DOS Doomsday vs Hercules

Originally posted by abhilegend
Are you retarded or something? How's saying all Lanterns have auto shields equal to saying Doomsday didn't break his auto shields?

Originally posted by carver9
Why are you struggling to comprehend this? If Doomsday grabbed his jacket (and he did) there are no shields. This is as basic as I can tell you. Maybe if I gave an example, it would help.

If you got a new haircut and didn't want to mess it up and put a glass bowl on top of your skull so that people won't touch it, it would be next to impossible for Philo to rub his hands through your hair. This is the best description that I think you would understand this simple concept.

So I'm going to say this again, if Doomsday grabbed his jacket, THERE IS NO SHIELDS. Now if you think the shields were there during the beat down, the proof is on you.

Delta, my computer became soaked by your tears as soon as I looked at your reply. You're obviously feeling some type of way about what is being debated here. Mods can easily tell us to get off of this topic but nothing wrong is being said here. It's ok, don't take any of this to the heart.

Originally posted by carver9
What was your question?

Originally posted by carver9
Delta, my computer became soaked by your tears as soon as I looked at your reply. You're obviously feeling some type of way about what is being debated here. Mods can easily tell us to get off of this topic but nothing wrong is being said here. It's ok, don't take any of this to the heart.

Gotta love you use such a weak attempt to say I'm hurt instead of even acknowledging the multiple points. Concessions accepted. Hulk and everyone at Marvel are weak because Hulk's pants don't get more than torn official canon.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Except in THAT Galactus thread, I thought it was limited to what THAT Galactus did.

The point I had in that thread (or maybe it was Sin?) was that people were just doing pure scaling. Galactus said he was the most powerful ever, yet didn't have the feats. So I asked, what were his feats?

Now, if DOS Superman said he was the most powerful Superman ever, but didn't show feats....I mean, comic narration is nice, but you agree that feats are better, no?

I mean, would YOU ignore Hulk smashing his fists into human Strange?

I wouldn't ignore Hulk melting everyone and failing to kill human Strange just like I'm not ignoring everything that happened in DOS (but you are).

Moral of the story is, if this was any other character, you would be all over this. You've done it in the past and you will continue to do it. I'm done debating this. You know where I stand and I obviously know where you stand on this. I have this thread saved. It was fun debating with you all. All I ask is, be consistent. If you treat one character one way, make sure you give other characters the same treatment. You can hate Hulk but dang, Thor and Silver Surfer fans done nothing to you. Be...consistent.

Originally posted by lawest9
In various posts earlier in this thread I accused you of lowballing Superman when you made statements like Hercules KILLS DD and Herc wins this EASILY, Superman killed DD and died in the process, so in your opinion does Herc die as well in the midst of "killing" DD like Superman did?

Lol... I already explained why I think Hercules destroys DOS Doomsday though. Throughout this thread. HP Doomsday along with any other Doomsdays. Heck, even alternate Doomsday, even the clone Doomsday during Doomsday War ANNIHILATES Hercules. I just think Hercules would break DOS Doomsday.

Your accusations of it being any other character hold as much water as when you accused him of reporting you to a mod. Garland's Stupidity-Sense was just tingling too much for him to ignore.

Answer why if you say Hulk's pants are indestructible, why they're torn. And how Hulk even exists because radiation should have killed him, not given powers. You have a problem with Booster surviving but not with Bruce becoming Hulk instead of at best should have gotten cancer?

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... I already explained why I think Hercules destroys DOS Doomsday though. Throughout this thread. HP Doomsday along with any other Doomsdays. Heck, even alternate Doomsday, even the clone Doomsday during Doomsday War ANNIHILATES Hercules. I just think Hercules would break DOS Doomsday.

@delta..
Hulk pants gets torn because Hulk strength is >>> indestructible items. It was already explained how Bruce survived being exposed by radiation. 🤣🤣🤣

Originally posted by carver9
@delta..
Hulk pants gets torn because Hulk strength is >>> indestructible items. It was already explained how Bruce survived being exposed by radiation. 🤣🤣🤣

Prove it. Hulk himself isn't tearing his pants with his strength. So fail.

So if it was explained why didn't you post earlier? Show the explanation.

Originally posted by lawest9
Which Superman did at the cost of his life, right? You see now why I accused you of lowballing Supes? I don't think Herc has a big chance here without some aid.

Superman is EXTREMELY powerful. Hes the benchmark in most cases for strength and power, BUT, in that book, the writer did a terrible job at displaying his power which leads to Doomsday looking weak. It's not just that. Other characters in the book as well didn't look anywhere close to their peak levels. Again, not even close. Like I've mentioned before, in this same book, Superman got knocked TF out by some pillars (freaking rocks) falling on him. Doomsday kicked those same rocks at Superman after Superman recovered and knocked him out again. He then got knocked out by a gas station explosion. He got knocked out AGAIN from a building blowing up and could hardly stand. Said his legs feel like Jelly. If you think this low of Superman then that's on you but I feel freaking confident Superman can take MUCH more than that but again, if you feel like he's this weak, then it seems like you're pointing fingers at the wrong person who's lowballing.

The writer portrayed Superman terribly. Not only Superman, he portrayed Doomsday terribly as well.

Originally posted by carver9
I wouldn't ignore Hulk melting everyone and failing to kill human Strange just like I'm not ignoring everything that happened in DOS (but you are).

Moral of the story is, if this was any other character, you would be all over this. You've done it in the past and you will continue to do it. I'm done debating this. You know where I stand and I obviously know where you stand on this. I have this thread saved. It was fun debating with you all. All I ask is, be consistent. If you treat one character one way, make sure you give other characters the same treatment. You can hate Hulk but dang, Thor and Silver Surfer fans done nothing to you. Be...consistent.

So you don't ignore this?

Fin Fang Foom, amped, vomiting multiple nukes at Betty/Bruce.

Hulk, She-Hulk, Betty and A-bomb, all significantly amped, fighting.

Hulk and Betty, fighting as if they were in the Dark Dimension and cutting loose.

And about 50 metres away, human Monica, a normal truck, a normal building etc etc, all being perfectly fine.

So this means, as you are being consistent, that we should ignore WBH, lmao. He melted some no-name, featless Wendigo/BiBeast characters etc. I mean, what energy durability feats did this Bi Beast have?

So we have to throw WBH's feat out. Because a normal truck is durable enough to withstand an AMPED Hulk/Betty fighting an amped Foom AND an AMPED Rick/Jennifer, lmao. We cannot ignore this, it happened, and we know what a normal truck durability is like. We even see Vegas in the background - no harm done to them.

As you said, you wouldn't ignore Hulk melting people yet failing to melt humans.

So here, you wouldn't ignore Hulk melting heralds/destroying Umar's realm, yet failing to melt a truck/Monica's sunglasses, right?

This is if we want to be consistent, as you keep insisting I am not.

Originally posted by carver9
Superman is EXTREMELY powerful. Hes the benchmark in most cases for strength and power, BUT, in that book, the writer did a terrible job at displaying his power which leads to Doomsday looking weak. It's not just that. Other characters in the book as well didn't look anywhere close to their peak levels. Again, not even close. Like I've mentioned before, in this same book, Superman got knocked TF out by some pillars (freaking rocks) falling on him. Doomsday kicked those same rocks at Superman after Superman recovered and knocked him out again. He then got knocked out by a gas station explosion. He got knocked out AGAIN from a building blowing up and could hardly stand. Said his legs feel like Jelly. If you think this low of Superman then that's on you but I feel freaking confident Superman can take MUCH more than that but again, if you feel like he's this weak, then it seems like you're pointing fingers at the wrong person who's lowballing.

The writer portrayed Superman terribly. Not only Superman, he portrayed Doomsday terribly as well.

So you're either going to dishonestly omit accumulated damage, or you're intentionally lowballing. Pick your poison.

Originally posted by carver9
So I'm going to say this again, if Doomsday grabbed his jacket, THERE IS NO SHIELDS. Now if you think the shields were there during the beat down, the proof is on you.

You're simply retarded.

So you yet again post ONE showing to try to take away from the entirety of a story line? When in my posts did I say one freaking showing justified the totality of a comic? I even mentioned this to you when you brought up Thor being hit in the back of the head. Why ignore everything that happened in the story and focus on that one rock scene? If it was just the gas station explosion in DOS how in the WORLD can I just use THAT showing against Superman and Doomsday? That entire comic displayed these characters as weak. I've said this on multiple of occasions. I JUST said it again when I quoted lawest. You're trying waaaaayyyy to hard here. The ENTIRE BOOK was written terribly. This is why I said this...

Originally posted by carver9
@dark...

You asking me that question shows that you didn't read my posts. The characters Doomsday fought, of course they are strong but during DOS, they're power level sucked. If Wendigo and Bi Beast (these are examples) during HOTM had to combine strength to lift a car then right after that, someone throw a hand grenade at them, killing both, the showing make their power level suspect.

Another example, if a Mindless One walked up to both Betty and Hulk and one punch koed both and used a kitchen knife to lop limbs off so they couldn't fight anymore, I wouldn't ignore this and say "well, even though they got taken out by a kitchen knife, in issue 92, not written by Pak, Hulk ate a Nuke, so we need to ignore him being sliced up by a kitchen knife". Then, if it kept happening throughout the story, Hulk getting koed by a child hitting him with a baseball bat, Hulk getting koed from falling off a one story roof, Hulk getting hit in the back of the head by a rock ending with him being knocked out. All of this happening in the same story under the same writer, I wouldn't say, "we need to ignore this from Pak and focus on what Stan Lee wrote about Hulk. Yes, he got taken out by a brick under Pak but Stan Lee had him withstand a planet explosion".

I dont know any other way of explaining this. So yes, if Wendigo and Bi Beast had ridiculous showings in HOTM, then I would use that against them but since they didn't have outright terrible showings, I can only go by what I know of them in other books.

You do know that Superman in DOS not only got knocked out by a gas station explosion, he got knocked out by some pillars falling on him AND he got knocked out and could hardly stand from a building exploding on both him and Doomsday. This is not your high end or even mid level Superman we are discussing here. He was WEAK in DOS.

Are you not reading my posts?

Originally posted by abhilegend
I already showed you the scan where the field is outright shown just before Doomsday broke it and grabbed his jacket.

You're simply retarded.

BEFORE HE CHARGED DOOMSDAY. BBEEEEEEEEFFFFFFOOOOOORRRREEEE!!! Doomsday then GRABBED HIS JACKET WHICH MEANS HIS SHIELDS ARE NOT UP and then he pounded on him which resulted in Guy eyes being closed shut throughout the comic. Now again, I do not care about what Guy had on BEFORE charging Doomsday. When Doomsday pounded on him, he was shieldless and how do we know that? Doomsday grabbing his freaking jacket. If you think his shields are up AFTER Doomsday grabbed his jacket, prove it. It's like I'm talking to a child.

Originally posted by carver9
So you yet again post ONE showing to try to take away from the entirety of a story line? When in my posts did I say one freaking showing justified the totality of a comic? I even mentioned this to you when you brought up Thor being hit in the back of the head. Why ignore everything that happened in the story and focus on that one rock scene? If it was just the gas station explosion in DOS how in the WORLD can I just use THAT showing against Superman and Doomsday? That entire comic displayed these characters as weak. I've said this on multiple of occasions. I JUST said it again when I quoted lawest. You're trying waaaaayyyy to hard here. The ENTIRE BOOK was written terribly. This is why I said this...

Are you not reading my posts?

But you're using instances of PIS (the gas station).

Then, you're saying 'well Wendigo had no low showings, so he must be uber'.

But failing to address my point. That a normal truck, a few metres away, was unaffected by four gamma monsters fighting, and a fifth gamma monster spitting multiple nuclear missiles.

So that means in THATS storyline, the HOTM storyline, WBH's output sucked. I don't know what level Wendigo is at - but I know what a truck's level is at. I know what level sunglasses are at. And he failed to even nudge them.

What does this mean? It means melting Wendigo isn't that impressive.

Originally posted by carver9
BEFORE HE CHARGED DOOMSDAY. BBEEEEEEEEFFFFFFOOOOOORRRREEEE!!! Doomsday then GRABBED HIS JACKET WHICH MEANS HIS SHIELDS ARE NOT UP and then he pounded on him which resulted in Guy eyes being closed shut throughout the comic. Now again, I do not care about what Guy had on BEFORE charging Doomsday. When Doomsday pounded on him, he was shieldless and how do we know that? Doomsday grabbing his freaking jacket. If you think his shields are up AFTER Doomsday grabbed his jacket, prove it. It's like I'm talking to a child.

So your assertion is that Guy had his shields up, then removed them before Doomsday grabbed him?

Why do you assert that the shields are hard, like a glass bowl? How would he move his joints?

@Dark...

That's the difference between me and you. You use one showing to dictate a character power level (Thor hit with a rock) while I look at everything to determine the power level of a character. I can't convince you because I think your debating style is broken and I feel you feel the same about me. The entire book of DOS was written terribly concerning power level. The gas station explosion is only part of it. You'll have to say the entire book is PIS and that's just not the way I debate and you don't either (with certain characters). I prefer consistency. Seems like you do as well. Are you not the same guy who tried to debunk Hulk 133 herc showing because even though the first statement had something to do with Hercules strength, everything after it was mentioning magic (picking and choosing on Marvel characters). Again I ask, be consistent.

Also, in regards to Guy shields, Abhi said Doomsday broke them. Debate that topic with him if you want...

Originally posted by abhilegend
Or Doomsday broke the auto shields and grabbed the jacket. It's not hard to understand, if you aren't a gibbering toddler.

Originally posted by carver9
@Dark...

That's the difference between me and you. You use one showing to dictate a character power level (Thor hit with a rock) while I look at everything to determine the power level of a character. I can't convince you because I think your debating style is broken and I feel you feel the same about me. The entire book of DOS was written terribly concerning power level. The gas station explosion is only part of it. You'll have to say the entire book is PIS and that's just not the way I debate and you don't either (with certain characters). I prefer consistency. Seems like you do as well. Are you not the same guy who tried to debunk Hulk 133 herc showing because even though the first statement had something to do with Hercules strength, everything after it was mentioning magic (picking and choosing on Marvel characters). Again I ask, be consistent.

Also, in regards to Guy shields, Abhi said Doomsday broke them. Debate that topic with him if you want...

You're legitimately either lying or just don't understand DS.

You so fail to even acknowledge the point of accumulated damage. If you did this but still said it's wrong, at least you'd maybe be honest. But clearly you're avoiding it so you can cling to your argument.

But why are you ignoring DS' points about all the stuff that didn't break around Hulk?