The Official Naruto series Thread

Started by Q991,600 pages

Pretty cool attack of Kabuto's there. Mostly useful in caves, but we can see where Orochimaru was going with his research into jutsu.

Not a lot happening, but not bad.

Originally posted by Astner

Also, what's with the backstory? Why not wait until the character is about to die, having his life flash by him as he's bleeding out? Why squeeze it into the battle?

Shouldn't the battle follow the basic drama structure? Set up, rising action, climax, and dénouement?

Possibly because Kabuto's backstory is going to play into the climax, since it'll help us understand why he is where he is better.

Originally posted by Astner
So the jutsu was just a Deus ex machina that will be triggered when all hope seems lost?

Also, what's with the backstory? Why not wait until the character is about to die, having his life flash by him as he's bleeding out? Why squeeze it into the battle?

Shouldn't the battle follow the basic drama structure? Set up, rising action, climax, and dénouement?

kabuto's eyes were opening up, so maybe it's like literally TALK NO DOJUTSU imo.

as a kabuto fan i have already prepared for the ass-pull loss he will suffer so it's just a mater of patients to see how badly he gets lamed out.

on one hand you have itachi (kishi speaking through him) saying kabuto will lose matter of factly, and then on the other hand you have kabuto boasting about how he already won and there is no way for him to lose which is shonen code for imminent villain shaming, not to mention his cloak is off which is imminent demise for all villains in the manga (except konan cause she's supposedly nearly naked under that shit); when that cloak comes off you die soon after.

Originally posted by Q99
Possibly because Kabuto's backstory is going to play into the climax, since it'll help us understand why he is where he is better.

I see no reason why we wouldn't be able to puzzle the pieces together if we were given them at a later time. We really don't have to understand him before the battle is over as far as I'm concerned.

It was a bad move to detach from the battle. It drags it out and makes it feel incredibly disjointed.

Mind you, he has plenty of reason to draw it out. The more tired Sasuke gets, the better, he's the one regenerating chakra due to sage mode.

Personally I don't find it too disjointed, it's happened often enough before (Gaara, Valley of the End, etc.), though that's admittedly a personal preference thing.

i don't really know what chapter it was, but some time during the chuunin exam, there was a point in time where kabuto looked like he was about to rage out and his eyes were starting to turn all red and stuff. i hope this backstory helps shed some light on it. that part always seemed like it was just pushed under the rug for such a long time and now i hope kishi uses this time to pull that back out.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
as a kabuto fan i have already prepared for the ass-pull loss he will suffer so it's just a mater of patients to see how badly he gets lamed out.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
as a kabuto fan i have already prepared for the ass-pull loss he will suffer so it's just a mater of patients to see how badly he gets lamed out.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
as a kabuto fan i have already prepared for the ass-pull loss he will suffer so it's just a mater of patients to see how badly he gets lamed out.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
as a kabuto fan i have already prepared for the ass-pull loss he will suffer so it's just a mater of patients to see how badly he gets lamed out.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
as a kabuto fan i have already prepared for the ass-pull loss he will suffer so it's just a mater of patients to see how badly he gets lamed out.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
as a kabuto fan i have already prepared for the ass-pull loss he will suffer so it's just a mater of patients to see how badly he gets lamed out.

DOCTOR GUNDY??!?!?! IZ DAT EWWWWE!?!?!?!?!?!

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awesome

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😐

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evillaugh

Originally posted by Misfit Justice
i don't really know what chapter it was, but some time during the chuunin exam, there was a point in time where kabuto looked like he was about to rage out and his eyes were starting to turn all red and stuff. i hope this backstory helps shed some light on it. that part always seemed like it was just pushed under the rug for such a long time and now i hope kishi uses this time to pull that back out.

It was during the chunin exams when they were in the forest. It was when those clone ninja were becoming a nuisance. It was the first glimpse into Kabuto's character being evil and that he wasn't as good as he was leading on. ALSO...it was during a time when Naruto was written VERY well.

I agree with the haters: I would like to see this kind of story telling be told after the fight. Kubo got it right when he did the stories of his Espada generally towards the end of their lives or right before. How many world-class ninja warrior assassins are really going to just sit there while you monologue about your life story? hmm? Anyone? Bueller? That's right: it would never happen.

I really don't care when Kabuto's backstory gets told. I prefer midfight to end because that just doesn't appeal to me.

Kishi did make a mistake though. The last chapter should have ended with the start of Kabuto's flashback instead of Izanami( Im a nazi backwards lol) because now it is just confusing. We were expecting Izanami but now we might have to wait a few weeks.

huh, so the backstory begins. while it's nice to finally see how Kabuto will eventually become the way he is today, I gotta agree with you guys: it would have been better if Kishi did this near the end of his life or something and not during a damn battle. I bet Sasuke and Itachi are already planning out their next few moves.

I'll point out the fight hasn't gotten very serious yet. We'll get flashback, *then* they'll start going all-out.

Stat update time! This time with summons!

Stats:

SS
Madara Uchiha (Rinnegan + Wood)^
Naruto Uzumaki (Full Partnership)
Tobi (Jinchuuriki Paths)^

SS-
Hashirama^
Kurama (Full power)
Madara Uchiha (EMS only)^
Nagato (Pain or Solo)

S+
Itachi Uchiha
Izuna Uchiha
Gedō Mazō
Gyūki
Killerbee
Minato Namikaze
Mito Uzumaki
Muu
Naruto Uzumaki (Kyuubi chakra mode)
Onoki
Sasuke Uchiha (Complete Susano'o)
Second Mizukage
Third Raikage
Tobi (Sharingan only)^
Yagura

S
A (Raikage)
Danzo (with implant jutsu)
Deidara
Deva Path (Yahiko/Pain)
Fū (Jinchuuriki)
Gaara (Kage)
Jiraiya
Han
Kabuto* (Orochimaru Merge Sage)
Kakashi Hatake (Mastered Kamui)
Kakuzu
Kisame Hoshigaki (with Samehada)
Konan*
Kushina Uzumaki
Mei Terumi
Naruto Uzumaki (Sage Mode)*
Orochimaru*
Roshi
Sandaime Kazekage (3rd)
Sasori
Sasuke Uchiha (Orochimaru merge/mangekyo w/incomplete susano'o)
Shukaku
Tsunade
Utakata
Yondaime Kazekage (4th)
Yugito Nii

S-
Chiyo
Danzo (without implant jutsu)
Darui
Fukasaku
Ginkaku
Hidan
Hiruzen Sarutobi (Old)
Kakashi Hatake (start of part 2)
Kimimaro Kaguya (healthy)
Kinkaku
Kisame Hoshigaki (without Samehada)
Kitsuchi
Manda II
Mangetsu Hōzuki (Swords)
Mifune
Might Gai (part 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (start of part 2)
Shima
Shisui Uchiha
Zetsu (Black half or Complete)

*These characters have jutsu that require specific preparation that can't be done mid combat but increase their ability significantly, such as Edo Tensei, preparing multiple sage-mode charges, or readying unusual amounts of explosive tags.

^These characters have high-level Biju control of tailed beasts outside of their bodies.

A+
Animal Path (Pain)
Asuma Sarutobi
Asura Path (Pain)
Enma
Hiashi Hyuuga
Ibuse the Salamander
Jūgo
Kabuto Yakushi
Kakashi Hatake (part 1)
Kimimaro Kaguya (sick)
Mangetsu Hōzuki (No swords)
Might Gai (part 1)
Multi-Headed Dog
Suigetsu Hōzuki
Suikazan Fuguki (Samehada)
Yamato
Zabuza Momochi

A
Ao
Baki
Baku
Dodai
Fū (ANBU)
Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval)
Gamabunta
Gari
Giant Clam
Hizashi Hyuuga
Human Path (Pain)
Kankurō (with Sasori puppet)
Katsuyu
Killer Bee (Young, Minato fight)
Kurenai Yuhi
Kurotsuchi
Manda
Munashi Jinpachi
Naruto Uzumaki (post elemental training)
Neji Hyuuga (part 2)
Pakura
Ringo Ameyuri
Sasori (Sans puppet arsenal)
Torune

A-
C
Chōjūrō
Chōji Akimichi (Asuma Fight)
Chōza Akimichi
Gamahiro
Gamaken
Inoichi Yamanaka
Jinin Akebino
Kushimaru Kuriarare
Kakko (Kakashi Gaiden)
Naruto Uzumaki (start of part 2)
Preta Path (Pain)
Sai (post-emotions)
Shibi Aburame
Shikaku Nara
Shizune
Suikazan Fuguki (No sword)
Temari (start of part 2)

B+
Drill-Beaked Bird
Genma Shiranui
Haku
Ibiki Morino
Ittan
Kakashi Hatake (Kakashi Gaiden)
Kankurō (as of Sasori fight)
Mahiru
Naraka Path (Pain)
Naruto Uzumaki (One Tail)
Rock Lee (part 2)
Sai (start)
Sakura Haruno (part 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (VotE)
Snake-Tailed Chameleon

B
Anko Mitarashi
Gaara (Chuunin Exam)
Giant Crab/Ox/Panda/Rhino
Ino Yamanaka (4th Shinobi War)
Kamatari
Kankurō (Sasuke Retrieval)
Omoi
Sakon/Ukon
Shino Aburame (part 2)
Shikamaru Nara (part 2)
Taiseki (Kakashi Gaiden)
Temari (Sasuke Retrieval)
Toroi
Tsume Inuzuka

B-
Aoba Yamashiro
Chōji Akimichi (start of part 2)
Giant Centipedes
Hayate Gekkō
Hinata Hyuuga (part 2)
Jirōbō
Kiba Inazuka (part 2)
Kidōmaru
Neji Hyuuga (Sasuke Retrieval)
Shin
Tayuya
Tenten (Part 2)

C+
Ebisu
Ino Yamanaka (start of part 2)
Karin
Naruto Uzumaki (Post Rasengan Training)
Neji Hyuga (Chunin exam)
Rock Lee (Chunin exam)
Sasuke Uchiha (Chunin exam finals)
Shikamaru Nara (Sasuke Retrieval)
Temari (Chunin exam)
White Zetsu Clone

C
Dosu
Iruka
Izumo Kamizuki
Kankuro (Chunin exam)
Konohamaru Sarutobi (part 2)
Kotetsu Hagane
Obito Uchiha (Sharingan)
Rin
Sasuke Uchiha (Sharingan)
Shikamaru Nara (Chunin exam)
Shino Aburame (Chunin exam)
Yashamaru

C-
Gōzu (Demon Brother)
Kiba Inazuka (Chunin exam)
Meizu (Demon Brother)
Mizuki
Naruto Uzumaki (Post clone jutsu)
Obito Uchiha (pre-Sharingan)
Sasuke Uchiha (pre-Sharingan)
Shigure

D+
Chōji Akimichi (Chunin exam)
Hinata Hyuga (part 1)
Ino Yamanaka (Chunin exam)
Kin
Oboro
Tenten (Chunin exam)
Zaku

D
Misumi Tsurugi
Sakura Haruno (Chunin exam)
Yoroi Akadō

D-
Rock Lee (Just graduated Genin)
Sakura Haruno (Start)

E+
Naruto Uzumaki (pre-clone jutsu)

E-
Konohamaru Sarutobi (start)
Rock Lee (Academy flashback)

---

Moved: Kabuto Sage from S- to S.

Added: Gedō Mazō S+

Fukasaku / Shima and Manda II S-

Enma, Multi-Headed Dog, and Ibuse the Salamander to A+

Giant Clam, Baku, and the three boss summons to A.

Gamahiro/Gamaken- A-

Snake Tailed Chameleon and Drill Beaked Bird- B+

Kamatari, Giant Crab/Ox/Panda/Rhino- B

Giant Centipedes- B-

Input still welcome 🙂

On Manda II, we've had a call for S on sheer size. Though I'll note on that, that summons can be vulnerable to Genjutsu, so that strikes me as high.

Oh yea- the "three great snakes" used in the Sand/Sound invasion. B- like the Centipedes?

Any opinion on Tayuya's Doki giants as individuals? Or as a group?

Originally posted by Q99
Input still welcome 🙂

On Manda II, we've had a call for S on sheer size. Though I'll note on that, that summons can be vulnerable to Genjutsu, so that strikes me as high.

Oh yea- the "three great snakes" used in the Sand/Sound invasion. B- like the Centipedes?

Any opinion on Tayuya's Doki giants as individuals? Or as a group?

I would put the snake as a B because it is much larger than the centipedes.

The giants should be a group. What would you put them as? They are not susceptible to any genjutsu except the toad sage sound one. They are obviously really strong.

BUT! They have to be controlled by the flute/whistle thingie. I think. So I'd put them at C+ or B-.

Manda V2 should be S or S+. It can be summoned on top of any town or city and solo destroy it almost like a nuke. Making it a one hit kill surprise attack for anyone but chakra sensors.

Good point on the control. Yea, C+ or B-...

Manda V2 should be S or S+. It can be summoned on top of any town or city and solo destroy it almost like a nuke. Making it a one hit kill surprise attack for anyone but chakra sensors.

That's more someone else using it as a big attack, it can't summon itself after all 🙂

Originally posted by Q99
Stat update time! This time with summons!

Stats:

SS
Madara Uchiha (Rinnegan + Wood)^
Naruto Uzumaki (Full Partnership)
Tobi (Jinchuuriki Paths)^

SS-
Hashirama^
Kurama (Full power)
Madara Uchiha (EMS only)^
Nagato (Pain or Solo)

S+
Itachi Uchiha
Izuna Uchiha
Gedō Mazō
Gyūki
Killerbee
Minato Namikaze
Mito Uzumaki
Muu
Naruto Uzumaki (Kyuubi chakra mode)
Onoki
Sasuke Uchiha (Complete Susano'o)
Second Mizukage
Third Raikage
Tobi (Sharingan only)^
Yagura

S
A (Raikage)
Danzo (with implant jutsu)
Deidara
Deva Path (Yahiko/Pain)
Fū (Jinchuuriki)
Gaara (Kage)
Jiraiya
Han
Kabuto* (Orochimaru Merge Sage)
Kakashi Hatake (Mastered Kamui)
Kakuzu
Kisame Hoshigaki (with Samehada)
Konan*
Kushina Uzumaki
Mei Terumi
Naruto Uzumaki (Sage Mode)*
Orochimaru*
Roshi
Sandaime Kazekage (3rd)
Sasori
Sasuke Uchiha (Orochimaru merge/mangekyo w/incomplete susano'o)
Shukaku
Tsunade
Utakata
Yondaime Kazekage (4th)
Yugito Nii

S-
Chiyo
Danzo (without implant jutsu)
Darui
Fukasaku
Ginkaku
Hidan
Hiruzen Sarutobi (Old)
Kakashi Hatake (start of part 2)
Kimimaro Kaguya (healthy)
Kinkaku
Kisame Hoshigaki (without Samehada)
Kitsuchi
Manda II
Mangetsu Hōzuki (Swords)
Mifune
Might Gai (part 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (start of part 2)
Shima
Shisui Uchiha
Zetsu (Black half or Complete)

*These characters have jutsu that require specific preparation that can't be done mid combat but increase their ability significantly, such as Edo Tensei, preparing multiple sage-mode charges, or readying unusual amounts of explosive tags.

^These characters have high-level Biju control of tailed beasts outside of their bodies.

A+
Animal Path (Pain)
Asuma Sarutobi
Asura Path (Pain)
Enma
Hiashi Hyuuga
Ibuse the Salamander
Jūgo
Kabuto Yakushi
Kakashi Hatake (part 1)
Kimimaro Kaguya (sick)
Mangetsu Hōzuki (No swords)
Might Gai (part 1)
Multi-Headed Dog
Suigetsu Hōzuki
Suikazan Fuguki (Samehada)
Yamato
Zabuza Momochi

A
Ao
Baki
Baku
Dodai
Fū (ANBU)
Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval)
Gamabunta
Gari
Giant Clam
Hizashi Hyuuga
Human Path (Pain)
Kankurō (with Sasori puppet)
Katsuyu
Killer Bee (Young, Minato fight)
Kurenai Yuhi
Kurotsuchi
Manda
Munashi Jinpachi
Naruto Uzumaki (post elemental training)
Neji Hyuuga (part 2)
Pakura
Ringo Ameyuri
Sasori (Sans puppet arsenal)
Torune

A-
C
Chōjūrō
Chōji Akimichi (Asuma Fight)
Chōza Akimichi
Gamahiro
Gamaken
Inoichi Yamanaka
Jinin Akebino
Kushimaru Kuriarare
Kakko (Kakashi Gaiden)
Naruto Uzumaki (start of part 2)
Preta Path (Pain)
Sai (post-emotions)
Shibi Aburame
Shikaku Nara
Shizune
Suikazan Fuguki (No sword)
Temari (start of part 2)

B+
Drill-Beaked Bird
Genma Shiranui
Haku
Ibiki Morino
Ittan
Kakashi Hatake (Kakashi Gaiden)
Kankurō (as of Sasori fight)
Mahiru
Naraka Path (Pain)
Naruto Uzumaki (One Tail)
Rock Lee (part 2)
Sai (start)
Sakura Haruno (part 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (VotE)
Snake-Tailed Chameleon

B
Anko Mitarashi
Gaara (Chuunin Exam)
Giant Crab/Ox/Panda/Rhino
Ino Yamanaka (4th Shinobi War)
Kamatari
Kankurō (Sasuke Retrieval)
Omoi
Sakon/Ukon
Shino Aburame (part 2)
Shikamaru Nara (part 2)
Taiseki (Kakashi Gaiden)
Temari (Sasuke Retrieval)
Toroi
Tsume Inuzuka

B-
Aoba Yamashiro
Chōji Akimichi (start of part 2)
Giant Centipedes
Hayate Gekkō
Hinata Hyuuga (part 2)
Jirōbō
Kiba Inazuka (part 2)
Kidōmaru
Neji Hyuuga (Sasuke Retrieval)
Shin
Tayuya
Tenten (Part 2)

C+
Ebisu
Ino Yamanaka (start of part 2)
Karin
Naruto Uzumaki (Post Rasengan Training)
Neji Hyuga (Chunin exam)
Rock Lee (Chunin exam)
Sasuke Uchiha (Chunin exam finals)
Shikamaru Nara (Sasuke Retrieval)
Temari (Chunin exam)
White Zetsu Clone

C
Dosu
Iruka
Izumo Kamizuki
Kankuro (Chunin exam)
Konohamaru Sarutobi (part 2)
Kotetsu Hagane
Obito Uchiha (Sharingan)
Rin
Sasuke Uchiha (Sharingan)
Shikamaru Nara (Chunin exam)
Shino Aburame (Chunin exam)
Yashamaru

C-
Gōzu (Demon Brother)
Kiba Inazuka (Chunin exam)
Meizu (Demon Brother)
Mizuki
Naruto Uzumaki (Post clone jutsu)
Obito Uchiha (pre-Sharingan)
Sasuke Uchiha (pre-Sharingan)
Shigure

D+
Chōji Akimichi (Chunin exam)
Hinata Hyuga (part 1)
Ino Yamanaka (Chunin exam)
Kin
Oboro
Tenten (Chunin exam)
Zaku

D
Misumi Tsurugi
Sakura Haruno (Chunin exam)
Yoroi Akadō

D-
Rock Lee (Just graduated Genin)
Sakura Haruno (Start)

E+
Naruto Uzumaki (pre-clone jutsu)

E-
Konohamaru Sarutobi (start)
Rock Lee (Academy flashback)

---

Moved: Kabuto Sage from S- to S.

Added: Gedō Mazō S+

Fukasaku / Shima and Manda II S-

Enma, Multi-Headed Dog, and Ibuse the Salamander to A+

Giant Clam, Baku, and the three boss summons to A.

Gamahiro/Gamaken- A-

Snake Tailed Chameleon and Drill Beaked Bird- B+

Kamatari, Giant Crab/Ox/Panda/Rhino- B

Giant Centipedes- B-

Input still welcome 🙂

On Manda II, we've had a call for S on sheer size. Though I'll note on that, that summons can be vulnerable to Genjutsu, so that strikes me as high.

Oh yea- the "three great snakes" used in the Sand/Sound invasion. B- like the Centipedes?

Any opinion on Tayuya's Doki giants as individuals? Or as a group?

YouTube video

Ah, and back to whining, are we? 🙂

Once again, it's a chart open to input from anyone who provides, y'know, reasons. You don't like that... well, who cares? There's no reason to ignore accuracy for the whims of one who whines like a petulant child.

Originally posted by Q99
That's more someone else using it as a big attack, it can't summon itself after all 🙂
It can do the same by moving forward, and could kill most of the S- list at once.

S+.

So...I wonder if anyone is going to explain the talking snake sages and why Manda v2 hasn't shown any ninjutsu.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
So...I wonder if anyone is going to explain the talking snake sages and why Manda v2 hasn't shown any ninjutsu.

An even better question is justifying how in the hell Manda got so big. The amount of food required to grow a creature that large is stupid. And to keep it hidden is even more stupid. And THEN!...the amount of time it would take to grow to that size is even MORE stupid.

But no one will want to go that far into how stupid some things in a manga, aimed at 14 year old boys, is.

animals that molt get larger each time, and kabuto has lots of captives he can feed that thing as well as random animals. he also has medicines that only he can make, like soldier pills so i'd assume he could make some kind of like steroid/hgh laced meals for that thing

Wel the fact that he was able to hide is a more pressing issue than simply being large.

Kabuto needs to be bumped up to S+. On top of his being able to use Sage Mode, Manda v2 is his own personal summon.