The Official Naruto series Thread

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Why? He basically completely repeated what he did last time he turned skinny.

"LOUD MONOLOGUE, BUTTERFLY WINGS AND FALCON PAUNCH".

I mean, the only difference between now and last time is that he can do it without dying. 😐

Being able to do something powerful without any large negative effects is leet. Hell, his Dad isn't doing it and he seems pretty damn surprised that Choji is doing it.

That and he is saying that he is able to end this battle. Holy crap.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Why is Kushina S+?

Cause our little QT is a Kushina fan. 😖hifty:

I am too though. She does however lack feats.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Why? He basically completely repeated what he did last time he turned skinny.

"LOUD MONOLOGUE, BUTTERFLY WINGS AND FALCON PAUNCH".

I mean, the only difference between now and last time is that he can do it without dying. 😐

I agree with this about 90%. However, that other 10% likes the fact that Choji may be finally growing up...which I thought he already did. K..it's hard to be Choji supporter.

The not dying part may not necessarily be true, either. He very well could die. The only difference is he can activate that mode without the pills. Seems like he's just as likely to die and it's a self-activated death.

Choji should learn sage mode. awesome That way, he doesn't have to almost die everytime he uses butterfly mode...which is utterly g*y for a character as manly as an Akimichi clan member (they always seemed like the "manly" versions of ninjas...but butterfly mode is making them seem more like the closet cross-dressing type.)

Originally posted by BloodRain
Why is Kushina S+?

Because she had one of the best skills at sealing techniques in the manga, had the highest chakra levels of anyone (an Uzumaki clan member+ the most chakra powerful tailed-beast makes for the most chakra intensive person in all of Naruto minus the Great Sage himself) and the most important factor: she had control over her tailed beast. Her tailed beast is the most powerful beast. As I pointed out, Naruto in 8-tails mode greatly eclipsed the blast from the Hachibi. That version of the Kyuubi has only half of it's chakra. Kushina had full control over a full-powered Kyuubi. That's just insane. Very few could stand against her and that list is probably less than 5 long. She's definitely one of the most powerful and formidable ninjas in all the history of Naruto (only one other person, the previous host of the Kyuubi, was able to get control. Naruto is at about 50% to 75%, so not even he's at full control yet.) Apparantly, Kushina MAY have taught Minato the Rasengan.

Originally posted by dadudemon
She had control over her tailed beast.

Have yet to seen this~.

Let's not forget that *sans tailed beast*, she was strong enough to restrain the Kyuubi. That's S-class ability right there.

If aside from that she has Yugito-level control and can do menace balls, which judging by the way she handles Kyuubi inside Naruto's mind strikes me as conservative, then she's S+.

Not Killerbee level friendship, but she can rope Kyuubi at any time.

Originally posted by Q99
Let's not forget that *sans tailed beast*, she was strong enough to restrain the Kyuubi. That's S-class ability right there.

If aside from that she has Yugito-level control and can do menace balls, which judging by the way she handles Kyuubi inside Naruto's mind strikes me as conservative, then she's S+.

Not Killerbee level friendship, but she can rope Kyuubi at any time.

Indeed. Ever other Jinchuriki died from a beast extraction: her life-force was so strong that she survived it being ripped out of her as she was fully conscious AFTER having given birth.

And, her level of control of the Kyuubi was absolute, but not Naruto Sage type stuff. I think Naruto is unique in what he's done and Kushina even told him that he had to do it...

The Kyuubi was at her mercy. If she were at full power? The Kyuubi wouldn't stand a chance.

La de da let's assume things without reason.

Much obliged for the help Danzo.

That and her fighting style was said to be like Naruto's, meaning she was probably a clone user. Not someone like Bee.

And yes, her chakra would be able to hold the Kyuubi considering that was kinda her job. Does not make her, as a shinobi, look impressive.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
La de da let's assume things without reason.

Note Danzo was only talking 'total control'.

Yugito could activate her beast at will and wasn't listed as total.

Naruto, currently, does not have total.

The temple where KB is training Naruto has apparently been used to control the beast many time before.

"Ability to partially or entirely transform on purpose" seems to be a common ability for mature Jinchuuriki that does not require total control.

That and her fighting style was said to be like Naruto's, meaning she was probably a clone user. Not someone like Bee.

I got the impression they were talking more about rasengan-type moves, and generallly being a 'rough and tumble, but powerful, ninjutsu type,' probably a close in fighter, as opposed to having a style like Minato.

In any case, they spoke of her as being strong.

And yes, her chakra would be able to hold the Kyuubi considering that was kinda her job. Does not make her, as a shinobi, look impressive.

With a jutsu, while it's outside of her, rather than the 4-element seal designed to hold it? That is very impressive.

It's one thing to have it contained inside a ninja with a seal, and another to tie it up on the outside.

Not to mention, she had S-class seal knowledge outside of that. She taught Minato the high-level Uzumaki techniques designed for jinchuuriki like the four-element seal.

So she's good in two S-class areas, plus is a 9-tails jinchuuriki with not total, but certainly high, levels of control, and a clan bloodline of exceptional chakra that makes her well suited to being a jinchuuriki.

Originally posted by Q99
Note Danzo was only talking 'total control'.

Yugito could activate her beast at will and wasn't listed as total.

Naruto, currently, does not have total.

The temple where KB is training Naruto has apparently been used to control the beast many time before.

"Ability to partially or entirely transform on purpose" seems to be a common ability for mature Jinchuuriki that does not require total control.

Yugito went full beast mode after Hidan said a particularly rude comment.

What does Yugito having control prove for Kushina by the way?

Yes, mostly so that if the Jinchuuriki failed(which they probably did more often than not) they have the Beast trapped in a place where they can't get out.

Originally posted by Q99
I got the impression they were talking more about rasengan-type moves, and generally being a 'rough and tumble, but powerful, ninjutsu type,' probably a close in fighter, as opposed to having a style like Minato.

In any case, they spoke of her as being strong.

Eh, Minato invented that move. It would really depend on when he got the inspiration for it that determines when Kushina could have managed to learn it.

There is a great difference between strong and S+.

Originally posted by Q99
With a jutsu, while it's outside of her, rather than the 4-element seal designed to hold it? That is very impressive.

It's one thing to have it contained inside a ninja with a seal, and another to tie it up on the outside.

Not to mention, she had S-class seal knowledge outside of that. She taught Minato the high-level Uzumaki techniques designed for jinchuuriki like the four-element seal.
.

We actually do not know the circumstances of her seal.

She tied it up outside using her special chakra chains. Again, since that is a directly special chakra link of hers and we've seen it done on only one thing, the thing she won't be encountering in a fight, how does that make her an S+ shinobi.

Why did she do that?

Originally posted by Q99
Note Danzo was only talking 'total control'.

Yugito could activate her beast at will and wasn't listed as total.

Naruto, currently, does not have total.

The temple where KB is training Naruto has apparently been used to control the beast many time before.

"Ability to partially or entirely transform on purpose" seems to be a common ability for mature Jinchuuriki that does not require total control.

I got the impression they were talking more about rasengan-type moves, and generallly being a 'rough and tumble, but powerful, ninjutsu type,' probably a close in fighter, as opposed to having a style like Minato.

In any case, they spoke of her as being strong.

With a jutsu, while it's outside of her, rather than the 4-element seal designed to hold it? That is very impressive.

It's one thing to have it contained inside a ninja with a seal, and another to tie it up on the outside.

Not to mention, she had S-class seal knowledge outside of that. She taught Minato the high-level Uzumaki techniques designed for jinchuuriki like the four-element seal.

So she's good in two S-class areas, plus is a 9-tails jinchuuriki with not total, but certainly high, levels of control, and a clan bloodline of exceptional chakra that makes her well suited to being a jinchuuriki.

All good reasons. I think Madara's comment was more on a level of 'mind control' or severe will control rather than the unique relationship that B and the Hachibi share.

In order for Minato to get to study the chakra ball...it had to be in a controlled fashion. He did NOT have her chakra ability, did not have control over the kyuubi...etc. The only way he could have done that is on a date...which that date sounds damn sexy.

Minato: Yo, Kushina...show me your chakra balls.
Kushina: RAAAAAAAAWR!
Minato: 😮 😮 😮...................................................*skeeeeets*pained

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Yugito went full beast mode after Hidan said a particularly rude comment.

What does Yugito having control prove for Kushina by the way?

That full awakening like that isn't rare among jinchuuriki and that Kushina, known for having special chakra good for being a jinchuuriki and who could handle Kyuubi in the mindscape pretty easily, would certainly qualify.

Yes, mostly so that if the Jinchuuriki failed(which they probably did more often than not) they have the Beast trapped in a place where they can't get out.

Point is, it's not unknown for Jinchuuriki to succeed either (probably mostly 2-tails users there).

High levels of biju control can happen without reaching Killerbee/Yagura level total control, and having the same ability to awaken the Biju like Yugito Nii is pretty much all she'd need to be S+.

There is a great difference between strong and S+.

That difference is being a jinchuuriki able to do high tail Biju transformation. Even if she can just do 6 tails, that'd make her S+ class for the same reason Killerbee is.

One more thing: Post sealing Kyuubi in the chamber, Naruto still has becoming a stronger Ninja than his mother as a goal.

And he just experienced how strong she was.

We actually do not know the circumstances of her seal.

The seal's not the chains is my point. Her seal wasn't helping her when it was on the outside. So she didn't have the seal preventing it from using it's full strength like when a biju is inside a host, she restrained the Kyuubi just by being that strong.

-
Mito probably made her seal, but she was the one who taught Minato the seal to use on Naruto.

She tied it up outside using her special chakra chains. Again, since that is a directly special chakra link of hers and we've seen it done on only one thing, the thing she won't be encountering in a fight, how does that make her an S+ shinobi.

Because it's able to hold the most powerful Biju physically, and said Biju was just barely being pushed back by Hiruzen and dozens of other ninja.

Yea, sure, she won't bump into Kyuubi often, but it means she could do the same to any other Biju like Hachibi and many other strong opponents.

So we know she has an S-class ninjutsu, the chains. S-class seal knowledge. And is a high-control Jinchuuriki.

Originally posted by Q99
Point is, it's not unknown for Jinchuuriki to succeed either (probably mostly 2-tails users there).

High levels of biju control can happen without reaching Killerbee/Yagura level total control, and having the same ability to awaken the Biju like Yugito Nii is pretty much all she'd need to be S+.

But without proof, we have nothing to go on. And just because Yugito might have been able to partially control(which is arguable for several reasons) does not mean Kushina can.

Proof that she has this ability?

Originally posted by Q99
That difference is being a jinchuuriki able to do high tail Biju transformation. Even if she can just do 6 tails, that'd make her S+ class for the same reason Killerbee is.

One more thing: Post sealing Kyuubi in the chamber, Naruto still has becoming a stronger Ninja than his mother as a goal.

And he just experienced how strong she was.

Yes, if she can. I've yet to see anything that indicates that she can.

Naruto has never seen her fight...?

Originally posted by Q99
The seal's not the chains is my point. Her seal wasn't helping her when it was on the outside. So she didn't have the seal preventing it from using it's full strength like when a biju is inside a host, she restrained the Kyuubi just by being that strong.

Mito probably made her seal, but she was the one who taught Minato the seal to use on Naruto.

Or it's cause her chakra is specifically able to stop the Kyuubi. Note that stopping the Kyuubi and actually being able to control it are two different things.

Why did she teach him seals?

Originally posted by Q99
Because it's able to hold the most powerful Biju physically, and said Biju was just barely being pushed back by Hiruzen and dozens of other ninja.

So we know she has an S-class ninjutsu, the chains. S-class seal knowledge. And is a high-control Jinchuuriki.

Yes, the only thing we've seen her use it on. What makes you think the chains can just be used willy nilly in combat?

S-class seal knowledge is the only one we know of. S-Class ninjutsu I have not seen. The chains technique does not sound like a technique that would make Tsunade say her style is like Naruto's. And we have no evidence that she has any control over the Kyuubi, short of chaining it up.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Here's my take on that mode: it's like the chakra storage Tsunade does and it is used to activate like a Sage Mode because it's a definite power increase which should improve speed.

You know what I mean? It's Sage Mode + Creation Rebirth (without the healing portion...just the chakra storage and the use-age version) = Butterfly Mode.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I think its more akin to A's nintaijutsu.

Originally posted by Q99
Yea, they're all similar in gaining extreme strength simply through huge amounts of chakra. Probably somewhat different applications, but the basic ideas are similar.

What Q said. Down at their basic levels, their stats get amped thanks to the immense chakra used up in the tech.
A's Raiton Shroud tech is slightly different in that he's using chakra that he already has, while the other two have to convert fat into chakra (Akimichi clan) or release stored up chakra. (Tsunade)

That said, the Calorie control tech is similar to Creation Rebirth in that it needs certain factors to be present before activation. Stored up Chakra for CR, and extreme fat for the CC tech, so A's technique has far easier access, depending on the circumstances.
We'll have to see if the chakra can be reverse converted into fat.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Why is Kushina S+?

She's Minato's wife awesome

~ Mostly implied ability.

For some reason the current argument is reminding me of this scene.

😛

^ Nice cop-out 313

Point out the cop-out good sir. 131

The intent should be obvious. 😛

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
But without proof, we have nothing to go on. And just because Yugito might have been able to partially control(which is arguable for several reasons) does not mean Kushina can.

Proof that she has this ability?

We don't have absolute proof, but it's common for adult jinchuuriki.

Going by the anime, 6-tails had it too.

So at least three of the last generation can do transformations, and controlling Biju is something Kushina's chakra is noted to be good at.

Yes, if she can. I've yet to see anything that indicates that she can.

Naruto has never seen her fight...?

He just saw her against the Kyuubi and her jutsu in action. He was also a sensor at that point and could detect her chakra right there.

And I'm not sure how much of the flashback he saw, but since it's mindscape he may have been able to see some of that too.

Or it's cause her chakra is specifically able to stop the Kyuubi. Note that stopping the Kyuubi and actually being able to control it are two different things.

Stopping does help one obtain control, but let's just go with the stopping alone:

Without the Kyuubi, she's able to stop the Kyuubi. Hiruzen was having much more problem doing that.

Keep in mind the aspect which made it able to stop the Kyuubi in the real world is how strong it is. It's not like it was doing anything to Kyuubi except holding it down.

Why did she teach him seals?

Because she thought it'd be helpful for him, presumably. And it did help him when she was giving birth.

Yes, the only thing we've seen her use it on. What makes you think the chains can just be used willy nilly in combat?

We've gotten no indication at all that they can't be used on other things.

They physically restrained him, after all.

Presumably they take a large amount of chakra, but normally she'd have more too.

The chains technique does not sound like a technique that would make Tsunade say her style is like Naruto's.

A menace ball would be, though.

Also so would a similar physical style.

I mean, it could be clones for all I know, but I don't think anyone in the manga has made that connection. Her jutsu style was apparently pretty unique.

And we have no evidence that she has any control over the Kyuubi, short of chaining it up.

Being able to restrain it is the primary requirement for learning how to control a tailed beast's chakra.

Oh yes, one more thing:

Hiruzen tried to get physically through the chain barrier, but couldn't.

So it works on non-Biju.

Oh, one third thing: Kushina chakra in the seal would help Naruto control the Kyuubi one day.

So, specific reference to her chakra in seals making control via seals easier too.

Would seem rather odd if she didn't have at least normal levels of control.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
What Q said. Down at their basic levels, their stats get amped thanks to the immense chakra used up in the tech.
A's Raiton Shroud tech is slightly different in that he's using chakra that he already has, while the other two have to convert fat into chakra (Akimichi clan) or release stored up chakra. (Tsunade)

Is this the end of sage mode btw?