Doctor Manhattan vs Celestials

Started by abhilegend5 pages
Perpetua being limited is not up for debate given the circumstances. It's not just the word "limted" was used, we have a full explanation outlining that Perpetua and Batman Who Laughs powers depleted over the course of the fight.

Let me guess, Celestials and Beyonder have never been depleted or weakened? Even pre retcon Beyonder was weakened after he erased death to the point he couldn't kill a flower.

And like I said, I haven't read A.X.E. so I'm not aware of how the Celestials are portrayed there. Could it be that Ewing's representation of them in Defenders Beyond is inconsistent with with their portrayals in A.X.E.? Sure. Could a figurative reading of "infinity" make more sense than a literal reading of it for the Celestials when accounting for it? Sure. Could Perpetua be more powerful than the Celestials? Sure.
But as far as I'm aware, this is not the case.

Because "infinity" for Celestials is literal but not for everyone else?

You're not the authority of arbitration here if you don't know.


I tend to be equally critical of all works, but not overly-critical of any. It's just a better approach to debates.

So whichever benefits the Marvel characters?

No. You're misremembering. There were two kinds of Incursions, the Red ones where the Earths collided and that were stopped by the Black Swans with bombs that blew up one of the Earths under order of Dr. Doom; and the Blue ones where the Mapmakers found a universe and then summoned the Bridgebuilders who Ã_n turn summoned the Beyonders.

Mapmakers never summoned the Beyonders, what are you talking about? I've read the entire saga multiple times, do share the scan where Beyonders destroyed a universe.

Yeah, it shattered the universe into a multiverse. Why would that make it less than universal?

The combined universe was stronger than the resultant multiverse, Ewing made it clear in Ultimates.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
[b]Ultimates 2 #9 Pt 2/2

[/B]


Scans

astner larping for marvel cosmics is literally like me larping for thor

he doesn't really truly believe what he's saying

he's just bored and try to find something to debate

Originally posted by Astner
Those are all very good points, and I don't have any good answer to any of them.

Probably because it's just poetic licence that the Beyonders are 'without limit'. Because we clearly see in the same issue that they indeed have limits.

Not that they're even in this thread. Beyonders =/= Celestials.

^ Does the Celestial Host need to be without limit to defeat Doctor Manhattan???

Originally posted by ODG
^ Does the Celestial Host need to be without limit to defeat Doctor Manhattan???

let's start from basic

how would you rate doctor manhattan power wise

universal? multiversal?

Originally posted by ODG
^ Does the Celestial Host need to be without limit to defeat Doctor Manhattan???

They do not, of course.

Astner's logic stems from one side being said to have limits, and th other was inferred to have none

Originally posted by MrMind
let's start from basic

how would you rate doctor manhattan power wise

universal? multiversal?

How would you rate the Celestial Host?

Originally posted by ODG
How would you rate the Celestial Host?

c'mon bro don't do the answering a question with a question thing

Tons of high end cosmics are described as infinite or unlimited in power.

Feats are what matter.

Originally posted by MrMind
c'mon bro don't do the answering a question with a question thing
That’s what you did, no?

im trying to get a discussion discourse going

how powerful do you think celestial host is?

how powerful do you think doctor manhattan is?

doctor manhattan is stated to be more powerful to mxy

how do you compare celestial host to someone like mxy. who has snapped away and recreated dc with his finger

^ So what are your thoughts then?

I don't think Celestial host can casually destroy and recreate a universe (forget multiverse).

If Manhattan can then he wins.

How does this celestials as creators story fit in with them getting their heads chopped off by knull?

Originally posted by Diesldude
How does this celestials as creators story fit in with them getting their heads chopped off by knull?

or sue storm

or thor

godkiller armor killed billions of them

marvel cosmic is such a joke

Originally posted by MrMind
or sue storm

or thor

godkiller armor killed billions of them

marvel cosmic is such a joke

also didn’t the beyonders kill them also?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Reykjavik is Iceland, noob. Such a lowballer.

Abhi's geography knowledge is on American level 😂

Read defenders 1 and 2. There nothing in these 2 books that would support the celestials being raised to higher tier than they were previously.

Sure they created the beyonders and they gave them the raw power to kill them. But is this raw power from the celestial themselves or the power from beyond the beyond?

And at this point secret war 2 is completely retconned