Originally posted by MrMind
DK was achieving some range of omniscience/omnipotencethe dark multiverse was all apart of him after he took over dark multiverse manhattan's power
his intention was set to create a multiverse that destroy all multiverses in the omniverse
Or they can’t see when Superman is involved against them. This is why he couldn’t see past the point where Superman is coming at him.
It’s the S lol.
Originally posted by Stoicor he’s gotten more powerful? They wrote him above DK level. Anyway they made him powerful enough to rag doll DK. An invulnerable character that tanked a universal destroying explosion point blank. A guy that destroyed a universe in a tantrum.
Exactly. But a no limits fallacy is in effect. It allows people to forget several events that happened to Superboy Prime in earlier stories. There were those that were far less powerful than Doctor M that pushed Superboy Prime on a physical level. If he was this unbeatable character how then was he sent into the Speedforce? There was a period in time that he didn't exist as well, but yeah we need to acknowledge the punches.
Originally posted by Stoic
Or DK and Perpetua weren’t as powerful as you thought that they were. Show me where it stated that Prime had become more powerful than he was when he fought Monarch. Cosmic King Thor survived a character that casually destroyed universes when he fought the Black Winter.
No idea why you’re bringing thor into this and no one is denied his feat. But you have to see the hypocrisy in your post here.
One minute you are quick to dismiss DK and Perpetua but have no problem accepting whatever positives are said about KT or Blackwinter.
Originally posted by GalacticStormhow can you have a degree of omniscience. You either can see everything or you can't. It's like unique... you are or aren't. You aren't unique, but you are very, very special.
No comic book character will display total omniscience within a story even if theyre said by canon to possess a degree of omniscience as then the story would be very dull. No one would truly be a threat removing all drama and engagement from the plot.Dr Manhattan however has displayed an impressive level of omniscience as ive touched on page 8 of this thread:
Sufficient omniscience that if Darkest Knight truly possessed the full Dr M power-set then he should have been able to foresee Superboy Primes attacks and take action ahead of time removing him as a threat before he became a threat.
Originally posted by Diesldude
Describing power levels of Perpetua and DK will be a waste of time, hundreds of examples in the comic and their power levels have already been discussed. And no DK isn’t Monarch level. 😂No idea why you’re bringing thor into this and no one is denied his feat. But you have to see the hypocrisy in your post here.
One minute you are quick to dismiss DK and Perpetua but have no problem accepting whatever positives are said about KT or Blackwinter.
Let's not skip past the main subject here. Superboy Prime had a beginning correct? Just need a yes or no. If you say no, that would mean that he has been around longer than the Source Wall itself. If you say yes, that means that we can measure the length of time that he has been in existence. If a an omniscient master of time, space, reality, matter manipulation, etc knew these things and could do these things, what could stop him, her, it from travelling back in time and simply removing Prime's time line, or placing him in a time loop?
Did you see DK resort to any of that? If he was able to do so but didn't, he jobbed. Monarch gave Superboy Prime a harder fight than DK did, and Prime was amped as well. How again am I being a hypocrite by pointing out that Cosmic King Thor took several assaults by the Black Winter after you mentioning that Superboy Prime survived the detruction of universal forces? I mentioned Cosmic King Thor, because the Black Winter was also able to strike with universal force. You seem to have mistaken my post as a means of lowballing the Superboy Prime vs Monarch battle. That wasn't the case.
So tell me, how again does Superboy Prime stop the myriad 616 beings that are capable of manipulating reality, time, space, and are all knowing? Because DK failed to do so? DK brawled it out and somehow got his ass kicked. Are there any citations that state that DK was using time manipulation attacks on Prime? Any that state that he attempted to use reality manipulation attacks on Prime? If it wasn't stated there really is no hard proof that he fought to the best of his ability, which is just another way of saying that he jobbed.
Again, Prime had a clear beginning. This means that an omniscient master of manipulating time could dial back to a time before Prime's time and effectively BFR him.
Originally posted by Diesldude
You’re a failure debater period. QWERTY made you realize that prime isn’t just a heightened kryptonian you were incorrectly pushing like a cheap corner pharmacist. If you dig a little deeper, something you never do, you would see the post he quoted was Galan’s and galan was replying to me in agreement to my post. That’s your style, you never read the comic, come up with a view that agrees with your biases against dc based on superficial out of context scans in the ownage threads. A I’ll I’ve seen from GA that he’s a stubborn carverlite level debater. You make child like argument and never accept other’s view even when the freaking comic itself tells you that you were wrong.I showed you a panel in the comic where prime himself might as well be directly telling you that are wrong and you still won’t accept it. Arguing with you is like arguing with a girl on her period. If DK came out here and say he tried everything, you still won’t believe him. You’re not a debater, you just show up on “that time of the month” and argue just for the sake of arguing. 👆
As debaters we can never have access to or be expected to have read all available comics that are out there.
However you were consistently asserting a point about SBP without providing conclusive evidence to back up that claim.
Based solely off of what you were presenting i was telling you it doesnt demonstrate what youre asserting it does.
It was your burden of responsibility to back up your claims.
You failed and i had you on life support. Qwertys the true Superman and gave some validity to one strand of your argument.
The remaining 90% remains inconclusive and easily dismissed. Better DM Qwerty 👆
Originally posted by Diesldude
or he’s gotten more powerful? They wrote him above DK level. Anyway they made him powerful enough to rag doll DK. An invulnerable character that tanked a universal destroying explosion point blank. A guy that destroyed a universe in a tantrum.
They didnt write him above DMs level.
You have a theme of DM explicitly through the latter stages of Death Metal confirming he has his power tied up in his schemes and stating he doesnt want to divert any to properly deal with SBP.
THAT is a feasible explanation for why SBP was able to engage him as successfully as he did.
He has NEVER demonstrated such prowess against a being of such a level (Anti Monitor was severely weakened and SBP just dealt the finishing blow so dont even try it lol )
If we arent dealing with a Darkest Knight that was hampered then the only other option is it was PIS.
Regardless as ive said in these last couple pages, Superboy Prime conclusively demonstrated he was not on DKs level as the power backlash that engulfed them both left SBP dead/comatose whilst DK was unfazed, had an epic battle with Wonder Woman straight afterwards and was still confldent he could go on to beat multiple Perpetua level beings thereby demonstrating a power level WAY beyond Superboy Prime.
Logic and objectivity make all the difference 🙂
Originally posted by Old Man Whirly!
how can you have a degree of omniscience. You either can see everything or you can't. It's like unique... you are or aren't. You aren't unique, but you are very, very special.
The same way you can have degrees of infinite power.
Cube beings such as Kubik, Shaper of Worlds and Kosmos/Maker are regarded by the abstracts as "minor omnipotents"
Within the closed bubble of one reality their power is practically unlimited. However there are others within that sphere who are more powerful and theres more to reality than one universe.
Dr Manhattans powers allow him to see, past, present and future and to psionically manipulate events across the timeline with a thought:
With such power DK could have easily removed the threat of Superboy Prime.
So either Darkest Knight didnt truly possess the full range of Dr Ms abilities (as simply inhabiting his body could possibly just give him the raw power but not the know how), he was hampered (as indicated by his multiple statements regarding his power being tied up in his schemes) or its PIS.
I'll let you choose. All result in SBP not being as uber as claimed 🙂
Youre a smart guy. I aint telling you a thing you dont know. Your long period of inactivity has just made you a lil rusty.
Its cool. I got you though bro 😉👆
Originally posted by GalacticStormNo, infinite is also infinite GS.
The same way you can have degrees of infinite power.Cube beings such as Kubik, Shaper of Worlds and Kosmos/Maker are regarded by the abstracts as "minor omnipotents"
Within the closed bubble of one reality their power is practically unlimited. However there are others within that sphere who are more powerful and theres more to reality than one universe.
Dr Manhattans powers allow him to see, past, present and future and to psionically manipulate events across the timeline with a thought:
With such power DK could have easily removed the threat of Superboy Prime.
So either Darkest Knight didnt truly possess the full range of Dr Ms abilities (as simply inhabiting his body could possibly just give him the raw power but not the know how), he was hampered (as indicated by his multiple statements regarding his power being tied up in his schemes) or its PIS.
I'll let you choose. All result in SBP not being as uber as claimed 🙂
Youre a smart guy. I aint telling you a thing you dont know. Your long period of inactivity has just made you a lil rusty.
Its cool. I got you though bro 😉👆
Originally posted by Stoic
Let's not skip past the main subject here. Superboy Prime had a beginning correct? Just need a yes or no. If you say no, that would mean that he has been around longer than the Source Wall itself. If you say yes, that means that we can measure the length of time that he has been in existence. If a an omniscient master of time, space, reality, matter manipulation, etc knew these things and could do these things, what could stop him, her, it from travelling back in time and simply removing Prime's time line, or placing him in a time loop?Did you see DK resort to any of that? If he was able to do so but didn't, he jobbed. Monarch gave Superboy Prime a harder fight than DK did, and Prime was amped as well. How again am I being a hypocrite by pointing out that Cosmic King Thor took several assaults by the Black Winter after you mentioning that Superboy Prime survived the detruction of universal forces? I mentioned Cosmic King Thor, because the Black Winter was also able to strike with universal force. You seem to have mistaken my post as a means of lowballing the Superboy Prime vs Monarch battle. That wasn't the case.
So tell me, how again does Superboy Prime stop the myriad 616 beings that are capable of manipulating reality, time, space, and are all knowing? Because DK failed to do so? DK brawled it out and somehow got his ass kicked. Are there any citations that state that DK was using time manipulation attacks on Prime? Any that state that he attempted to use reality manipulation attacks on Prime? If it wasn't stated there really is no hard proof that he fought to the best of his ability, which is just another way of saying that he jobbed.
Again, Prime had a clear beginning. This means that an omniscient master of manipulating time could dial back to a time before Prime's time and effectively BFR him.
You want a yes and no answer right? Here I’ll give it to you..
Yes.
That’s my answer and I’ll throw you some more bits...
Yes he has a beginning.. Now I can tell you why your “if yes, then...” Is wrong, actually I did already in a couple of responses to you. You still didn’t pick up on it because you don’t know who prime is and where he came from. If you did, you would know why DK could NOT do what your intending and why nobody in marvel can either. I’ll explain it to you and your friend GS because he doesn’t get it either.
Is prime from marvel? If the battle is in marvel those beings don’t have access to dc let alone earth prime. If they did and go there to stop prime, what happens? Self bfr. You just outted your best/only shot in a self bfr.
Originally posted by Old Man Whirly!
No, infinite is also infinite GS.
As i quite capably demonstrated there are levels to all of these throwaway terms within comics.
The crux of the matter is if DK had the full Dr M powerset then he had an ability to foresee what would happen and when it would happen. With that insight he couldve then enacted the other ability i conveyed which is his ability to make alterations across the timeline.
PIS or he was hampered or he just didnt have the full Dr M powerset.
Make your choice! 😱