Originally posted by GalacticStormWork GS, I haven't been in London for 10 odd years, KSA, Cairo, KSA again now 3 years in Naija. I'll take this to pm as you never know who is stalking bud.
Youre in Nigeria?!! How come?! Last i heard you lived in London mate. I'm way behind lolItd be boring as hell if everyone agreed 😄
Originally posted by GalacticStormagain you’re not comprehending the scans or you stubbornly refuse to accept them. Prime clearly states that he will try to change the earths.
AGAIN. Its all about interpretation. Your argument isn’t being verified by any conclusive commentary. Its you piecing together the ambiguous and crafting your own take on things and trying to assert that it’s the official line.
That’s not how this works im afraid
As convinced that you are that your interpretation is correct you have to preface it with “in my opinion” and accept that its not canon until DC states it is in a conclusive manner.
Darkest Knight had just created 52 new realities, each with a evil Superman archetype.
Everything was new and in still in flux, said versions had yet to be established as the permanent multiverse.Superboy Prime saw that when an evil archetype was knocked unconscious, then on the planet they were from, a good archetype takes his place:
https://imgur.com/d4EhDbF
No on panel verification is given as to what happened. SBP even states he doesn’t know what happened. So who made you the authority to tell us DCs official stance?
This whole event from the discovery of the Totality onwards was about good vs evil, anti-crisis vs crisis. As we saw when falters in reality the other rises to prominence. So this could simply be a continuation of that same long established theme.
As I said before, Darkest Knight was the one maintaining these nightmare realities and trying to transition them to permanency, it was a work in progress.
After SBP sees how him hitting the evil archetype leads to the rise of the good equivalent, he reasons that if he kills Darkest Knight, can he create the same effect across all of the last 52. We then see SBP flying directly at DK
https://imgur.com/eLjrEBSSBP collides with DK thereby having the side effect of causing good to become dominant in the worlds DK created:
https://imgur.com/0r8qXobYou see a world where SBP is a part of a superhero team. Another where he had a kid and another where hes signing autographs for fans.
So where your interpretation is that SBP has some reality altering power that’s never confirmed in writing or through artistic depiction.
My interpretation is that it was the culmination of a theme of good vs evil that’s Snyder had been building up to and by attacking DK who was the source of the crsis/nightmare worlds and the power that maintained them, good began to take a stronghold and we saw what was possible.
When Darkest Knight disappeared and regained his bearings after that initial assault you see that crisis/evil regains the upper hand on those worlds as evidenced by Superboy Primes comments:
[B]“Now all I hear are screams. Pain. Anger. Where is that bat guy hiding?”
https://imgur.com/gRVGKXl
So as I said, reality was in flux and DK was in the process of trying to make his evil worlds the “last 52” permanent.
As DK was attacked meaning good gained the upperhand it affected change on reality as a side effect as DK was powering these nightmare worlds.
There is no confirmation of a reality altering punch. That’s just your preferred interpretation. Is it possible he has such an ability? Of course. Is it a confirmed ability that you can assert as canon? Absolutely not. No matter how strongly you believe in your interpretation.
However SBP states clear as day that he wonders if he kills DK would it have the knock on effect of changing the worlds to good versions.
You see SBP attack DK and that’s what happens: [/B]
He hits the supermen, or dk and he can make cha he’s or just destroy. What happens to Marvel if he does the same to TOAA? Marvel ends.
You’re seeing a fist fight but you admit that reality is manipulated when prime hits DK. So which is it?
You’re saying he gets energy drained, when has that happened and he has his suit on.
Or gets hit by the red sunlight - you forget he has his suit on.
You think he can be warped, show me anyone doing this to prime. He’s encountered beings like DK, Mxy.
Lock him away? Show me any prison that can hold him. He punched out of the phantom zone, escaped out of the speed force while under a red sun.
None of your tactics work against him and your unsupported assumptions have been thoroughly addressed multiple times and with scans and character statements. Right now I’m just repeating myself thinking that if I do it enough I’d get through to you but it’s working. Kinda reminds me to conversing with Trollberto and carter. Like them you also suffer from the last word syndrome. You can go ahead and respond back with “something like it’s been established that sbp is a regular flying brick...”. You can say whatever you want but you didn’t convince anyone here, not even carter because he just hates the S and had already voted against prime. :up.
Prime says "Can i change all of them if i kill this monster?"
Prime doesnt claim any ability to change reality directly. He reasons after what happened with the evil superman that taking out the source of the nightmare worlds, would have the same effect i.e causing good to become dominant over the 52 worlds.
He explicitly highlights it as a possible side effect from taking out DK who we know is maintaining said worlds.
SBP attacks DK and Good starts to take hold and SBP sees glimpses of whats possible if good triumphs.
DK gets his bearings meaning evil takes hold hence Prime seeing a return to the evil/nightmare versions of said worlds.
After attacking DK again and finally defeating him, good/anti-crisis prevails and the worlds are changed.
Its presented as a side effect of taking out DK. Not an outcome SBP possesses an ability to directly bring about.
He states: "Can i change all of them if i kill this monster?"
SBP attacked DK thereby disrupting his hold over reality resulting in good prevailing as a side effect. That is all.
As I've demonstrated, ambiguous art without explicit explanatory narration or character commentary can generate different interpretations in different readers.
Sharing said views and talking about the characters we love is cool.
What isnt cool is to assert that your interpretation is canon.
Thats what youre doing here. You are not DC editorial. Be humble. 🙁 👆
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Relax with that tone and language. Its unnecessary. You can disagree and still conduct yourself appropriately.Nowhere have i asserted that it is canon that DK was weakened after his battle with Perpetua.
What i did say was that he was either weakened/hampered in some way OR its Plot Induced Stupidity.
See your opinion isn’t based on a statement in the comics. It’s based on your self belief that this shouldn’t be a close battle. While I agree that this is an outlier for Prime, it’s not because DK was weakened
Nothing in the comics suggest that he was weakened.
Originally posted by Diesldude
again you’re not comprehending the scans or you stubbornly refuse to accept them. Prime clearly states that he will try to change the earths.He hits the supermen, or dk and he can make cha he’s or just destroy. What happens to Marvel if he does the same to TOAA? Marvel ends.
You’re seeing a fist fight but you admit that reality is manipulated when prime hits DK. So which is it?
You’re saying he gets energy drained, when has that happened and he has his suit on.
Or gets hit by the red sunlight - you forget he has his suit on.
You think he can be warped, show me anyone doing this to prime. He’s encountered beings like DK, Mxy.
Lock him away? Show me any prison that can hold him. He punched out of the phantom zone, escaped out of the speed force while under a red sun.None of your tactics work against him and your unsupported assumptions have been thoroughly addressed multiple times and with scans and character statements. Right now I’m just repeating myself thinking that if I do it enough I’d get through to you but it’s working. Kinda reminds me to conversing with Trollberto and carter. Like them you also suffer from the last word syndrome. You can go ahead and respond back with “something like it’s been established that sbp is a regular flying brick...”. You can say whatever you want but you didn’t convince anyone here, not even carter because he just hates the S and had already voted against prime. :up.
Despite his armour, the all powerful SBP gets scorched by red sun radiation
Despite his armour the omnipotent SBP gets battered unconscious with magic lightning:
https://imgur.com/NH2lIPL
https://imgur.com/Vaf3X0S
The infinitely powerful SBP manhandled by Black Lanterns and has his armour ripped off him:
Prime encountering beings such as Mxy and DK who dont use their reality warping on him is not the same as reality warping does not work on Prime. I hope you dont need me to explain the difference.
The laws of reality clearly do work on Prime as reality corrected itself when Prime collided with his future self and Prime was shunted back to Earth Prime powerless:
Prime ages and is therefore mortal and subject to the laws of time:
He can therefore be affected by chronal manipulation and aged to dust or de-aged into being a foetus. 🙂
Originally posted by xJLxKing
You’re saying he was weakened or hampered because you feel Superboy shouldn’t be on the same levelSee your opinion isn’t based on a statement in the comics. It’s based on your self belief that this shouldn’t be a close battle. While I agree that this is an outlier for Prime, it’s not because DK was weakened
Nothing in the comics suggest that he was weakened.
No. Im saying he was either weak/hampered OR it was PIS. We'll never know which one unless an official source sheds clarity.
Whether its the former or the latter DK never brought his full range of abilities to the table, therefore you cant then apply ABC logic and evaluate who you believe DK is superior to in Marvel (whilst referencing his full range of abilities) and then give an auto win to Superboy Prime over those same people (whilst ignoring the fact that DK didntuse 99% of his abilities and just resorted to fisticuffs)
I hope thats brought some clarity to my stance.
Happy to discuss further. Keep it civil 😉
Originally posted by Old Man Whirly!
SBP's powers had increased with his age.
An increase in strength of the Kryptonian power set is to be expected with maturity.
These guys however are interpreting ambiguous art to give SBP new powers that are not confirmed officially and are asserting them as canon.
Doesnt work like that 😬
The bias is real. These guys want to weigh up who they believe DK can beat in Marvel(referencing his full range of abilities) then say SBP beat DK so he can therefore beat all of those Marvel characters to but conveniently ignore that DK didnt use all of those same abilities in his fight with SBP.
Absurd! 😱
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Despite his armour, the all powerful SBP gets scorched by red sun radiationDespite his armour the omnipotent SBP gets battered unconscious with magic lightning:
https://imgur.com/NH2lIPL
https://imgur.com/Vaf3X0SThe infinitely powerful SBP manhandled by Black Lanterns and has his armour ripped off him:
Prime encountering beings such as Mxy and DK who dont use their reality warping on him is not the same as reality warping does not work on Prime. I hope you dont need me to explain the difference.
The laws of reality clearly do work on Prime as reality corrected itself when Prime collided with his future self and Prime was shunted back to Earth Prime powerless:
Prime ages and is therefore mortal and subject to the laws of time:
He can therefore be affected by chronal manipulation and aged to dust or de-aged into being a foetus. 🙂
Do you even know what you’re saying?
First of all, Prime’s armor is not there to act some form of shield, it was made inside the Speed Force so Prime can absorb solar radiation quicker.
Second, what’s the point of showing the BL rings? That is a feat for Prime, because anyone alive that wears the rings are corrupt. Prime was able to resist that aspect of the ring.
In one your scans you show Prime attacking and killing Time Trapper, his future self, and you say Prime ages like that take away form Prime.
The fact that’s what you take away proves you are not understanding the scans.
Prime in that scene attack himself, by killing Trapper, he basically was erasing himself from the timeline.
Originally posted by SquallX
Do you even know what you’re saying?First of all, Prime’s armor is not there to act some form of shield, it was made inside the Speed Force so Prime can absorb solar radiation quicker.
Second, what’s the point of showing the BL rings? That is a feat for Prime, because anyone alive that wears the rings are corrupt. Prime was able to resist that aspect of the ring.
I do know what im saying 🙂
If you follow the flow of the thread and read my comments in context i.e read what points i was actually replying to you'd see that Diesldude presented the armour as meaning that SBP couldnt be harmed by red sun radiation due to its constant funelling of yellow sun radiation.
I debunked that showing that even with said armour red sun radiation is a threat 🙂
I then went on to show how easily removed that armour is anyway. Thats why i showed that Black Lantern scan.
Anytime my line of argument is too complex for you to process feel free to ask for clarification.
Happy to help 🙂
Originally posted by SquallX
In one your scans you show Prime attacking and killing Time Trapper, his future self, and you say Prime ages like that take away form Prime.The fact that’s what you take away proves you are not understanding the scans.
Prime in that scene attack himself, by killing Trapper, he basically was erasing himself from the timeline.
NOPE. I said Prime and Time Trapper collide with each other and reality reacts and corrects itself destroying Trapper, depowering Prime and shunting him back to Earth Prime thereby showing the very real effects the laws of reality have on Prime 🙂
Im misinterpreting and not understanding scans you say? 😕
Lets see what the actual comic says about the situation:
Exactly what i said 😱 😆
Originally posted by GalacticStormlol you haven’t debunked anything. You’re just making stuff up. 😂 prime destroys marvel by flying into TOAA don’t mad he was going to do the same thing with DC.
I do know what im saying 🙂If you follow the flow of the thread and read my comments in context i.e read what points i was actually replying to you'd see that Diesldude presented the armour as meaning that SBP couldnt be harmed by red sun radiation due to its constant funelling of yellow sun radiation.
I debunked that showing that even with said armour red sun radiation is a threat 🙂
I then went on to show how easily removed that armour is anyway. Thats why i showed that Black Lantern scan.
Anytime my line of argument is too complex for you to process feel free to ask for clarification.
Happy to help 🙂
Im making stuff up?
Im the one insisting on conclusive on panel evidence Youre the one stringing stories together based on ambiguous art. Thatll be making stuff up 😱
Furthermore, if youre commenting saying red sun radiation isnt an issue when Superboy Prime has his armour on then i show a scan of SBP getting fried by said radiation whilst hes got his armour on then thats basically your point debunked 😆
People can read DD 😉
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
No. Im saying he was either weak/hampered OR it was PIS. We'll never know which one unless an official source sheds clarity.Whether its the former or the latter DK never brought his full range of abilities to the table, therefore you cant then apply ABC logic and evaluate who you believe DK is superior to in Marvel (whilst referencing his full range of abilities) and then give an auto win to Superboy Prime over those same people (whilst ignoring the fact that DK didntuse 99% of his abilities and just resorted to fisticuffs)
I hope thats brought some clarity to my stance.
Happy to discuss further. Keep it civil 😉
You are making baseless theories because you dont know how the issue portrayed Superboy
ABSOLUTELY NOTHING suggests that FK was weakened or hampered. Nothing.
All evidence point to Superboy performing at or above the level that he was previously generally portrayed at.
A character in comics not using their full power is a silly excuse. I can point out to too many Cosmic Beings who've had some level of power be forgotten in fight. Hell, even the fight between WW and DK looked like they were just smashing planets between each other or punching each other. Should we assume they were both weakened?
Originally posted by xJLxKing
Yeah, that's now how this is going to workYou are making baseless theories because you dont know how the issue portrayed Superboy
ABSOLUTELY NOTHING suggests that FK was weakened or hampered. Nothing.
All evidence point to Superboy performing at or above the level that he was previously generally portrayed at.
A character in comics not using their full power is a silly excuse. I can point out to too many Cosmic Beings who've had some level of power be forgotten in fight. Hell, even the fight between WW and DK looked like they were just smashing planets between each other or punching each other. Should we assume they were both weakened?
You are missing the point entirely and arguing over a point thats not being asserted as canon.
I said either its a case of DK being weakened or hampered in some form or its Plot Induced Stupidity. (Look up the forum rules for PIS)
I never asserted a weakening as being canon, im all about conclusive evidence, so why youre pursuing me as if i did is baffling. Read and digest the points in play and then you'll find you'll be doing a lot less typing.