Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
Oh, you probably judge all men that way. I personaly take offence to that. you notice that last item on my list? That's the option I'm going to stay with. I respect women too much to do that to them.Of course, I'm not gonna lie. I think about it... but I wouldn't do it. that is not untill I am married.
Too bad for your little retort that I am a man. And I have no clue what the hell the rest of your post is addressing.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
I repeat what I said: To every human, however you have been raised, [B]at one point in your life certian things feel wrong. THEN, you are corrupted by the world's decaying morality.The first time you do something wrong, you always have even a slight feeling that it is wrong, no matter how you have been raised. as you continue doing it, that feeling decays, untill you see no difference between right and wrong.
why is that human wrong? Their morality is decayed. They have lived in that life for so long, they have lost their ability to determin what is right and what is wrong. [/B]
That was the shittiest concept of morality that I've ever seen. I actually have to agree with Bardock and call this one out as bullshit. Every human being has a different idea of what makes them feel bad, and that bad feeling is what tells them that something is wrong. The act that makes them feel bad usually only happens when it affects another person.
Things that people do to themselves don't fall subject to morality, because they don't see themselves as hurting other people. And they're right, **** everyone else, they have the right to do whatever they want to themselves.
Fact is that whether a woman has an abortion or not is not going to effect you in any way, so stay out of her business.
Originally posted by Arachnoidfreak
Too bad for your little retort that I am a man. And I have no clue what the hell the rest of your post is addressing.That was the shittiest concept of morality that I've ever seen. I actually have to agree with Bardock and call this one out as bullshit. Every human being has a different idea of what makes them feel bad, and that bad feeling is what tells them that something is wrong. The act that makes them feel bad usually only happens when it affects another person.
Things that people do to themselves don't fall subject to morality, because they don't see themselves as hurting other people. And they're right, **** everyone else, they have the right to do whatever they want to themselves.
Fact is that whether a woman has an abortion or not is not going to effect you in any way, so stay out of her business.
But it affects THAT child. Wheather or not it affects any born human is irrelevant, but that one unborn human, what gives you the right to take that child's life. That helpless child, at full mercy of the mother. I can't see how you could even think about aborting it? How can you even think about killing it? It has needs, like a baby, it needs food, like a baby, it needs protection... like a baby. I honestly don't understand... what gives you the right, what even makes you think you have the right... to kill a helpless human being? I just don't understand.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
But it affects THAT child. Wheather or not it affects any born human is irrelevant, but that one unborn human, what gives you the right to take that child's life. That helpless child, at full mercy of the mother. I can't see how you could even think about aborting it? How can you even think about killing it? It has needs, like a baby, it needs food, like a baby, it needs protection... like a baby. I honestly don't understand... what gives you the right, what even makes you think you have the right... to kill a helpless human being? I just don't understand.
And that's the problem, sympathy for a baby and a child. Well it is neither a baby nor a child, so your point is irrelevant first of all.
Second, preventing suffering is better than putting it through a lifetime of whatever hardships they have to go through in life just because he was unwanted or an accident.
and third, it's worse to make the mother go through such hardships for something she doesnt even want. how selfish of you.
Originally posted by Arachnoidfreak
And that's the problem, sympathy for a baby and a child. Well it is neither a baby nor a child, so your point is irrelevant first of all.Second, preventing suffering is better than putting it through a lifetime of whatever hardships they have to go through in life just because he was unwanted or an accident.
and third, it's worse to make the mother go through such hardships for something she doesnt even want. how selfish of you.
My point is it is helpless. At full mercy of the mother. And Killing to preventing suffering is not beter. Everyone has a right to life. even a fetus. you are terminating a life before it can even breathe... If it was beter to end a life to prevent suffering, then abort everybody, kill the race. End human suffering once and for all. everyone suffers somehow, so kill them all. end their suffering... but OH... MY... GOD... it just became wrong didn't it? like I said... 1. Put the child up for adoption. 2. use protection. or 3. DON'T HAVE SEX FOR GOD'S SAKE! HOW SELFISH OF ME? HOW SELFISH OF YOU. I say killing it is more selfish!
Originally posted by Arachnoidfreak
I see you are male.Push a softball out of your anus and then tell a woman she has to go through childbirth just to give it away.
You say it is the male's fault... but it takes two to tango.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
I can't see how you could even think about aborting it.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
How can you even think about killing it?
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
I honestly don't understand...
Did it ever occur to you, following these statements, that you actually might not get why we believe what we do? Because I don't think you do, you don't, by your own admission, so why are you even debating? If you don't get why we believe this, 300+ pages in, then you're beyond help.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
what gives you the right, what even makes you think you have the right... to kill a helpless human being? I just don't understand.
Forgive me for smashing your debate to pieces, but who said anything about us doing it? It's to my knowledge that we're just saying it's up to the woman if she wants an abortion and we won't stop her.
So my question to you, is this: What gives you the right to believe that you have any say on this? Go on.
You ask us what right people have to abort their foetuses, the foetuses they created, yet you are of the belief that you have a right to impose your will on another life, a living life. One that has nothing to do with you. By your rationale, the mother has more right to have an abortion than you have any right to force her not to have one. She is involved with the foetus, you're not involved with the woman.
For the record, "It's a human!", "It's a baby!" and "It's a child!" are not acceptable.
-AC
I think that you are missing a very key point. They reason theyt do not have trhe right to kill the fetuses they created is because that fetus is a living being. Ladies, that's a little person inside your stomach. It doesn't matter who created it, you can't kill it. It doesn't matter who the parents are, you can't go around murdering people. That's why you can't kill it. Unless of course, you enjoy murder.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
My point is it is helpless. At full mercy of the mother. And Killing to preventing suffering is not beter. Everyone has a right to life. even a fetus. you are terminating a life before it can even breathe... If it was beter to end a life to prevent suffering, then abort everybody, kill the race. End human suffering once and for all. everyone suffers somehow, so kill them all. end their suffering... but OH... MY... GOD... it just became wrong didn't it? like I said... 1. Put the child up for adoption. 2. use protection. or 3. DON'T HAVE SEX FOR GOD'S SAKE! HOW SELFISH OF ME? HOW SELFISH OF YOU. I say killing it is more selfish!
No, forcing the mother to go through something she doesn't have to go through is selfish. Her abortion doesn't effect you in ANY WAY.
And if I could end all human suffering I would.
1. Adoption is forcing the mother through labor. How dare you?
2. Protection doesn't work 100% of the time
3. first off, if people didn't have sex there'd be no children. besides, sex feels damn good, and noone is going to stop just cuz you tell them to.
You say it is the male's fault... but it takes two to tango.
I never said it was the male's fault. How about you try actually reading and then get back to me?
Originally posted by Nazgulinthedark
I think that you are missing a very key point. They reason theyt do not have trhe right to kill the fetuses they created is because that fetus is a living being. Ladies, that's a little person inside your stomach. It doesn't matter who created it, you can't kill it. It doesn't matter who the parents are, you can't go around murdering people. That's why you can't kill it. Unless of course, you enjoy murder.
We've been over this 300 times too. How about actually taking a look at some of the thread before posting?
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
yet you are of the belief that you have a right to impose your will on another life, a living life.
-AC
NO! I am not. I am of the belief that people have the right to live. even if they are as of yet un-born. It saddens me to see that people will just look at what they want, put their will above another. end a life, just to try to allow themselves to have fun. But that Fetus (since you don't me saying child) will never have fun. I don't see how you can even support that. The way I see it is that every person that has an abortion, and every doctor that preforms that operation... is nothing more, and nothing less than a Murderer.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
NO! I am not. I am of the belief that people have the right to live. even if they are as of yet un-born. It saddens me to see that people will just look at what they want, put their will above another. end a life, just to try to allow themselves to have fun. But that Fetus (since you don't me saying child) will never have fun. I don't see how you can even support that. The way I see it is that every person that has an abortion, and every doctor that preforms that operation... is nothing more, and nothing less than a Murderer.
clapping
Originally posted by Nazgulinthedark
I think that you are missing a very key point. They reason theyt do not have trhe right to kill the fetuses they created is because that fetus is a living being. Ladies, that's a little person inside your stomach. It doesn't matter who created it, you can't kill it. It doesn't matter who the parents are, you can't go around murdering people. That's why you can't kill it. Unless of course, you enjoy murder.
It's not a little person, it's a foetus. Stop trying to brainwash (yes, that is what you're doing) females into not having abortions. If you want to guilt trip them, at least be truthful about it. You are the ones being so selfish as to weave your own moral agenda in where it doesn't concern you. Because make no mistake, unless it's your wife or girlfriend, you have no say.
You are now saying "You can't kill it." Says who? You? Let me say something to you that I know you are unaware of, ready:
You do not matter. Ok? You are inconsequential. Got that? All you are is a random human who has such a lack of conviction in his own morals, that he has to go around begging and guilting people into feeling the same.
If I was walking my partner to the abortion clinic and you stepped out and said "You cannot do that." you would be brushed aside like yesterday's newspaper, or laughed at, or both.
Also, stop calling it murder, it's not murder, you complete cretin. That is a hard core, stone cold, undeniable fact.
Originally posted by LORD JLRTENJAC
NO! I am not. I am of the belief that people have the right to live. even if they are as of yet un-born. It saddens me to see that people will just look at what they want, put their will above another. end a life, just to try to allow themselves to have fun. But that Fetus (since you don't me saying child) will never have fun. I don't see how you can even support that. The way I see it is that every person that has an abortion, and every doctor that preforms that operation... is nothing more, and nothing less than a Murderer.
Then mind your own damn business and exercise your own right to live. Live your life with your own morals, but keep those morals out of other people's lives. Your morals are your own, stop trying to selfishly force others to live as you do.
I know you don't see how I can support it, that's why you're having problems. You don't see anything beyond what you believe. I see what you're trying to say, but it's either complete horseshit, or it's factually inaccurate. You genuinely do not grasp what anyone is saying.
As I said to the man above, it's not murder. End of argument. It's not. Never was, never will be. Continuing calling it such and you are denying/ignoring a fact.
-AC
Originally posted by Phoenix2001
Show us some proof then.
This is what a baby looks like at 20 weeks (see below) where it is still legal to have an abortion. Besides the obvious physical resemblance to a human, the brain is developed and functioning. Just because the child hasn't had a chance to learn anything doesn't make it any less of a person.
Here's a 3-d ultra sound (see below) incase a drawing isn't enough. You can clearly make out the face. At this stage the baby has already begun to open and close it eyes, moves all it's limbs and even sucks it's thumb. Odd how such human like behavior form 'something' that looks exactly like a human is not a human??? Someone made the comment, '"it's nothing more than jello, you're protecting jello." Ya ok....
So, like I said before, just because it suit's you to say 'a fetus is not a person' and try to pass this off as fact doesn't make it so. Do some more research on how a baby developes and educate yourselves before jumping to such hasty conclusions.
Can you show me proof that this fetus is not a person? As you and especially Alpha Centauri claim, 'there is UNDENIABLE proof that a fetus is not a person.' Lets see it.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You do not matter. Ok? You are inconsequential. Got that? All you are is a random human who has such a lack of conviction in his own morals, that he has to go around begging and guilting people into feeling the same.
Wow, I see you still think you're really deep and meaningful with your insults... Why don't you take what you said above and apply it to yourself oh wise prophet... What's next..."Right and wrong do not exist..." "Life is just a fantasy...", "The future is only a dream.." Dude, all you are is one big cliche; so full of yourself with your pseudo-intellectual one liners...