Avenged Sevenfold

and this is a music discussion encompassing everything about their music...i focus on technique, u focus on sound...this is so silly...i mean, i could sit here and do exactly what you do, say everything that you say is silly and has no backing...what they're not doin is making music that everyone will like, and unless you have seen them life, i suggest you not comment on their playing ability and stick to your opinion on the way their music sounds....and by the way, i havent defended them all the way and im not bent out of shape about it...i openly admitted that m.shadows has seen better days vocally...they're rhythm guitarist and bassist are very mediocre as compared to their lead and drummer...but why not focus on individuals when you focus on lombardo, eddie van halen, etc.

and by the way master of the music, why dont you elaborate for us all what is supposedly "wrong" with music since you have a plethera of other opinions...i would like to hear what the know all music man has to say about this.

and for god's sake, you're comment about me not accepting that fact that you don't like what you hear has never been an issue which ive raised time and time again.....it's your constant badgering about me liking their technality that is causing these posts. You have consistently tried to rip me for thinking they are technically excellent, by naming all these bands they sound innovatively like and by comparing them to other people and saying, well these guys would burn a hole in avenged's instruments. i have never said anything like...well, you dont like their sound so im gonna rip you for that...none of my posts have been about that..it has been they're playing ability, now whether or not you like their sound, good for you..im happy for you if you dont like their sound or if you do...great.....but, it sounds to me that you know nothing of technicality so i think you should drop this whole gag....i mean, you probably dont have the first clue how to read music, to write it, know what sextuplets are or anything, so why i bother with you, i dont know....

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
and this is a music discussion encompassing everything about their music...i focus on technique, u focus on sound...this is so silly...i mean, i could sit here and do exactly what you do, say everything that you say is silly and has no backing...what they're not doin is making music that everyone will like, and unless you have seen them life, i suggest you not comment on their playing ability and stick to your opinion on the way their music sounds....

They don't automatically gain some newfound technical ability when they play live, you know that right? When they play their songs live, they're not technically better than on record for some inexplicable reason. Let's break this down shall we? Because you're being rather stupid:

You're discussing technique because of how impressive YOU think it is and how impressive your buddies think it is. That doesn't prove technique, it just proves you like the technique. I am focusing on the MUSIC THEY MAKE AS A BAND. You know, the more important aspect in this discussion. Technique is irrelevant, it doesn't concern me in this debate. I'm discussing why I believe them to be a mediocre band. I can't prove it, I can't MAKE you agree, not that you would anyway. Neither can you.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
and by the way, i havent defended them all the way and im not bent out of shape about it...i openly admitted that m.shadows has seen better days vocally...they're rhythm guitarist and bassist are very mediocre as compared to their lead and drummer...but why not focus on individuals when you focus on lombardo, eddie van halen, etc.

I'm not focusing on them am I you applejohn? I mentioned Van Halen's name ONCE. I didn't dwell on it. I spoke about Lombardo for a bit because you tried making the dumb claim that The Rev is as good or better. I'm not focusing on them at all now. Nor have I been, really.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
and by the way master of the music, why dont you elaborate for us all what is supposedly "wrong" with music since you have a plethera of other opinions...i would like to hear what the know all music man has to say about this.

If you need me to explain why Ashlee Simpson is wrong for music, then I realise how futile it has been trying to explain my points to you.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
and for god's sake, you're comment about me not accepting that fact that you don't like what you hear has never been an issue which ive raised time and time again.....it's your constant badgering about me liking their technality that is causing these posts. You have consistently tried to rip me for thinking they are technically excellent, by naming all these bands they sound innovatively like and by comparing them to other people and saying, well these guys would burn a hole in avenged's instruments.

What the hell man? I never did any of that. Hahahaha, where are you GETTING this stuff? I said ONCE that Lombardo would "burn a hole" in The Rev's kit. Once. I never names "all these bands" and such. You're making stuff up. I don't CARE if you like them technically or not, but that isn't relevant to this debate because this is all stemming from RedAlertV2 asking me why I don't like them. To which I replied "Because I think their music is mediocre" or something to that effect.

You chose to join in this debate, so you should be adhering to the topic at hand, the music. Nobody was intricately discussing technique or anything until YOU brought it up. It's irrelevant.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
i have never said anything like...well, you dont like their sound so im gonna rip you for that...none of my posts have been about that..it has been they're playing ability, now whether or not you like their sound, good for you..im happy for you if you dont like their sound or if you do...great.....but, it sounds to me that you know nothing of technicality so i think you should drop this whole gag....i mean, you probably dont have the first clue how to read music, to write it, know what sextuplets are or anything, so why i bother with you, i dont know....

Hahahaha, I laughed at the last bit.

I'll say this one last time. You can love their "technicality" all you want, but you loving it, doesn't make them great technical players. Sorry, but it doesn't.

RedAlert asked me for my opinion on their music, I gave it. Why are you so depressed about that? Just let it go.

-AC

They play better live than what they show on their cd. Their virtuoso musicianship is excellent, as heard in their cd's. Zach Vengeneance and synyster could destroy pretty much any other band who employs harmonic lead lines. The riffs, to me, are something that you would get from iron maiden, hammerfall, and judas priest. Synyster's solos are virtuous which is evident in his new cd where he takes virtuous pieces from classical music and incorporates them incredibly well into the music....although, dont get me wrong, he doesnt plagiarize the music, but modifies it in a way that blends in excellently with the music while still keeping the original level of difficulty. they're range of musical ability extends way beyond metalcore....from driving punk, to power ballads (comparable to guns n roses), to classic rock (metallica), death metal, and they even have signs of some pop in their newest cd. They have metallica-like dynamics, and their drummin is very precise over lengthy periods of time in which it is sustained. It is a mixture of some of the best drummers style. One could also see signs of the misfits in their music. their melodies are excellently thought out, and, as seen in their newest album, city of evil, they're not just all about speed, as you so pointed out in bat country. everything from sidewinder on will give you a clue about this. they also have a tendency to have a mixture of extremely fast and then change to slow. the only real thing wrong with some of the guitar parts is that synyster sometimes makes the solos sound almost non-melodic in that some of the notes sound a little flat/sharp in comparison to the song, as in i wont see you tonight pt.2..but, he somehow manages to still pull of harmonious endings and sometimes, rapidly-driven shredding. the mixture of their music makes them extremely hard to classify. the songs can be merely called epics.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
They play better live than what they show on their cd. Their virtuoso musicianship is excellent, as heard in their cd's. Zach Vengeneance and synyster could destroy pretty much any other band who employs harmonic lead lines. The riffs, to me, are something that you would get from iron maiden, hammerfall, and judas priest. Synyster's solos are virtuous which is evident in his new cd where he takes virtuous pieces from classical music and incorporates them incredibly well into the music....although, dont get me wrong, he doesnt plagiarize the music, but modifies it in a way that blends in excellently with the music while still keeping the original level of difficulty. they're range of musical ability extends way beyond metalcore....from driving punk, to power ballads (comparable to guns n roses), to classic rock (metallica), death metal, and they even have signs of some pop in their newest cd.

Hahaha, oh dear. I see I have one of those people who, regardless of clarity, never understands a word people say.

They may very well be better live than on CD. I said they're not better technical players when they play live, are they? They don't magically gain technical ability from being on stage. Let's be realistic here. Synyster and Zacky could destroy pretty much any band who employ harmonic leads? Are you even aware of what you are implying there? Are you? Do you realise how utterly ridiculous that claim is?

They're nowhere near as good as Metallica or G'N'R and the very fact that you are claiming they have death metal in their music reveals that you have very little to no ability to differentiate between ways of making music or playing it. Using words like 'musicianship' and 'virtuoso' don't make you right. They make you pretentious, especially seeing as you're using them just to make the guys look good.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
They have metallica-like dynamics, and their drummin is very precise over lengthy periods of time in which it is sustained. It is a mixture of some of the best drummers style. One could also see signs of the misfits in their music. their melodies are excellently thought out, and, as seen in their newest album, city of evil, they're not just all about speed, as you so pointed out in bat country. everything from sidewinder on will give you a clue about this. they also have a tendency to have a mixture of extremely fast and then change to slow. the only real thing wrong with some of the guitar parts is that synyster sometimes makes the solos sound almost non-melodic in that some of the notes sound a little flat/sharp in comparison to the song, as in i wont see you tonight pt.2..but, he somehow manages to still pull of harmonious endings and sometimes, rapidly-driven shredding. the mixture of their music makes them extremely hard to classify. the songs can be merely called epics.

All of what you just said is nothing more than reasons why you love the band so much. Extremely flimsy ones, but reasons nonetheless. I don't care why you like them, or that you even like them. I'm not asking for an explanation. I, however, was asked for an explanation as to why I dislike them. I explained, you didn't like it so now here we are with you spouting bullshit and me picking it up with a scooper and flushing it away.

"They go fast then change to slow", "They use harmonies". So? So what? Who doesn't? That's no accolade. Now you realise that you've made a rather silly point, you're attempting to turn this into "Look how much I worship these guys, that MUST make them good". Which is needless to say, pathetic. Nothing they do is "epic". They tried to make one of their albums epic, but they couldn't do it. So what did they do? Hired a member of Godsmack to produce it and make it "epic" sounding.

Stop replying if all you're gonna do is try to prove you love the band blindly, I don't care. I know.

-AC

They may very well be better live than on CD. I said they're not better technical players when they play live, are they? They don't magically gain technical ability from being on stage.

No, but you cant really see what they're playing on cd's..you hear it, and you can guess how it's played technically, but it doesnt mean that you're playing it the same...and as we all know, tabs have a way of not always being correct.......so, seeing them live gives you the full effect.

Let's be realistic here. Synyster and Zacky could destroy pretty much any band who employ harmonic leads? Are you even aware of what you are implying there? Are you? Do you realise how utterly ridiculous that claim is?

You name a song with harmonic leads to prove you know what the hell you're talking about, because it seems like most of the time you dont. In comparison to harmonic lead lines of metallica/eagles, and im only comparing them to these two bands because they're easy to think of off the top of my head, they're just as good if not better.

They're nowhere near as good as Metallica or G'N'R and the very fact that you are claiming they have death metal in their music reveals that you have very little to no ability to differentiate between ways of making music or playing it. Using words like 'musicianship' and 'virtuoso' don't make you right. They make you pretentious, especially seeing as you're using them just to make the guys look good.

Many songs in their whole first cd had hints of death metal influence in it. Very fast drum/guitar beats..every now and then roars/growls/grunts, blast beatss, abrupt tempo/signature changes, and a focus on apocalyptic verses. That's very much death metal material...but as any musician knows, genres flow over into other genres. Using virtuoso is a classical term for an experienced player who plays a solo designed for him...considering synyster uses these solos and makes them his own.....that is considered virtuoso material, in other words a person who can play these hard classical/renassaince/borocco/romanesque/middle age music.

All of what you just said is nothing more than reasons why you love the band so much. Extremely flimsy ones, but reasons nonetheless. I don't care why you like them, or that you even like them. I'm not asking for an explanation. I, however, was asked for an explanation as to why I dislike them. I explained, you didn't like it so now here we are with you spouting bullshit and me picking it up with a scooper and flushing it away.

This is a music forum, i gave my reasons for liking them, that's allowed correct? I didnt focus on your post at all, i gave my reasons, with backing, and if you dont like it, it seems that your the one with the problem. I gave accurate descriptions of what makes them good players EVEN indicating flaws in some of their playing abilities, such as synyster's a-melodic tendencies sometimes in his solos.

"They go fast then change to slow", "They use harmonies". So? So what? Who doesn't? That's no accolade. Now you realise that you've made a rather silly point, you're attempting to turn this into "Look how much I worship these guys, that MUST make them good". Which is needless to say, pathetic. Nothing they do is "epic".

I pointed out changes in tempo/signature to expand on the death metal and other genres comment..as i pointed out earlier. I never said "They use harmonies". If you read my post again, you'll see that the only thing i wrote about harmonies is when synyster does his solos, he has a tendency to be a-melodic but always seems to pull out harmonious endings..meaning that at the end of the solos, no matter how off-key they were, he meshes it in with the piece at the end. big difference between harmony and melody. and what they do is epic..definitions of epic: Surpassing the usual or ordinary, particularly in scope or size or........A literary or dramatic composition that resembles an extended narrative poem celebrating heroic feats.
The first definition describes the length of their songs and extended difficulty....songs these days dont normally last 7-9 minutes long as with almost all of the A7X's songs, which makes it, by definition epic.
2nd definition, city of evil song-describes the fall of babylon, a tale, where there is a hero. A song is a dramatic composition....so it is an epic by 2 definitions.
Please make sure what your saying is true before you say it.

Once again, we're back to "my boys" argument..."Look how much I worship these guys, that MUST make them good"...i dont worship them, they're not my boys, quit being childish. To finally clear the record on this, if i had to pick a band to be "my boys" it would be Thrice, i particularly love their music...so now that thats cleared up, i think it might be wise for you to move on AC. I created the last post independent of our last argumentative posts to simply give my reasons with backing....i know the next post you'll be saying the same ol' thing you've been sayin with everyone, it's your opinion, a bad one at that...when in essence, urs is an opinion also entitling it to be equally wrong. you're going to reply with how much i dont know, how they're my boys again. Why dont you move past these petty arguments, get some balls, and start posting arguments that dont involve..."Do you realise how utterly ridiculous that claim is" who's only backing is the implied one, just because i say so.

by the way, the last post, i went to a bunch of reviews...rolling stone, amp, etc....and got alot of the information i wrote, so it isnt just my opinion. i could've given the same exact information without going, but i thought it would be better to so that i do have some backing and feel free to check it out...although, i dont think you will be willing to believe much of that "nonsense" from magazines, etc, with high musical reputations........

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
No, but you cant really see what they're playing on cd's..you hear it, and you can guess how it's played technically, but it doesnt mean that you're playing it the same...and as we all know, tabs have a way of not always being correct.......so, seeing them live gives you the full effect.

If you know the techniques, you can tell what they are doing. You saying that you can't only proves that you clearly doing know as much about technique as you claim you do.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
You name a song with harmonic leads to prove you know what the hell you're talking about, because it seems like most of the time you dont. In comparison to harmonic lead lines of metallica/eagles, and im only comparing them to these two bands because they're easy to think of off the top of my head, they're just as good if not better.

No, I'm sorry, you're wrong. If you like Avenged's lead harmonies more than Metallica's, that's fine. To claim they are better only implies that they are better guitarists, which they are not. Zacky Vengeance is nowhere even close to being a slim-chanced competitor of James Hetfield, Synyster is not as good a soloist as Kirk Hammett.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
Many songs in their whole first cd had hints of death metal influence in it. Very fast drum/guitar beats..every now and then roars/growls/grunts, blast beatss, abrupt tempo/signature changes, and a focus on apocalyptic verses. That's very much death metal material...but as any musician knows, genres flow over into other genres. Using virtuoso is a classical term for an experienced player who plays a solo designed for him...considering synyster uses these solos and makes them his own.....that is considered virtuoso material, in other words a person who can play these hard classical/renassaince/borocco/romanesque/middle age music.

No, they had no death metal at all. Nothing they have ever done has echoed or mirrored death metal. Let's move on. Using solos doesn't make you a virtuoso. Guitar virtuosos are the all time greats, but you don't like me mentioning them because they're just on another level to Synyster. A virtuoso is someone with masterful skill, not ability to play every genre.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
This is a music forum, i gave my reasons for liking them, that's allowed correct? I didnt focus on your post at all, i gave my reasons, with backing, and if you dont like it, it seems that your the one with the problem. I gave accurate descriptions of what makes them good players EVEN indicating flaws in some of their playing abilities, such as synyster's a-melodic tendencies sometimes in his solos.

So you believe that by passively showing that they have flaws, which is obvious, that your opinion is less biased? Hahaha. You haven't gave accurate descriptions of what makes them good players, you've have accurate descriptions of what makes you believe they're good. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
I pointed out changes in tempo/signature to expand on the death metal and other genres comment..as i pointed out earlier. I never said "They use harmonies". If you read my post again, you'll see that the only thing i wrote about harmonies is when synyster does his solos, he has a tendency to be a-melodic but always seems to pull out harmonious endings..meaning that at the end of the solos, no matter how off-key they were, he meshes it in with the piece at the end. big difference between harmony and melody. and what they do is epic..definitions of epic: Surpassing the usual or ordinary, particularly in scope or size or........A literary or dramatic composition that resembles an extended narrative poem celebrating heroic feats.
The first definition describes the length of their songs and extended difficulty....songs these days dont normally last 7-9 minutes long as with almost all of the A7X's songs, which makes it, by definition epic.
2nd definition, city of evil song-describes the fall of babylon, a tale, where there is a hero. A song is a dramatic composition....so it is an epic by 2 definitions.
Please make sure what your saying is true before you say it.

They've never ever touched death metal. End of story. Now, you continually mention difficulty. Math is difficult to a retard, not to a mathematician. You thinking that something is difficult doesn't mean it actually is. It's just difficult for you. When I listen to their songs, I don't think they're epic at all. They don't make epic music, they take stories already written and add music. Opeth are epic, Tool are epic, Rush are epic. Avenged Sevenfold are not epic.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
Once again, we're back to "my boys" argument..."Look how much I worship these guys, that MUST make them good"...i dont worship them, they're not my boys, quit being childish. To finally clear the record on this, if i had to pick a band to be "my boys" it would be Thrice, i particularly love their music...so now that thats cleared up, i think it might be wise for you to move on AC. I created the last post independent of our last argumentative posts to simply give my reasons with backing....i know the next post you'll be saying the same ol' thing you've been sayin with everyone, it's your opinion, a bad one at that...when in essence, urs is an opinion also entitling it to be equally wrong. you're going to reply with how much i dont know, how they're my boys again. Why dont you move past these petty arguments, get some balls, and start posting arguments that dont involve..."Do you realise how utterly ridiculous that claim is" who's only backing is the implied one, just because i say so.

You need to understand this whole backing issue. You are trying to prove why you like the band so much, why? I don't care, it's not relevant. I was asked why I don't like them and you decided to get involved. You think you're saying they're great players and "backing" it up, you're not. Well, not with anything factual. You're just saying, essentially, "I think this is difficult, therefore it is and they're great". You are the one implying that, off the back of what you believe, these two guitarists are competitors for the greats.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
by the way, the last post, i went to a bunch of reviews...rolling stone, amp, etc....and got alot of the information i wrote, so it isnt just my opinion. i could've given the same exact information without going, but i thought it would be better to so that i do have some backing and feel free to check it out...although, i dont think you will be willing to believe much of that "nonsense" from magazines, etc, with high musical reputations........

Funny that, because I happened to read up on them before you even got involved. I don't speak on shit I don't know, which isn't much. Secondly, they needed outside help from the member of a shit band to make one of their records "epic". You are resorting to internet pages to provide you with a lot of your argument. So when I say you don't know much, this is why.

I don't like Avenged Sevenfold and I don't think they are great players. You do, knock yourself out.

-AC

On a related note, I find Thrice to be the most boring, samest music ever...
Light guitar, goes into some singing, upend into annoying as hell screaming with the drummer smashing quarter notes into the snare as hard as he can....

yeah thrice blows.

I'll thrice that.

-AC

the simple fact is, i do know quite alot...i know the techniques. im in a band, ive played in bands before, throughout highschool, etc. I dont need to go to internet pages to prove my argument...going to them and finding the same information that i could already give you expands on my thoughts, and makes them more relevant. obviously you havent read much because everything brought up on the net talked of how good they are, no matter what site.

I could go into greater detail of how they are technically brilliant, but i know that you wouldnt have the first clue about what im talking about. its evident in what you write, because you obviously dont understand the concept of virtuoso playing..which is learnt in an introduction to music course...you don't know what harmonic leads are at all, obviously by your comparison of INDIVIDUALS of metallica, and i guarantee synyster could play with kirk hammett. and if you do know what harmonic leads are, please tell us...because i think you dont know shit.

Let me explain virtuoso to you. Virtuoso parts were made for virtuoso players to play in traditional classic music. If a person can play a virtuoso part, then that makes him a virtuoso performer...that's the way it was and still is. He can play the virtuoso parts, thus making him a virtuoso player..and im not gonna argue against your opinions on this anymore, it's simple, i put in stupified terms, and if you can't understand it, you're lacking in alot of other places besides in the musical areas.

Look the all-time greats you have been mentioning are mostly fogies! How can you compare the old with the new, when the new is nothing like the old....they may have been good back in the day, or maybe they are still a little talented today, but just because they were legends in THEIR time doesnt make players of this age unable to play at their level or exceed their level.

Look, ill give you one reason why he's an excellent guitarist in my terms...yes, im gonna include speed in this one......he is able to triple stroke at insanely fast speeds (thus sextuplets), while playing patterns up and down the guitar, many times resembling arpeggios which are difficult to play when you are advancing 2-3 octave arpeggios, with sometimes grace notes in-between while progressing through this 2-3 octave arpeggio. But, the speed and that combined is incredibly hard to play. even sometimes play these in harmonic lead lines at the same speed which makes it insanely difficult...but, i wont elaborate on harmonic lead lines in a way that will give away the question that i would like for you to answer...or, maybe you should answer what sextuplets are, octaves, grace notes are? i dont think you have the first clue.....but i was even hesitant to write this in fear that my knowledge might actually get me called trite again.....but, if i know it, why not share it, right?

Opeth are epic, Tool are epic, Rush are epic. Avenged Sevenfold are not epic.

AGREED.

And anyone who thinks they hear ANY death metal in Avenged Sevenfold truly honestly knows nothing about the metal genre and needs to go listen to some real death metal.

And I found that I got very bored very quickly with Thrice....

I think a lot of Avenged's work can be classified as epic. Songs like Strength of the World and I Wont See You Tonight Pt 1 are clearly epics in my opinion

ok, maybe i did go a little to far on the deathmetal subject, but its a changing genre..and when you get bands like dimmu borgir in that category where sometimes they have a tendency to have non-deathmetal parts (referring to progenies of the apocalypse)...then the line gets somewhat distorted. but, yeah, i did go to far on that subject.

Yeah but that's because we all have different views of epic. To me, The Moor by Opeth is epic. That's the definition of epic music. Not some metalcore band.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
the simple fact is, i do know quite alot...i know the techniques. im in a band, ive played in bands before, throughout highschool, etc. I dont need to go to internet pages to prove my argument...going to them and finding the same information that i could already give you expands on my thoughts, and makes them more relevant. obviously you havent read much because everything brought up on the net talked of how good they are, no matter what site.

I guess we'll never know if you're lying or not. You say you could have but you didn't.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
I could go into greater detail of how they are technically brilliant, but i know that you wouldnt have the first clue about what im talking about.

Oh you'd be surprised, go on...or is that an excuse to make a claim and not back it up? Admittedly, there have been many times in your posts that I have no clue what you're talking about. You have a tendancy to go off and ramble.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
its evident in what you write, because you obviously dont understand the concept of virtuoso playing..which is learnt in an introduction to music course...you don't know what harmonic leads are at all, obviously by your comparison of INDIVIDUALS of metallica, and i guarantee synyster could play with kirk hammett. and if you do know what harmonic leads are, please tell us...because i think you dont know shit.

Wait, so...you are implying that because you took a music course, you know MORE then people? Dude, this is exactly where you fail. You've gone completely off topic. You telling me that I don't know what harmonic leads are (lead guitar lines/melodies played in harmonics either natural or artificial) is just a huge assumption. Secondly, virtuoso doesn't mean what you think it means, because Synyster isn't one. Thirdly, you didn't say he could play with Hammett. Lots could, they're not better though. Neither is Synyster.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
Let me explain virtuoso to you. Virtuoso parts were made for virtuoso players to play in traditional classic music. If a person can play a virtuoso part, then that makes him a virtuoso performer...that's the way it was and still is. He can play the virtuoso parts, thus making him a virtuoso player..and im not gonna argue against your opinions on this anymore, it's simple, i put in stupified terms, and if you can't understand it, you're lacking in alot of other places besides in the musical areas.

A virtuoso is someone who has demonstrated mastery of an art or instrument. You obviously think it's just someone who plays a certain way.

vir·tu·o·so
n. pl. vir·tu·o·sos or vir·tu·o·si (-s)
A musician with masterly ability, technique, or personal style.
A person with masterly skill or technique in the arts.
A person with a strong interest in the fine arts, especially in antiquities.
Archaic. A very learned person.

None of which apply to Synyster. Let's move on.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
Look the all-time greats you have been mentioning are mostly fogies! How can you compare the old with the new, when the new is nothing like the old....they may have been good back in the day, or maybe they are still a little talented today, but just because they were legends in THEIR time doesnt make players of this age unable to play at their level or exceed their level.

See, this is why you're stupid. "How can you compare the old with the new, when the new is nothing like the old." They're guitarists, of course you can compare them. They play the same instrument.

Let me ask you a question, right now. Because that quote is really making me laugh. Do you believe Synyster Gates is as good as people like Hendrix, Van Halen, Clapton, Vai? (If you even know who they are). He isn't, and that's a fact. But you seem to have the utterly moronic belief that because they are older, they lose their talent and young guitarists are now better.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
Look, ill give you one reason why he's an excellent guitarist in my terms...yes, im gonna include speed in this one......he is able to triple stroke at insanely fast speeds (thus sextuplets), while playing patterns up and down the guitar, many times resembling arpeggios which are difficult to play when you are advancing 2-3 octave arpeggios, with sometimes grace notes in-between while progressing through this 2-3 octave arpeggio

He's just fast, that's it. I've said this to you before. This isn't even relevant.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
But the speed and that combined is incredibly hard to play. even sometimes play these in harmonic lead lines at the same speed which makes it insanely difficult...but, i wont elaborate on harmonic lead lines in a way that will give away the question that i would like for you to answer...or, maybe you should answer what sextuplets are, octaves, grace notes are? i dont think you have the first clue.....but i was even hesitant to write this in fear that my knowledge might actually get me called trite again.....but, if i know it, why not share it, right?

For you. Incredibly hard to play FOR YOU. Not for Steve Vai, Joe Satriani, Adam Jones, Eddie Van Halen, Tom Morello etc. You are AGAIN implying that because YOU find them difficult, he's one of the best. I'm sorry, that's not the case.

Grace notes are mini-notes played before you play a main chord or note, octaves are the sets or series of notes and tones (higher and lower). Why is this even relevant? You are trying to prove that you know some words? Why? Because I don't think Synyster Gates is amazing? It is isn't it? I don't think he's anything special so in a futile attempt at...something, you go on about why you believe he is. That doesn't change anything. THEN you try the whole "Oh he doesn't think Synyster is technically amazing so then he must not know about technique" bs, which is unbelievably silly. Bottom line: I know my shit. People here will vouch for that. You asking me to define techniques is not only off topic but also another notch of proof that you are just insecure about someone not loving Synyster. So unless you have a plan to reply with something RELEVANT about the band, I suggest you don't bother. Because what some Avenged/The Used/Dashboard Confessional fan (who believes guitarists lose talent with age. <---Still cracking me up) thinks of me really doesn't matter.

You say "If I know it, why not share it?" Why not? Because this isn't a "Show off how many musical terms you know" thread.

Peace aht.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You telling me that I don't know what harmonic leads are (lead guitar lines/melodies played in harmonics either natural or artificial) is just a huge assumption.

True one, it would appear.

but, you said i didnt have proof...and yes, for me its difficult because im not a guitarist, i dont play guitar....as i said, i have friends that attend Musical Institute in hollywood, and they have elaborated to me how awesome synyster is....octave by the way is not just a series or set, its specifically 8 notes...but, you wanted to know why it was technically difficult, i gave it to you in musical terms, you cant handle it, get over it...so thus you're only response is im showing off. there is no other way to describe what i said without musical terms. you said i was giving no proof of why it is hard, and right there, i gave you something....but then you're like it's just hard to me, but to other guys it might not be hard. LOOK, YOU CAN TELL WHEN A MUSICAL PIECE IS HARD EVEN WHEN YOU CANT PLAY NEAR THAT PLAYING LEVEL IF YOU HAVE A SOLID KNOWLEDGE OF MUSIC. AND YOU CANT TELL ME THAT ALTHOUGH UR GUITAR GODS CAN PLAY "ANYTHING", THEY DONT LOOK AT EACH OTHERS PLAYING ABILITY AND SAY, WELL THEY'RE MEDIOCRE BECAUSE I CAN PLAY AT THEIR LEVEL..NO, THEY GIVE THEM CREDIT FOR REACHING THAT LEVEL AND BEING ABLE TO PLAY DIFFICULT MUSIC. and yes, i do think synyster is as good as them, as do other people. i do not stand alone on this, but neither do you. i guarantee that synyster could take them on a classical guitar. on electric guitars, who knows..they havent really went up against each other, and they havent really shown their playing boundaries...its really hard to say who's the best unless there is like a battle of the guitarists, which is likely to never happen. but, hey, ur looking at it one way...synyster can play eddie van halen's stuff, steve vai, morello etc. it's what they grew up on and played at MI. so what they can play each other's music....once again, we're at a standstill. it's basic physiological functions that tell us, playing ability does decrease with age...only someone with no knowledge of age effects on adults would imply that it doesnt. you are in your prime from around 18-30 roughly...some go outside the range, some dont, but always, with age, it declines. by the way, u should look further into definitions....

Virtuoso (Vir`tu*o"so) (?), n.; pl. Virtuosos (#); It. Virtuosi (#).
[It. See Virtuous.]
2. (Mus.) A performer on some instrument who excels in the technical part of his art; a brilliant concert player.

he's both

Actually, an octave in guitar playing is a two note chord, both being the same note but an octave apart.

that is what i meant by 8 notes...8 notes apart...such as Middle C, and one C higher...etc, etc

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
but, you said i didnt have proof...and yes, for me its difficult because im not a guitarist, i dont play guitar....as i said, i have friends that attend Musical Institute in hollywood, and they have elaborated to me how awesome synyster is....octave by the way is not just a series or set, its specifically 8 notes...but, you wanted to know why it was technically difficult, i gave it to you in musical terms, you cant handle it, get over it...so thus you're only response is im showing off.

What are you TALKING about? Your friends attend an institude (so you claim, it could be another lie for all we know), are fans of Synyster, so they say he's awesome. Right, so what? That doesn't mean he is. It means they think he is. Why can you not understand it?

As for octaves, yes. They're a set of 8 notes, a set. A series. Which I said. Moving on.

Third, I didn't want to know anything. You took it upon yourself to spout out shit about how technically amazing YOU THINK he is. I can handle it perfectly well, I've discussed like this with people before. Except they weren't talking bullcrap. You throwing random words and claims out there, doesn't conclude anything. It's the only response because it's all you're doing. I have NO problem with you thinking he is technically amazing, go for it. But WHY do you continue to tell me why you think he is? Because it's not a fact, it's your opinion.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
LOOK, YOU CAN TELL WHEN A MUSICAL PIECE IS HARD EVEN WHEN YOU CANT PLAY NEAR THAT PLAYING LEVEL IF YOU HAVE A SOLID KNOWLEDGE OF MUSIC. AND YOU CANT TELL ME THAT ALTHOUGH UR GUITAR GODS CAN PLAY "ANYTHING", THEY DONT LOOK AT EACH OTHERS PLAYING ABILITY AND SAY, WELL THEY'RE MEDIOCRE BECAUSE I CAN PLAY AT THEIR LEVEL..NO, THEY GIVE THEM CREDIT FOR REACHING THAT LEVEL AND BEING ABLE TO PLAY DIFFICULT MUSIC.

Calm down, kid. Calm down. Just breathe and relax.

Yes, those guitarists do, because they are some of the best of all time.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
and yes, i do think synyster is as good as them, as do other people. i do not stand alone on this, but neither do you. i guarantee that synyster could take them on a classical guitar. on electric guitars, who knows..they havent really went up against each other, and they havent really shown their playing boundaries...its really hard to say who's the best unless there is like a battle of the guitarists, which is likely to never happen. but, hey, ur looking at it one way...synyster can play eddie van halen's stuff, steve vai, morello etc.

You just said Synyster was as good as Morello, Vai, Satriani and Hendrix. You claimed he could play Eddie Van Halen's material, Steve Vai's material. You henceforth have no valid musical opinion. Fact. End. Oh and before you say "You have no response" you're right. I don't. I have no response to the sheer and utter stupidity that you claim a mediocre metal guitarist is better than the best guitarist of all time and those close to him. You just claimed Synyster Gates could take Jimi Hendrix. If you're not locking YOURSELF away now, you should be ashamed.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
it's what they grew up on and played at MI. so what they can play each other's music....once again, we're at a standstill. it's basic physiological functions that tell us, playing ability does decrease with age...only someone with no knowledge of age effects on adults would imply that it doesnt. you are in your prime from around 18-30 roughly...some go outside the range, some dont, but always, with age, it declines. by the way, u should look further into definitions....

Eddie Van Halen is older than Synyster. He'd still kicked multiple shades of shit out of him in a guitar duel. Why am I even trying to convince you that Eddie Van Halen is better than Synyster Gates of Avenged Sevenfold? It's not up for debate.

Originally posted by Apocalypse9
Virtuoso (Vir`tu*o"so) (?), n.; pl. Virtuosos (#); It. Virtuosi (#).
[It. See Virtuous.]
2. (Mus.) A performer on some instrument who excels in the technical part of his art; a brilliant concert player.

he's both

Ahahahahahaha, it's so painfully obvious that you just edited that. If you didn't, link please.

Anyway, in light of the fact that you just made the dumbest claim ever, I won't be replying to you anymore.

-AC

i didnt link it, i only gave the relevant parts of it....look, ur saying synyster isnt as good as those guitarist is also opinion no matter how painful it is to admit it