Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Often a fertilised egg fails to implant and is expelled during menstruation. What's that then? Involuntary manslaughter? 😐
Some people would like to think so, I imagine.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Not in some countries.
True. But what if, lets say, someone comes from a country where abortion is illegal by law, because it is considered to be murder. People who hold that opinion would be right, and the people who believe abortion isn't murder would be wrong, because they are 'factually' wrong, right? What if they were to holiday in a country where abortion is legal, and not considered to be murder? Would a person be the holder of a wrong opinion for just a few weeks? Or is their opinion worthy, as it is the right opinion in their own country? 😕
Originally posted by autumn dreams
What about something like, say, euthanasia? The law makes it illegal because it is thought to be murder, isn't it? Does that mean all those who think it is not murder are wrong? 😕
Once again different areas of the law (and it is because suicide and assisted suicide are illegal.) There is a strong moral component to the debate, and because it clashes with the definition and regulations of other laws. By rights this could be corrected with simply legislation but few governments have the courage to enter into debate on the subject due to the particularly vocal "pro-life" lobby.
But anyway there are places where euthanasia is legal. It is, in fact, absurd that it isn't legal in more places, especially when one considers it is legal for a person to refuse a blood transplant that will save their lives and thus die, yet a terminal patient can't choose to die.
Originally posted by .😖pace Opera:.
...because we slaugter pigs, and cows. now, dont get me wrong i dont really care about the animals because they taste really good in my mouth, but for some reason a human embryo doesnt gell very well. oh well, might as well cook em' up and serve em' on a bun too. 😈 😂 😂 😆 😆 😐 😆
Umm... what does the processing of animals in the food industry have to do with abortion? Or eating meat? Though I guess you know what a hens egg is.
Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Unless this refers to cases where a pregnant women has been harmed in a way that has caused the loss of the unborn. However such cases are lite on precedent, and are a very different part of the legal system then abortion.
Lite on Precedent? 😂
here you go again making sh*t up and misrepresenting what I've said..🙄 Your strategy is to make me jump through hoops to prove the inherent stupidity in my arguments, however, once again you fail in creating these hoops because you don't even realize the inherent stupidity in your own. Did you no learn anything from our debate in the other thread?
Firstly, what I stated was that the law could only recognize SOME instances where 3 month preggers get punched in the stomach and loose their babies as being manslaughter. All other cases where the woman chooses to have an abortion after being pregnant for 3 months could only legally be classified as 1st degree murder.
Secondly before 3 months all talk about the embroyo being a viable life shouldn't even be considered, seeing as how the embryo at that stage is only about a million times more developed than a one celled ameba, which is considered to be one of the simplest forms of life that exists on planet Earth.
Either way, whether an individual considers it to be 1st degree murder, second degree murder, or manslaughter is irrelevant. The bottom line is that the women are the ones who created the life to begin with, and they are the ONLY one's who have the right to CHOOSE to take the life away.
Originally posted by .😖pace Opera:.
...because we slaugter pigs, and cows. now, dont get me wrong i dont really care about the animals because they taste really good in my mouth, but for some reason a human embryo doesnt gell very well. oh well, might as well cook em' up and serve em' on a bun too. 😈 😂 😂 😆 😆 😐 😆
No one is saying that animals shouldn't be cared for. What they're saying is that human beings exist on a higher evolutionary levels than the animals you find in the wild. But even with that being stated, 3 month year old human embryo's can't survive on their own, while most fully developed animals in the wild can.
This makes them about equal to animals in the wild in the evolutionary chain, and that is why women possess the inherent ability and right to make life or death decisions about what to do with the underdeveloped human lives that they have created, are carrying, and are responsible for protecting within their bodies.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Hello, whob.You're supposed to be playing the role of the Gay Guy now so god isn't your friend. That's for your other socks.
Role of the Gay Guy? I was agreeing with you moron. I don't need to pretend to be who I am. I just come here to express my views and give the gay people on this forum a voice. People have accussed me of being someon else the entire time since I've joined this website. Leave me alone and stay on topic or else you'll be reported.
EDIT: i'M NOT WHOB!!!
Originally posted by Gay Guy
Lite on Precedent? 😂here you go again making sh*t up and misrepresenting what I've said..🙄 Your strategy is to make me jump through hoops to prove the inherent stupidity in my arguments, however, once again you fail in creating these hoops because you don't even realize the inherent stupidity in your own. Did you no learn anything from our debate in the other thread?
No, I asked for clarification. I assumed you were talking about situational differences, not implying anything. And here we have the information I wanted, so I will respond.
Firstly, what I stated was that the law could only recognize SOME instances where 3 month preggers get punched in the stomach and loose their babies as being manslaughter. All other cases where the woman chooses to have an abortion after being pregnant for 3 months could only legally be classified as 1st degree murder.
As I said: precedent lite. Such case have come before the court, been highly contentious and have not gone convincingly one way or the other to show the actual inclination of the law on the matter. And precedent is everything in the law, and depending at which level a court decision has been made can make it binding. Far to few cases have occurred to know for sure, and no legislation has been passed that clarifies it.
As a result it can not be given as an absolute, and even if it is legally enforceable that an assault which leads to a miscarriage can be constituted as manslaughter it does not equal abortion being 1st degree murder. The law does not operate on A leads to B leads to C mechanics.
So I would agree with Alpha Centauri - the terminology murder is incorrectly used in the abortion debate.
About 43% of American women will have one (or occasionally more) abortions during their lifetime. Women's centers and hospitals perform more than a million abortions per year. Abortions are obviously in great demand. But why?
Women have many reasons for not wanting to be pregnant, and thus to seek an abortion. Many are related to:
-Age: Most abortions are done on women under the age of 25.
-Marital status: Most women seeking abortions are unmarried; many are separated from their spouse.
-Economic status: Many are poor
In a study by Torres and Forrest (1998) -- based on 1987 data --
The vast majority (in excess of 90%) of abortions are sought for personal reasons NON OF THESE ARE VALID REASON AND ARE JUST PLAIN MURDER - YOU WANTED TO HAVE SEX SO NOW ACCEPT THE RESULT AND GIVE THE CHILD A LIFE OR GET IT ADOPTED BY A FAMILY THAT CARES:
-21% feel that they do not have the financial resources to bring up a child.
-21% feel that they are not ready for the responsibility of bringing up a child.
-16% feel that their life would be changed too much. She might have a plan for her future (education, developing a career, etc.) that does not allow for having a child at the present time. She might be looking after an elderly parent and does not have sufficient time or energy to commit to a baby.
-12% feel that her relationship with her partner is in difficulty.
-11% feel that they are too young, and not sufficiently mature to become a mother.
-In 8% of the cases, her children are grown and she does not want to start another family, or that she has all the children that she wants.
-Some of these reasons may be influenced by:
-Pressure from the father or from her parents to have an abortion.
-She feels that she lacks the emotional and physical strength to go through another pregnancy and raise the child.
-She believes that raising an additional child would short-change her existing children.
-She is a student and/or without a partner; she feels that raising a child would be too difficult and disruptive at her time in life.
-She doesn't want other people to know that she became pregnant.
-A child would interfere with her career or education.
-She may fear physical abuse from a parent if they learn of her pregnancy.
-She may fear being tossed out onto the street by a parent if they learn of her pregnancy.
-In the case of a multiple pregnancy, the woman may be faced with giving birth to more newborns than she feels she can deal with.
About 6% of all abortions are sought because either the woman or fetus has medical reasons (THE ONLY THING WHERE ABORTION MIGHT BE JUSTIFIED IS IF DEATH OF THE CHILD OR MOTHER IS CERTAIN AND EVEN THEN I AM NOT 100% SURE):
-The fetus might have been hurt by exposure to high levels of toxic chemicals, medications that might be dangerous to the fetus, alcohol, drugs, etc. They may cause the fetus to be genetically damaged.
-Some girls become pregnant at a very young age, when pregnancy can be dangerous.
-The fetus has a genetic defect or other health problem. Virtually all of the couples who find that the fetus suffers from Down's Syndrome, or a similar defect, elect to have an abortion.
-The woman may develop eclampsia. This involves a sudden increase in blood pressure, and onset of seizures. The results can be fatal to both the woman and fetus. This used to be called toxemia of pregnancy.
-In the case of a multiple pregnancy, some or all of the fetuses will end up with various long-term health problems; some may not survive at all. Physicians will sometimes recommend a selective reduction process where one or more fetuses are killed in order that the remaining fetuses would be born normal.
About 1% of all abortions are sought because of abusive sexual act (THESE ARE VERY VERY SAD AND I REALLY FEEL FOR THE POOR WOMEN WHO GET PREGNANT THIS WAY BUT HERE AGAIN THERE IS NO WAY I AGREE WITH ABORTION. IF YOU DO NOT WANT THE CHILD THEN HAVE IT ADOPTED IN A LOVING FAMILY):
-About ten to fifteen thousand abortions (approximately 1%) annually are sought because the conception occurred after rape or during an incestuous relationship, and the woman does not want to bear a child who was conceived in violence.
1,000,000 abortion per year
well over 90% of these are done but people who did not take the necessary precautions!!! When will people wake up!