The Official Naruto series Thread

Started by Q991,600 pages
The regular fire is no stronger than regular fire of the same size. The earth manipulation is not stronger, either: it's the same thing as the Earth because they are manipulating the earth. Same thing with the wood. In fact, the wood seems to splinter very easily like dry wood. It appears to be weaker than living wood.

Except the fire jutsu cause way more destruction than regular fire, and so on.


An it REALLY is just plain ol' dry wood. Why do I know? Cause Yamato was rebuilding Konoha with it. If it were wet wood, it would warp like made crazy and smell while it dried.

Dry chakra wood =/= normal dry wood.

It was restraining a super-strong monster even with the 4-tails straining against it. Normal wood cannot withstand the strength that can rip through earth like this. And that giant crater? He made that too.

He also with one hand made shockwaves felt hundreds of feet away, that took out Orochimaru's snake swarm and even Sai's ink bird.


Wood a foot thick is very strong. And, he did not seem to be struggling very much when he caught him with the wood. Also, he was initializing the chakra stealing jutsu from the First. All nice elements that point to why a four tales can be capture. Also, a weak form of Oro appears to be physically stronger than the four tails cloak.

Not strong enough to hold back something that had no problem ripping through dozens of feet of Earth and punching huge craters. Not even close.

Also he had not yet activated the first's Biju jutsu, he restrained the
Kyuubi first and only started that one after it started to break free. Here

And that form of Oro used a sword to drag him something like a mile across the ground destroying every tree in it's path. It was only 'weak' in the sense that after using too much chakra/regens it started to break down, not in the sense of actually being physically weak in any way.

A final thing I'll note, Kyuubi's chakra was literally burning everything else living it touched, like Orochimaru's snakes, yet the wood stayed strong.

Originally posted by King Kandy
If we need a class above SSS then it's a sign we're inflating the top too much.

Yes, really. Considering we might have, what, 3-4 people above S+? Most if not all of whom are likely going to be SS-?

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
-Debatable but yeah I agree. He needs to be bumped up to S at least.

-Agreed.

-I wouldn't say they are only A+ in part one...S- fits. In part two they've become ridiculously hax, so they would both be above S-. Hate to say they'd be S+, but that seems to fit them best in my opinion.

kakashi's chackra pool was pretty laughable, just helping out his students, and defeating zabuza drained him to the point of having to bluff his way out of fighting some swordsman.

part II kakashi had the added benifit of kamui, and his chackra seemed to be less limited (he really stretched his chidori usage per fight limit, and used kamui and other jutsu at the same time)

but this whole idea goes to shit if we consider sliding powerlevels due to the "weaker" characters just being in the same manga as the bad guys, and naruto/sasuke pushing god tier every 50 chapters

Current list:

S-
Chiyo
Hidan
Kimimaro Kaguya (healthy)
Kisame Hoshigaki (without Samehada)
Might Gai (pt. 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (pt. 2 start)

A+
Asuma Sarutobi
Hiashi Hyuuga
Kabuto Yakushi
Kakashi Hatake (Part 1)
Kimimaro Kaguya (sick)
Might Gai (pt. 1)
Yamato

A
Ao
Baki
C
Darui
Fū (ANBU)
Hizashi Hyuuga
Jūgo
Kurenai Yuhi
Naruto Uzumaki (post elemental training)
Neji Hyuuga (pt 2)
Shikaku Nara
Suigetsu Hōzuki
Torune
Zabuza Momochi

A-
Chōjūrō
Chōza Akimichi
Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval)
Inoichi Yamanaka
Kankurō (with Sasori puppet)
Naruto Uzumaki (start of pt 2)
Shibi Aburame
Shizune
Temari (pt 2)

B+
Anko Mitarashi
Ibiki Morino
Kakashi Hatake (Kakashi Gaiden)
Kankurō (as of Sasori fight)
Rock Lee (pt 2)
Sai
Sakura Haruno (pt 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (VotE)

B
Kankurō (Sasuke Retrieval)
Naruto Uzumaki (VotE)
Sakon/Ukon
Shino Aburame (pt 2)
Shikamaru Nara (pt 2)
Temari (Sasuke Retrieval)
Tsume Inuzuka

B-
Aoba Yamashiro
Chōji Akimichi (pt 2)
Gaara (Chuunin Exam)
Hayate Gekkō
Hinata Hyuuga (pt 2)
Jirōbō
Kiba Inazuka (pt 2)
Kidōmaru
Neji Hyuuga (Sasuke Retrieval)
Tayuya

C+
Ebisu
Haku
Ino Yamanaka (part 2)
Iruka
Naruto Uzumaki (Post Rasengan Training)
Neji Hyuga (Chunin exam)
Temari (Chunin exam)
Rock Lee (Chunin exam)
Sasuke Uchiha (Chunin exam finals)

C
Dosu
Karin
Kankuro (Chunin exam)
Konohamaru Sarutobi (pt 2)
Obito (Sharingan)
Rin
Shino Aburame (Chunin exam)

C-
Kiba Inazuka (Chunin exam)
Kin
Obito (pre-Sharingan)
Tenten (Chunin exam)
Zaku

D+
Chōji Akimichi (Chunin exam)
Hinata Hyuga (pt 1)
Ino Yamanaka (Chunin exam)
Sakura Haruno (Chunin exam)

D
Sakura Haruno (Start)

E+
Naruto Uzumaki (pre-clone jutsu)

E-
Konohamaru Sarutobi (start)

Ok, I bumped down a lot of people (Kurenai, Jugo and Suigetsu again, many of the jonin), on the basis that "A- is still an incredibly badass jonin, A blanks are above many jonin, and A+ are the best of the village and practically as famous as S-class people," and also filling the special jonin category, which is still really badass, up some.

Tell me if you see any problems with this version.

I honestly think Zabuza should be higher.

He was a legitimate threat to Kakashi in part 1, and was one of the Mist's Seven Swordsman, and one of the Mist's best.

amen to that, zabuza was awesome! wish we could have seen more of what he was capable of

Originally posted by Q99
Current list:

S-
Chiyo
Hidan
Kimimaro Kaguya (healthy)
Kisame Hoshigaki (without Samehada)
Might Gai (pt. 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (pt. 2 start)

A+
Asuma Sarutobi
Hiashi Hyuuga
Kabuto Yakushi
Kakashi Hatake (Part 1)
Kimimaro Kaguya (sick)
Might Gai (pt. 1)
Yamato

A
Ao
Baki
C
Darui
Fū (ANBU)
Hizashi Hyuuga
Jūgo
Kurenai Yuhi
Naruto Uzumaki (post elemental training)
Neji Hyuuga (pt 2)
Shikaku Nara
Suigetsu Hōzuki
Torune
Zabuza Momochi

A-
Chōjūrō
Chōza Akimichi
Gaara (Sasuke Retrieval)
Inoichi Yamanaka
Kankurō (with Sasori puppet)
Naruto Uzumaki (start of pt 2)
Shibi Aburame
Shizune
Temari (pt 2)

B+
Anko Mitarashi
Ibiki Morino
Kakashi Hatake (Kakashi Gaiden)
Kankurō (as of Sasori fight)
Rock Lee (pt 2)
Sai
Sakura Haruno (pt 2)
Sasuke Uchiha (VotE)

B
Kankurō (Sasuke Retrieval)
Naruto Uzumaki (VotE)
Sakon/Ukon
Shino Aburame (pt 2)
Shikamaru Nara (pt 2)
Temari (Sasuke Retrieval)
Tsume Inuzuka

B-
Aoba Yamashiro
Chōji Akimichi (pt 2)
Gaara (Chuunin Exam)
Hayate Gekkō
Hinata Hyuuga (pt 2)
Jirōbō
Kiba Inazuka (pt 2)
Kidōmaru
Neji Hyuuga (Sasuke Retrieval)
Tayuya

C+
Ebisu
Haku
Ino Yamanaka (part 2)
Iruka
Naruto Uzumaki (Post Rasengan Training)
Neji Hyuga (Chunin exam)
Temari (Chunin exam)
Rock Lee (Chunin exam)
Sasuke Uchiha (Chunin exam finals)

C
Dosu
Karin
Kankuro (Chunin exam)
Konohamaru Sarutobi (pt 2)
Obito (Sharingan)
Rin
Shino Aburame (Chunin exam)

C-
Kiba Inazuka (Chunin exam)
Kin
Obito (pre-Sharingan)
Tenten (Chunin exam)
Zaku

D+
Chōji Akimichi (Chunin exam)
Hinata Hyuga (pt 1)
Ino Yamanaka (Chunin exam)
Sakura Haruno (Chunin exam)

D
Sakura Haruno (Start)

E+
Naruto Uzumaki (pre-clone jutsu)

E-
Konohamaru Sarutobi (start)

Ok, I bumped down a lot of people (Kurenai, Jugo and Suigetsu again, many of the jonin), on the basis that "A- is still an incredibly badass jonin, A blanks are above many jonin, and A+ are the best of the village and practically as famous as S-class people," and also filling the special jonin category, which is still really badass, up some.

Tell me if you see any problems with this version.

Start of Part 2 Kakashi for S-. It took him a while to get the Mangekyo activated, and his aim with Kamui wasn't very good.

Also, I need clarification as to why Naruto (VotE) is B, while Sasuke (VotE) is B+. They were roughly equal in power. His Kyuubi cloak made him incredibly fast by Part 1 standards.

Originally posted by NemeBro
I honestly think Zabuza should be higher.

He was a legitimate threat to Kakashi in part 1, and was one of the Mist's Seven Swordsman, and one of the Mist's best.

In A+? Dunno.
IMO, he tops the A tier though.


Start of Part 2 Kakashi for S-. It took him a while to get the Mangekyo activated, and his aim with Kamui wasn't very good.

Right, agreed.

Also, I need clarification as to why Naruto (VotE) is B, while Sasuke (VotE) is B+. They were roughly equal in power. His Kyuubi cloak made him incredibly fast by Part 1 standards.

Hm, it shouldn't, I think I was toying with moving them back and fourth and forgot to move them both back.

I'm kinda torn on them. Naruto's definitely a lot better post-timeskip, but his combat prowess still strikes me as pretty near the special jonin range, so B would give a larger gap, which makes sense. However, curse seal and kyuubi'd out, they are rather strong....


In A+? Dunno.
IMO, he tops the A tier though.

We do know he tried to off the Mizukage, which is impressive, but I do think ability wise he seemed to be A.

Originally posted by Q99

Hm, it shouldn't, I think I was toying with moving them back and fourth and forgot to move them both back.

I'm kinda torn on them. Naruto's definitely a lot better post-timeskip, but his combat prowess still strikes me as pretty near the special jonin range, so B would give a larger gap, which makes sense. However, curse seal and kyuubi'd out, they are rather strong....

Though, come to think of it, Sasuke can go cursed seal 2 at will, while Naruto only went one-tail under heavy emotional duress. So even though their max power is similar, there are some differences.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
In A+? Dunno.
IMO, he tops the A tier though.
I could see him manhandling damn near all of the A tier easily.

He is nearly as fast as Kakashi, is stronger and better in Taijutsu, is still in the top 5 Water jutsu users we have seen, and his Mist jutsu combined with his silent killing hax makes him ossim.

A
Ao
Baki
C
Darui
Fū (ANBU)
Hizashi Hyuuga
Jūgo
Kurenai Yuhi
Naruto Uzumaki (post elemental training)
Neji Hyuuga (pt 2)
Shikaku Nara
Suigetsu Hōzuki
Torune
Zabuza Momochi

Originally posted by NemeBro
I could see him manhandling damn near all of the A tier easily.

lol wut?

suigetsu is too much for him

When Kakashi got serious and decided to stop screwing around, Zabuza became less than a nuisance to him. The only time Zabuza ever had an advantage on Kakashi was when he took him by surprise. Dude hadn't even used his sharingan yet.

The thing Zabuza has going for him is he is really, really good at sneaking up on and killing people.

Originally posted by Q99
The thing Zabuza has going for him is he is really, really good at sneaking up on and killing people.
like a....ninja, huh weird

Originally posted by menokokoro
like a....ninja, huh weird

It's kinda funny how historically, there's no record of a successful ninja assassination to my knowledge, they were more used for stuff like spying or sabotage (opening the gate to an enemy castle = very useful).

Originally posted by Q99
Except the fire jutsu cause way more destruction than regular fire, and so on.

Uh... no it doesn't. 😬

Show me one example of the fire jutsu the that Uchiha use, being any stronger than a big ass ball of fire accelerated and blown at something.

Originally posted by Q99
Dry chakra wood =/= normal dry wood.

Yeah, it pretty much is. I do not see why you keep debating this point. It is not debatable. There is not one example showing that wood being any stronger than any other wood.

Originally posted by Q99
It was restraining a super-strong monster even with the 4-tails straining against it. Normal wood cannot withstand the strength that can rip through earth like this. And that giant crater? He made that too.

Yeah, he made that crater through...get this...a chakra explosion. A chakra explosion that would easily blow away that wood used to restrain him.

Originally posted by Q99
He also with one hand made shockwaves felt hundreds of feet away, that took out Orochimaru's snake swarm and even Sai's ink bird.

Irrelevant.

I already told you why just "plain" ol' wood was able to restrain Naruto in 4-tails. It didn't restrain him, it delayed him by one or two seconds. Are you going to ignore all of the other times that the wood was easily blocked/destroyed by weak means?

Also, without the necklace (it was destroyed) he can no longer "subdue" hosts in their cloaks, anyway. So much for he wood, right?

That pretty much wraps up that portion of the discussion. Do you agree?

Originally posted by Q99
Not strong enough to hold back something that had no problem ripping through dozens of feet of Earth and punching huge craters. Not even close.

Irrelevant. Already covered.

Originally posted by Q99
Also he had not yet activated the first's Biju jutsu, he restrained the
Kyuubi first and only started that one after it started to break free. Here

More proof that I'm right. You've hurt you opinion, not helped it. That really stong host tore it apart like it was nothing. It's quite clear that Yamato did that to delay Naruto JUST enough so he could seal the chakra.

Originally posted by Q99
And that form of Oro used a sword to drag him something like a mile across the ground destroying every tree in it's path. It was only 'weak' in the sense that after using too much chakra/regens it started to break down, not in the sense of actually being physically weak in any way.

Hey, just sayin'. Making sure you knew what version of Oro was fighting Naruto. Sure, Naruto is strong, but Oro appeared to be physically stronger while in a weakened state.

Originally posted by Q99
A final thing I'll note, Kyuubi's chakra was literally burning everything else living it touched, like Orochimaru's snakes, yet the wood stayed strong.

That's easy to explain: Naruto wasn't "blasting" chakra when the wood attacked him like in those other situations you described.

Like I've stated, it's wood. Dry wood, at that. That same dry wood is used to build houses. It's not super wood. Never is it stated. It WOULD be stated if it were. For example, Kimimaro's bones are specifically stated to be as strong as steel. Kakashi is said to be so fast that he cut a lightning bolt with his jutsu. Gai's body got so heated up that water was evaporating off of him. In other words, techniques are explained. Yamato's technique was explained. It's not stronger than wood, it IS wood.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Uh... no it doesn't. 😬

Show me one example of the fire jutsu the that Uchiha use, being any stronger than a big ass ball of fire accelerated and blown at something.

naruto vs sasuke, he melted the rock. itachi vs sasuke, breaking through stone ceiling.

Originally posted by Q99
Though, come to think of it, Sasuke can go cursed seal 2 at will, while Naruto only went one-tail under heavy emotional duress. So even though their max power is similar, there are some differences.

Good point. Then you should probably put Naruto (One Tail) as B+, because there is barely any difference between Base Naruto (VotE) and Base Naruto. (Post Rasengan mastery)

Originally posted by Q99
It's kinda funny how historically, there's no record of a successful ninja assassination to my knowledge, they were more used for stuff like spying or sabotage (opening the gate to an enemy castle = very useful).

Technically speaking, Itachi did assassinate his father. Pain assassinated Hanzo as well.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
lol wut?

suigetsu is too much for him

Which is why he should be in A+ 313
Going by what we've seen, he's better than Asuma, and his Water Form is pretty hax, unless he's up against a Raiton user. If he's merged with Water, he's the most durable ninja in the series right now.

Is nobody considering the idea that Yamato can make his wood of different varieties? Like, the strength could vary depending on how much chakra he puts into producing it? That would make sense to me.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Is nobody considering the idea that Yamato can make his wood of different varieties? Like, the strength could vary depending on how much chakra he puts into producing it? That would make sense to me.

ON this I agree. Wood density can vary, greatly, within the same tree.

Originally posted by menokokoro
naruto vs sasuke, he melted the rock. itachi vs sasuke, breaking through stone ceiling.

Again, how is this, "being any stronger than a big ass ball of fire accelerated and blown at something."

You do realize that it would be VERY hot and, on top of that, would be traveling at a really high velocity. So, basically, it's REALLY hot air being blown at a high speed.