The Bible

Though I asked how you would make it not how sucky it was...

I would create a uptopian world where there is no pain, no fear, and no hate. No wealth, no poverty, thus meaning there would be no greed. People would live in harmony with one another instead of in conflict... there is all kinds of things I would do different. I don't have the kind of time though that the creator had when designing the world, if i did, im sure I would do a lot of things different

Doesn't work. The people either
A. Rebel; You've heard of Eden right?
B. You restrict their freedom and they cannot choose love- the ultimate emotion.

I believe god dropped the ball when creating the earth... okay instead of creating a utopia, maybe just take away oil, gold, disease, and weapon making materials... either way, I think the world is flawwed. I wont be persuaded on this.

The Garden of Eden wasn't a rebellion, it was stupidity on God's part. What ass puts something forbidden in plain reach of someone who isn't supposed to have it? It's like leaving a razor on the floor when you have a toddler.

If God didn't want Adam and Eve to eat from the Forbidden Tree of Knowledge, then he should not have made it so they could get at it. If us "mere humans" can figure that out, I'm sure an all-knowing God would have thought of the same.

Oil is needed for plastic, and is the result of a rich and varied history (which the earth needs). Gold is an important currency that was needed to help humans start wealth collecting, an important economic action. Diseases are an inevitability of life; if there were none, flies would run rampant (if there were no flies, spiders would die out blah blah blah). I will eventually bore you out by destroying all your examples.

Originally posted by Arachnoidfreak
The Garden of Eden wasn't a rebellion, it was stupidity on God's part. What ass puts something forbidden in plain reach of someone who isn't supposed to have it? It's like leaving a razor on the floor when you have a toddler.

If God didn't want Adam and Eve to eat from the Forbidden Tree of Knowledge, then he should not have made it so they could get at it. If us "mere humans" can figure that out, I'm sure an all-knowing God would have thought of the same.

He gave them a choice; they could choose God, or knowledge. If us "mere humans" have curiosity, we can easily relate.

I assure you that human can flourish without oil... they did so for thousands of years in north and south america.

The same can go for currency, wealth collecting, and the like.

Are you claiming right now that the world is perfect and there is no flaw in God's creation? If you are then I am done responding to your posts on this thread.

I am claiming that there is no avoidable flaw in God's creation.
The oil was there in North and South america, because the plants died. If they hadn't, they might not have the correct plants.
Humans didn't advance much without wealth. It make the world go round since ages ago. Gold made it simpler, as it doesn't blend with rocks.

Are you telling me that God doesn't know when to give someone a choice, and when to do what is best for them? Taking the Forbidden Fruit out of Eden would not have been impedeing our free will in any way, and we still would have been sin-free.

Now, if God HAD taken the Tree from the Garden, and Adam went in search for it and took the fruit when God told him not to, that would be different. Instead, God put it right in front of them. It isn't curiousity, it's temptation. God actually tempted Adam by putting the tree in plain reach. Satan did not tempt them, all he did was secure their feeling for taking the fruit.

Originally posted by Arachnoidfreak
Are you telling me that God doesn't know when to give someone a choice, and when to do what is best for them? Taking the Forbidden Fruit out of Eden would not have been impedeing our free will in any way, and we still would have been sin-free.

Now, if God HAD taken the Tree from the Garden, and Adam went in search for it and took the fruit when God told him not to, that would be different. Instead, God put it right in front of them. It isn't curiousity, it's temptation. God actually tempted Adam by putting the tree in plain reach. Satan did not tempt them, all he did was secure their feeling for taking the fruit.

If the choice hadn't been obvious, then why should it be there? If you don't have the choice to sin, you are not free.

That's my point, it shouldn't be there.

It's not if "you don't have the choice" it's if you KNOW about the choice. We KNOW we have the option to sin, therefore we can choose it if we like. If God didn't give the tree to Adam, then he wouldn't have known about it, and he wouldn't have sinned. Just like you pick the razor up off the floor so the toddler doesn't know about it, and can't hurt himself.

It's simple really.

I am claiming that there is no avoidable flaw in God's creation

Originally posted by Arachnoidfreak
That's my point, it shouldn't be there.

It's not if "you don't have the choice" it's if you KNOW about the choice. We KNOW we have the option to sin, therefore we can choose it if we like. If God didn't give the tree to Adam, then he wouldn't have known about it, and he wouldn't have sinned. Just like you pick the razor up off the floor so the toddler doesn't know about it, and can't hurt himself.

It's simple really.

😕 well then, how and why did Satan sin?? God didn't put anything in front of him, it was greed, jeolousy and power that made him thk he was better than God, and he sinned.

So god's perfect creation was not really perfect then if it created satan...

its called choice

Satan comes from the story of Job which is based on an older story from another culture and his conflict with god is from another culture Hebrews were exposed to (Zoroastrianism?). The devil has been retroactively integrated into the bible in people's minds because he isn't mentioned earlier. Some claim that he was the serpent in the garden but that, too, is retroactive alteration in the minds of followers.

FE & RoguePw> But how do you KNOW God inspired anyone to write anything? Prove it.
And, RoguePW, what does the Revelations prove? Nothing? Has it come true? No. Will it, no. How do you know God showed John any signs and he hadn't just been drinking.

And as Arachnoidfreak says> We're supposedly God's children. If we are, he's a lousy parent, and an uncaring one at that, too.

FE> WHO created Satan?

I guess thats kind of the thing about religion, it needs faith. I imagine miracles don't leave much in the way of remains or evidence, thus its hard to prove, or disprove. And we can't really know what occurred back then, I mean, be 100% sure, people just have to have faith in that (if your that way inclined, I am not completely)

Imperial_Samurai> There is nothing to DISPROVE. Those making a claim, carries the burden of proof. And extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.