Juggernaut or The Hulk?

Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
You said "again," implying that it had happened before.

savagerampage, Juggernaut specifically says he was "punched." A punch isn't a telepathic attack. He wasn't "hurled across the country," he was punched from Canada to New Jersey.

I repeat AGAIN Cube, one last time: the helmet thing in Onslaught is completely irrelevant, seeing as how Psylocke's powers got through it TWICE, once in Uncanny #322 of course, and again in X-Men #53. Now Cube, you say Psylocke got through the helmet the first time because "his helmet was damaged", but how do you explain the second time, when his armor is completely intact? I'll answer, there is no explanation, that's how screwy some of the things in Onslaught were, it was completely forgotten or ignored, a clear case of PIS. And you really don't think Onslaught got into Juggernaut's head in their first meeting? Well, the fact that Juggernaut's mind was all f*cked up after should make that point pretty obvious, but anyways, Jean did find the psychic block that was in Juggernaut's head in X-Men #54, and finds out who Onslaught is. Don't believe it? Well, I suggest looking it up yourself, or reading it. How'd he know who Onslaught really was? Who knows, but he knew it, and that's what mattered.

And yeah, Alpha's right, this SO has absolutely nothing to do with Hulk vs Juggernaut, as I mentioned yesterday. But I just needed to clear that little detail up so we could move on.

great points tron. juggys head was indeed messed before onslaught,punched or threw him. cause he wasnt that physically injured.onslaught obsorbed nate, just before his second form,once he did he changed into his second form. Juggernaut can be harmed physically by celestial powers like galactus,beyonder,eternity, or any other characters that can dwarf any power. magical attacks do hurt juggernaut physically. but they have to be really powerful. and his last weekness is telepathic attacKs. other than that hes pretty immune to ever other thing i guess thats why marvel says "enhances his strength and grants him an extraordinary degree of resistance to all forms of injury. Once he begins moving in a certain direction, no force on Earth can stop him -- only slow his pace." the injuries he would suffer are from magical attacks that would do him harm

his only 2 vunerablities as listed by marvel his only 2 weekness are
"However, Juggernaut is vulnerable to magical forces of sufficient strength. Without his helmet, constructed of an unknown mystical metal, he is susceptible to psionic attack."

like i said if it was a fight to the death juggernaut would win. if its just gonna be a normal run of the mill fight the hulk would win

either way i hope marvel corrects there mistakes and gives us a worthy slugfest from 2 of there best characters!

I'm not gonna try to argue why Onslaught was able to do what he did, cause that same song has been played in here far too many times, and we've gotten far enough of the subject of the thread as it is. I was simply clearing up what was actually shown in the pages of the Onslaught saga. No one can say that his head wasn't messed with, because all the way to X-Men #54 it was clearly implied that it was.

I personally don't wanna see the fight written with a conclusive winner any more, cause all that'll do is blow up the heads of fanboys on either side, and that's the last thing we all need.

after seeing blatent ignorace and refusal to adhear to any common knowledge in this thread...i was gonna say some things.then it dawned on me...this is just all way to screwed up...on fanboys side and marvels side...its a lose lose situation...im done with this useless crap.

In Juggernaut 8th Day one of the Exemplars named Bedlam has very powerful psychic abilities and is able to assualt Juggernaut through his helmet on more than 1 occasion.

so back to the question....................can hulk still kick jugg's butt? I know the new version is stronger but who wins out of ten?

In theory.........I believe Hulk has a very good shot..a better shot than most.

i think if read most of this thread u will find out that hulk indeed has a more than fair chance of being victor. it all depends how angry and strong he is allowed to get in the story. if he is allowed to be peak hulk then its a matter of time till he gets so strong cyttoraks protection is pointless and juggies power therefore lies irrevelvant.

Juggernaut's chance would be towards the beginning and Hulk's chance would be towards the end is my take on it. But also likely, *puts on Squints from Sandlot glasses* Foo-eeevvv-aaahh.

I don't disagree, but I think there is also more than sufficient enough evidence to prove that Juggernaut could defeat Hulk as well.

It is by no means a matter of "time" when it comes to Hulk lashing out to full potential. Most of Hulk's insane feats of physical strength happen in mere seconds. Infact, his most impressive feats required the aid of others. Jean Grey had to shut off Banner in order to go berserk on Onslaught, and when Hulk supported the 250,000,000 billion ton mountain he needed Reed Richards to insult him to maintain his strength.

Regardless, Juggernaut has proven strong enough to go toe-to-toe with Hulk and strong enough to incapaciate him.

The Onslaught saga, which was what was in debate, was the only instance where Juggernaut has EVER been knocked out by a physical force.

Can anyone name a time where Hulk was ever able to knock someone 2000 miles across the United States? Not even War was able to do that to Juggernaut and he used centripital force to throw him...not just a backhand.

If he was mistaken for a shooting star he could of been knocked into orbit. Or at least the upper atmosphere.

"Can anyone name a time where Hulk was ever able to knock someone 2000 miles across the United States?"

I can't name a time when he has done that. Then again, no one can name times that Juggernaut has proven to be a potential match for Hulk's limitless strength. It still seems safe to assume he is though. My reason for believing Juggernaut's strength isn't infinite is because Cyttorak's isn't and that's where he gets it.

-AC

Then again, no one can name times that Juggernaut has proven to be a potential match for Hulk's limitless strength

Aside from when Juggernaut choked out Hulk so bad that he had to resort to throwing silt in Jugg's eye...and later wasn't able to free himself from the headlock...ultimately leaving him unconsious.

Well, Hulk has thrown Namor from Key West to Miami (though that is much less than 2000 miles.)

Jean wouldn't be around to shut off Banner for this one, so all of his strength would have to come from anger.

lol

Reed Richards: "Betty was just a stupid b*tch, she deserved to die. Your mother was a whore, that's why your father killed her." 😠

Tron,
I have conceeded and withdrawn from the Juggernaut vs Onslaught "sub-thread." It's pretty irrelevant to this one.

I also agree with Swanky. Juggernaut does seem to have the advantage in the beginning, but if Hulk lasts long enough, which he may or may not do, he will have the advantage in the end.

The end of this thread may be in sight.

"Aside from when Juggernaut choked out Hulk so bad that he had to resort to throwing silt in Jugg's eye...and later wasn't able to free himself from the headlock...ultimately leaving him unconsious."

I reiterate:

No one has proven Juggernaut to be a match to Hulk's limitless strength.

-AC

Has anyone came to the conclusion that the Hulk is just a punching bag for Marvel or DC characters? The list of those who shouldn't stand a chance with him and beat him or held their own is mindboggling..

Captain America
Wolverine
Spiderman
Superman(here for reference)
Sin Six(Ock)
Batman
etc

But ignoring this a bit...
Juggs should take this one as he is always at his peak and Hulk needs a minute to get up there.(all theory)

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
"I reiterate:

No one has proven Juggernaut to be a match to Hulk's limitless strength.

And no one's really proven that he's not a match for Hulk either. Now the limitless strength thing in the end, no one can really say, but still, Juggernaut's still a worthy foe for Hulk, and as shown he can be.

And ebosian, I would take Superman off that list, since he is after all, Superman, and more or less set the standard for super-strength. But that's another debate in another thread altogether though.

Alright, if Hulk is truly limitless in strength then why can't he lift Thor's hammer?

And before you shoot back with your reason. The more important question is....why is it that Hulk can't lift Thor's hammer, yet it is being argued that through pure strength Hulk will be able to overpower the protection given to Juggernaut by the gem of Cytorrak?

"why is it that Hulk can't lift Thor's hammer, yet it is being argued that through pure strength Hulk will be able to overpower the protection given to Juggernaut by the gem of Cytorrak?"

I never said will, ever.

I said and stand by my theory that someone with limitless theoretical strength could become strong enough to smash through anything. Hulk didn't lift Thor's hammer. Maybe because he wasn't at a level which he could, maybe it had something to do with the magic over it and he wasn't at a level to breach the magic yet.

It can't be said. I'm not like Tough Guy who claims things WILL happen. I can only (and have) state why I believe Hulk could win. I cannot concrete that until they have a fight with no loop holes, technicality wins or such. Until there's a straight up one on one, it's not gonna be settled.

-AC