Originally posted by Q99
Couldn't 4th Kaze just use gold to fly himself above the sandwich, much like how Gaara flies around? Also stopping a gold wave seems like it'd be hard since it could just flow around an earth barrier. So while it'd be a good fight, my money would be on Yondy.Gai could win with his max gates, but let's compare overall utility. 4th Kaze can throw multiple gold tsunamis, and unlike Gai his high-end powers can be used defensively too, to shield others. He's more multi-faceted.
I don't think he'd be fast enough to evade the Sandwich once it's out, assuming he is standing still as he normally does when fighting. Also worth noting is that while Kitsuchi is a top tier Earth user, he's also fast on his feet. My money's on Yondy too, but that Sandwich tech would be deadly to Yondy Kaze.
Most definitely. Gai's a beast in one-on-one combat, and even against small groups that cannot handle his speed, but he's pretty much centered around close combat. Group battles and misc. situations are a different story though, one where people like Gaara & his dad shine. Even Muu and Onoki as well, though those two are likely beasts in any type of combat situation.
Originally posted by Q99
The S- ones who stand the best chance of winning, the ones we're discussing right now, are the ones who are most focused on styles that are most focused on killing one on one or having a single all-or-nothing attack, I note. Yondy, on the flip side, is a high utility fighter who's optimized for group battle, in addition to being really dangerous in one on one battle. The S- with more versatility and utility, don't seem like they'd do so well.
Agreed, more or less. Mountain Sandwich isn't a tech that is all-or-nothing IMO, but still, agreed.
So, Gaara didn't flip out like Sasuke did, but he got a full-page to showcase him crying, like Sasuke. srug
Originally posted by TheAuraAngelSpoiler:
So Gaara beat his Daddy. Mizukage turns out to be a genjutsu user and has a summon...A GIANT CLAM!
He is officially win. Oh and Raikage is just like his freaking kid.
Oh and Temari is one stupid shit.
Naruto and Bee vs Itachi and Nagato. Should be fun.
Spoiler:
Thanks to his Mommy. Seriously though, now it's weird. Did Karura really give Gaara his auto-shield? I believe it to be the case, but I could also see it as Karura's love acting like Kushina's & Minato's love.Wonder what a Clam would do. Maybe emit some sort of mist that affects a large area and causes everyone in it to fall under a genjutsu. Nah, A's father is >> A. He has Black Lightningz, so he has Ninjutsu as well.
Yeah, A's father put her in her place. Also, what he said was kind of stupid. Why would he tell the Doton users to oppose him, when Doton is weak to Raiton? Should be the Fuuton users who should oppose him.
Originally posted by TheAuraAngelSpoiler:
I thought the same thing. And we have seen Toad Song, which was pretty high level.Was mostly meaning genjutsu users in general. They don't seem quite the taijutsu types. And Idk, certain Kage or Kage candidates aren't notably strong in some areas.
Itachi and Kurenai are both top tier genjutsu users, and both are good in taijutsu. I can say that for sure in regards to Itachi, but Kurenai was fast enough to block a kick from Itachi, so she must be good I guess.
Originally posted by Q99Spoiler:
Interesting! The first Genjutsu kage. That would explain how he could take on Muu- he doesn't need to match him power for power. We can also finally see what high-level non-sharingan genjutsu looks like.
Spoiler:
He has to be roughly in the same ball-park as far as physical stats go though. Muu is incredibly destructive; he has 3 elements to manipulate, in addition to Dust-Release. He can turn invisible, and he can fly, which is a big deal.Mizukage can apparently freeze Sand from the looks of it, so he definitely has more going for him than just genjutsu.
Originally posted by King Kandy
Does this chapter answer the Kurara question? The way i'm reading it, the power was Shukaku's but Kurara's will caused it to be protective instead of just murderous.
If Yashamaru's words are correct, then I don't think so. It was Karura's will, not Shukaku's power, that caused the Sand to protect Gaara.
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
I don't think he'd be fast enough to evade the Sandwich once it's out, assuming he is standing still as he normally does when fighting. Also worth noting is that while Kitsuchi is a top tier Earth user, he's also fast on his feet. My money's on Yondy too, but that Sandwich tech would be deadly to Yondy Kaze.Most definitely. Gai's a beast in one-on-one combat, and even against small groups that cannot handle his speed, but he's pretty much centered around close combat. Group battles and misc. situations are a different story though, one where people like Gaara & his dad shine. Even Muu and Onoki as well, though those two are likely beasts in any type of combat situation.
Agreed, more or less. Mountain Sandwich isn't a tech that is all-or-nothing IMO, but still, agreed.
All that said, final rating?
Itachi and Kurenai are both top tier genjutsu users, and both are good in taijutsu. I can say that for sure in regards to Itachi, but Kurenai was fast enough to block a kick from Itachi, so she must be good I guess.
By the databook, she has the taijutsu skills, but lowish physical stats.
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Yeah, A's father put her in her place. Also, what he said was kind of stupid. Why would he tell the Doton users to oppose him, when Doton is weak to Raiton? Should be the Fuuton users who should oppose him.
Originally posted by Q99
All that said, final rating?By the databook, she has the taijutsu skills, but lowish physical stats.
Low-end S or high-end S-. He's not as good as Gaara is right now, nor does he have the auto-shield, but I think his Gold could be used in nearly the same way that Gaara uses his Sand. That Third Eye tech of his is what makes me think so. Then there's his versatility in combat.
Though I don't adhere to the Databook's stats, her speed stat seems to be high. Stamina & Speed are what factor most into Taijutsu IMO.
Originally posted by Q99
I'm going to call mistranslation 🙂 In fact, I'm seeing a different version up now, where he's warning the Doton users that they'll be his first target, and Temari thanking him for the warning then asking for more info.
This is what I thought as well. It doesn't make sense for him to tell Doton users to fight against him, when he's the kind of guy that's far more interested in being stopped, than he is in killing for his controller.
Wow...Gaara's dad makes Itachi look decent in comparison. At least we don't get to see his stupid gold powers anymore.
I wonder if the 3rd Raikage's Raiton cloak appearance gives him super-speed like his son's does. Just think of how potential overpowered he could be along with actual ninjutsu.
Gaara's Dad is S-? Hmmm...even if his powers are stupid they seem pretty convinient to use since they function similar to Gaara's sand. Did you guys already go over the 3rd Kazakage's rank?
wow, Gaara's dad sure did mess up Gaara's life before it ever started. at least, some issues for Gaara have been cleared up so that the dad will end up losing soon once the other kages are taken down.
man, Nagato and Itachi vs Naruto and Killer Bee. two people with some overpowered eyes (for the Narutoverse anyway) up against two jinchuuriki. this should be interesting.
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
You are over-examining and over-looking things. In that instance, Gaara sent his sand out at the same time, (if not just before), that Yondy sent his Gold out. The fact that the Sand & Gold met at the half-way point of the distance between Gaara and Yondy, means that they were moving at about the same speed prior to the clash.
Wrong, that means that Yondaime Kazekage (YK, from now on) would have to have sent his sound out first and Gaara sent his out twice as fast (I'm not sure how much more dense gold sand is than quarts-like sand) in order for them to cancel out. Thus proving me right about Gaara being faster.
If he didn't do that, his sand would have been take over. We clearly saw something similar to that take place already. It's not over-complicated as that's the exact reason YK's sand "neutralized" Gaara's in the first place.
Half the speed, double the density. It could actually be closer to a third the speed, triple the density.
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
I already knew what you were referring to when you said 'not even 1/10th of the way'. His gold does not stop the movement of Gaara's sand by acting as a wall. It stops it by acting as an 'impurity' in the Sand. .
I disagree since it was quite clearly established that it was the density of the sand. Purity was never mentioned.
Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
In addition, collisions in Naruto-verse do not have to follow our laws of physics. Sage Mode Naruto, who is 51 kilos, completely stopped an ~100 ton Rhino that was charging at him, whilst stationary. He barely moved after they collided.
By our laws, he should have been skewered on the horn while the Rhino kept charging, or sent flying across Konoha like a hopeless idiot, while the Rhino kept charging.
This is a strawman as it completely overlooks that fact that gold sand was called heavier and that was the explanation given.
Also, you'd still be wrong because he can plant himself by "gripping" a very large amount of earth. You think they climb on the trees by gripping, with chakra, just the bark? If they did that, they'd fall right off because the bark is too thin. They have to grip much deeper than that.
So it's easy to explain, especially because the earth "morphs" where his feet are, that he was gripping tons of earth with that walk on trees chakra technique...but just super duper that time.
Also, this chapte was mostly lame. We already established the Gaara love thing, last chapter. We already established YK's motives. yadda yadda yadda.
It should have ended there and Gaara said something like, "I forgive you, father. Now let me show you what a real Kazekage is like" and then taken out all 4 of the Zombie Kages. That would have been a much better chapter.
Originally posted by Demonic PhoenixSpoiler:
Thanks to his Mommy. Seriously though, now it's weird. Did Karura really give Gaara his auto-shield? I believe it to be the case, but I could also see it as Karura's love acting like Kushina's & Minato's love.Wonder what a Clam would do. Maybe emit some sort of mist that affects a large area and causes everyone in it to fall under a genjutsu. Nah, A's father is >> A. He has Black Lightningz, so he has Ninjutsu as well.
Yeah, A's father put her in her place. Also, what he said was kind of stupid. Why would he tell the Doton users to oppose him, when Doton is weak to Raiton? Should be the Fuuton users who should oppose him.
Itachi and Kurenai are both top tier genjutsu users, and both are good in taijutsu. I can say that for sure in regards to Itachi, but Kurenai was fast enough to block a kick from Itachi, so she must be good I guess.
Spoiler:
Ah. Does it really matter? It's only meant to prove Karura loves her kid more than Kushina, but that isn't true.The clam will destroy the world. And yeah, but Raiton armor seems his preferred technique at the moment.
I was confused too. Maybe he reasoned that Doton users were from Muu's village and he wanted revenge for the rude things Muu said? awesome
Eh...technically the databook says you're right about Itachi...but it's not like we saw much of it in action. And it's cute that you mentioned Kurenai. *pats head*
Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
Gaara's Dad is S-? Hmmm...even if his powers are stupid they seem pretty convinient to use since they function similar to Gaara's sand. Did you guys already go over the 3rd Kazakage's rank?
3rd Kazekage, seems like a safe S, considering he's supposed to be the strongest Kazekage (of the first 4 at least). And judging from the puppet, it seems likely that he can do what Gaaradad does, and make a wider variety of shapes/weapons with his 'sand'.
We're still discussing Gaara's dad's rank. I think he's a full S but low in it, others have been arguing S-. What do you think?
dadudemonWrong, that means that Yondaime Kazekage (YK, from now on) would have to have sent his sound out first and Gaara sent his out twice as fast (I'm not sure how much more dense gold sand is than quarts-like sand) in order for them to cancel out. Thus proving me right about Gaara being faster.
That only has to do with the amount of power behind them with impact, which has other factors in play since it is telekinetically/magnetically controlled materials in the first place.
The fact they were launched at the same time and met half way means they were going the same speed.
The fact that they cancelled out even though Gold has more mass probably means Gaara put more chakra into it, used more sand, and/or simply that the extra momentum was enough to get some headway (where the two sand streams meet, they seem to 'explode' out a bit more towards Gaara than YK), but not enough to actually overcome that much sand and force Gaara had put in.
If you look at the page, Gaara is sending a much wider stream of sand than YK is of gold. YK's steam is smoother and more direct too, while Gaara's wobbles a bit. So 'Gaara's sending more sand' seems likely.