nontheless, but not equal to a whole reality.
Originally posted by GenghisJuan
I see. So pretty much, the Universes it contains have to be pocket Universes because there aren't any regular Universes outside of the 616 Multiverse, of which it can't contain? Gotcha.
Exactly that.
Such realities lack the cosmological complexity of proper universes. That's why they can be created by universal powers.
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Oh no.This response is weak. Can you not see that? 🙁
You're getting progressively worse, which is an achievement in itself LMAO
You're gonna make me do it to you again aren't you? 😆
Im starting to think you've got a kinky side cos you're clearly a glutton for punishment.
Let the verbal whipping commence! 😆
If all I had was insults coupled with a similar performance to what you’re currently displaying then yes, one could perhaps consider that a sign of weakness.
However where page to page I’m mopping the floor with your ass as well as dropping insults I’d say it just makes me ruthless, savage or ice cold. Either
description would be most fitting
Can you say ego?
Don’t forget, you came for me 1st and now you’re dealing with the consequences. Boo-hoo b**ch laughingBe humble and know your place.
You want to play that game, huh? Don't say that I didn't warn you idiot.
Already addressed this. In terms of mindset at that point it was barely sentient and mostly an entity of instinct. That point is stated explicitly. It was a neutral power source for Feron.
So lying straight, huh?
Necrom defeated Feron and caused the entity pain. It fled.
Ergo, it was defeated.
Character behaviour and demonstrated power output are two separate things. You cannot discredit the feats by making reference to a characters behaviour. This is a thread about power.
Concession accepted.
Try againWhy though?
Are you a child?
Why are you interested in my age?
[qupte]He was demonstrably more skilled than Rachel as shown in that story arc. However Necrom is still just a mortal man, he was force fed too much power and it overloaded him.[/quote]
And Rachel is what? Not mortal? And now its mortality which is the criteria? Not skill or mindset?
This is straight up hilarious. I want to see just how many hoops you are going to jump here to justify your idiotic agenda.
n the same way a person would be able to stomach three plates of food if they are tackling the plates at a pace they’re comfortable with, over a time period they feel they can comfortably manage it.
However if that very same amount of food is force fed to that person, shoved down their throat at a pace determined by someone else, with no insight or consideration for the persons capacity to ingest that food, then the victim is either going to choke or they’ll throw up way before they get near to finishing the 3rd plate.
Haha, what nonsense is this? Weren't you going on Necrm being more skilled than Rachel and skill being the most important part of handling Phoenix's full power?
So your point is redundant. The only way it could have had any value is if the situation was reversed and Rachel was subjected to the same treatment and through skill was able to wrest control of the power flow and survive.
You still did not answer my question. Here let me simplify, Necrom skilled, Rachel bad skilled, Necrom go boom, Rachel lived.
Now, can you understand it retard?
What makes your point even more redundant is that Rachel never channelled the power into him, she asked the Phoenix Force itself to do it and it complied.
And how is this relevant, idiot?
So it wasn’t Rachel’s energy manipulation skills vs Necroms, here it was simply down to the Phoenix following the will of its chosen host (vs Necrom who was a host via stolen power) and the Phoenix itself overloaded Necrom.You really don’t think things through do you?
Hey neanderthal, can you even form a thought without going "Jean is the most powaful host?" Just curious.
Rachel ended up near dead and comatose. But you didn’t want to highlight that did you? Of course not. Putting things into context doesn’t serve your agenda to win a debate at all costs regardless of whether you’re being truthful or not
This retard think getting into a coma is worse than being atomized.
crylaugh
But thanks for highlighting another differentiating factor between how powerful a host is from another host….the will of the Phoenix itself. It favours who it favours. It is a sentient power source after all with preferencesPhoenix who is your preferred host?
Who the **** cares who that turkey prefers? Bring the feats, retard. Or concede.
I was waiting for you to pull this one out your rectum.Dear Abhi, did you know that the Phoenix firebird is not the sum total of the Phoenix Force. It is just an avatar, a representation of the Big Bang/the universal life-force within reality?
”Feron called upon the Phoenix avatar”
Hey retard, Rachel is not talking about any firebird. Its talking about phoenix force.
Learn to read before talking to me.
In the very same Alan Davis run of Excalibur that your scan comes from, it was explained very clearly in the Phoenixes battle with Galactus that the Phoenix firebird avatar is just an expression/representation of the universal life force within reality:
No, it is said that all of Phoenix's power comes from tapping into future life force. **** off with your shitty reading comprehension.
s ive shown throughout this thread, the Phoenix Force is the Big Bang. The sum and substance of all life/energy native to a universe. In its natural state it is formless and all-encompassing, ambient life as stated on panel.
Hahaha. Oh your bitchass forgot that I debunked that already, huh?
However just like Eternity is the universe and yet requires an M-body/avatar to appear within himself, the Phoenix Force manifests within reality as the firebird avatar.
As you can read here Eternity is an Mbody avatar of the universe and as such isn’t power in itself this Mbody taps into power from that which it embodies, the chronal axis of the universe:
crylaugh
Phoenix doesn't has any M avatar.
The reason these cosmic entities need to use M-Bodies or avatars is because if they gathered all their essence into one being, then that which they represent would not be found anywhere else within the universe. Therefore avatars which tap into their essence are necessary.One of the reasons the Phoenix Force prefers to act through hosts instead of just carrying out its role as the firebird avatar is that as Galactus also explains the universe is a closed system. All energy and matter that is or ever will be within the universe is summed up in the Big Bang. Life feeds on life. There is nothing new created. Energy just transitions from state to state, being to being within that closed system. So when the Phoenix Force/Big Bang takes on sentience and becomes a life form itself within this closed universal system it is then an additional life form that thereby channelling life energy to sustain this firebird avatar instead of its power just being ambient energy there to facilitate future generations.
My true nature is without form touching all that lives
Who gives a shit? Rachel isn't talking about some firebird or M body retard, she is talking about actual phoenix force.
“My natural state is immortal of time and space yet beyond”So the Phoenix is more than just whats represented within reality
“My presence here is sustained by life-force stolen from that which I celebrate”
The avatar cannibalizes life by existing. It is not power in itself, it taps into the universal life-force that is the Phoenix Force/Big Bang.
English, do you read it ****er? Phoenix just steals from future generation and is born from the big bang. Its not big bang for the last ****ing time.
At the end of the run, the Phoenix Force gave up its avatar and allowed Rachel limited access to its power warning her not to draw on more universal life-force as it would be by having a sentient presence in reality itself.Aww. Did I spoil your big moment? You thought you had me didn’t you?
Remember, I didn't start this flamewar. But you can count that I will finish it.
I haven’t denied a single retcon. What I have denied is your claiming retcons whilst being completely unsupported by an official source.
crylaugh
Who said that Beyonder and Secret Wars II are out of continuity you ****ing liar?
There is a difference between adding more detail to a story so those additional elements run parallel to what was originally there and completing changing the nature of something or the actions that took place so the original action is no longer a story element it’s just written out of existence. THAT is a retcon.
crylaugh
See this bitchass backtracking now.
Weak in confidence at the time? Yep. Weak in power output? Nope. Theyre separate things. Sorry bro
Nope. Weak af.
Youre so dumb. I haven’t changed a thing. Your level of comprehension is at a shocking low. That last reply was regarding one of the few factors that could result in power differentiation between hostsI don’t have to mention all factors behind a hosts differing power levels when the point of discussion at that time was regarding a scan highlighting just one of them.
Youre not on my level. Stay in your lane
**** off with your lies and shitty reading comprehension.
Why would i have to disprove something that you have failed to prove in the 1st place? laughingGod Doom is surprised by Cyclops attack. You have zero evidence to say that if they both stepped on to the battle field prepared for a fight, that Cyclops could've harmed him.
Therefore hyping him harming God Doom with a surprise attack as the best Phoenix feat is weak. The incident was inconclusive.
I will not address this point again. I've won this line of argument
I accept your concession that Scott>Jean as phoenix host. Feats matter, your bitchiness. Not your shitty arguments.
