why are you an atheist?

Originally posted by Ytaker
1. If you don't accept what your democratic leaders say as true, then you aren't a true democrat. E.G. agreeing with bush on the W.M.D.

You're wrong about this. The Democratic National Council explicitly states in its part platform that, "members of our party have deeply held and differing views on some matters of conscience and faith. We view diversity of views as a source of strength, and we welcome into our ranks all Americans who seek to build a stronger America."

If you do not seek to build a stronger America?

If you don't have the basics of the moral obligement, they won't want you. If you seek to build a weaker america... scary!

Then I suppose that, in the Council's eyes, you're not a true Democrat, card or no. That's fine--I can admit it when I'm wrong, especially since in this case, it doesn't really weaken my overall arguement. Having to believe one thing to be a Democrat is not the same as having to believe everything the Democratic leaders tell you--with one exception, you're free to believe or do whatever you like. Likewise, you have to believe one thing to be a Christian--that Christ died for your sins, yadda yadda--and with that one exception, you can believe or do anything you like and still be a Christian.

If you seek to build a weaker america... scary!

Originally posted by Turbo-Cajun
If someone professes a belief in Christ, and asks god for forgiveness that makes you a christian. Remember in the Ghandi thread when you said that our actions on earth don't affect whether we get to heaven or not, only our beleifs? Well these people held christian beliefs, despite the fact that they are murderers they are still Christians. I dont think that either you or I is capable of judging someone else's faith or belief in god.

I've NEVER said that are Action on earth don't affect wether we get to heaven or not, only our beliefs, NEVER. you must have me confused w/someone else. When you ask God for forgiveness in Jesus name, you are not to keep on sinning, you're to stop, you can't repeatedly do the same sin. to do wrong and to know it's wrong is sin.

Ok everyone I thk you're missing the point of what i was trying to say. Let me see if I can clear up my meaning. I'm not saying anyone shld go around judging someone, the Word of God does say, you will know them by their fruits (thier actions) What I am saying is that, just cuz someone Kills and says, God told me to and I believe in Jesus Christ, YOU are saying then they are a christian, well i'm saying they are not and it's a LIE from Satan. If you read the Word of God, YOU would know thats a lie, no where in the bible does it tell you to drown your kids in a bathtub, give me a break. thats a lie, a copout, it's not of God.

I could possibly have you confused with someone else.

And I do beleive that if you are truely christian that you should act like christ did, however there are people out there that use lines from the bible to justify all kinds of things from genocide/ethnic clensing, to slavery, to murder, to just about any end. They are reading the same book you do.

Many christians do hold the belief that you enter the kingdom of god by your faith, not by your actions. In fact most religions basically believe it is your faith that gets you into heaven.

So if you can sin, and ask god for forgiveness, and he forgives... how does that not contribute to a lot of the blood spilt by the Christians?

Originally posted by Turbo-Cajun
I could possibly have you confused with someone else.

And I do beleive that if you are truely christian that you should act like christ did, however there are people out there that use lines from the bible to justify all kinds of things from genocide/ethnic clensing, to slavery, to murder, to just about any end. They are reading the same book you do.

Many christians do hold the belief that you enter the kingdom of god by your faith, not by your actions. In fact most religions basically believe it is your faith that gets you into heaven.

So if you can sin, and ask god for forgiveness, and he forgives... how does that not contribute to a lot of the blood spilt by the Christians?

and you hit it right on the nose, people do try to JUSTIFY things, but it doesn't mean they are right.
Yes, you did confuse me w/someone else, I did read that also there, but it wasn't meeee. I don't beleive that way at all. the bible says to repent and sin no more. God knows your heart, your intentions, if you really mean what you say if you ask for forgiveness, a person that sins, then ask 4 forgiveness, then goes and does it again and again, isn't really sorry, and God knows that.

You do not sound like that bad of a christian then.

However, there have been millions of christians before you and millions of christians now, and millions of christians who will follow you that will do un-christian like things in the name of christianity, and believe fully that they are correct in doing so.

This is the kind of Christianity that I have a problem with. If you do not harm me, you do not overstep certain lines, and act like christ acted, then I could probably stand having you as a neighbor. If you are go the other way though, I can tell you it would likely be unpleasent for both of us.

Sorry for the confusion with the mistaken identity... my bad.

Originally posted by Turbo-Cajun
You do not sound like that bad of a christian then.

However, there have been millions of christians before you and millions of christians now, and millions of christians who will follow you that will do un-christian like things in the name of christianity, and believe fully that they are correct in doing so.

This is the kind of Christianity that I have a problem with. If you do not harm me, you do not overstep certain lines, and act like christ acted, then I could probably stand having you as a neighbor. If you are go the other way though, I can tell you it would likely be unpleasent for both of us.

Sorry for the confusion with the mistaken identity... my bad.

Np about the mistaken identity 🙂 umm LOL i sound like i'm not that bad of a christian. LOL gee thx 🙂 My point exactly, people doing things in the Name of Christianity, it doesn't make it right.
just as you view me on here, i'm like that in person, except prolly bolder in here, since this is a debate/discussion forum, thats why we are all here. I don't go around stating my opinions to everyone, only if they ask am I honest to tell them and no matter who you are i am nice to ya. 🙂

Right on, that still doesnt change the fact though that there are a lot of christians who do some shitty shit out there, and despite what you and I know, they think that they are correct, and are good christians etc... If I were you man, I'd be more concerned about some of those retards giving christianity a bad name... I know alot of christians who are good people too, but I also know that Christianity has been used as a tool to crush people, good people man. So yeah, your cool man... but I hope you can see where I am kind of coming from here, yeah... I got to try be nicer here too, I'm an okay guy too, I'm probably more of a prick when I am in the forums than I am in real life, but yeah man right on....

<<<------------is a female

Originally posted by Turbo-Cajun
Right on, that still doesnt change the fact though that there are a lot of christians who do some shitty shit out there, and despite what you and I know, they think that they are correct, and are good christians etc... If I were you man, I'd be more concerned about some of those retards giving christianity a bad name... I know alot of christians who are good people too, but I also know that Christianity has been used as a tool to crush people, good people man. So yeah, your cool man... but I hope you can see where I am kind of coming from here, yeah... I got to try be nicer here too, I'm an okay guy too, I'm probably more of a prick when I am in the forums than I am in real life, but yeah man right on....

Yes there is alot of people that give christianity a bad name, but I can't change them, only God can and if they want him to change them. There's always going to be people like that, you've jsut got to be the best person you can be and be the example setter. Saying you're a christian doesn't mean you are, you will know them by their actions. And God knows 🙂

The problem is not people who are not Christians saying they are Christian. The problem is people who are not Christian believing that they are Christian. And your right you have got to try be the best person you can, and you do need to try be an example setter... I think that by doing those things you can change people though.

I think the world needs to be a more accepting, respectful place though... expecially in non-christian circles - Christianity is not notorious for this.

i thk they are only notorious for it cuz they are suppose to be different so people look at them more and watch how they live, what they say to people, they watch and see if they lie, cheat, steal and when they mess up people are all over that.

I think the examples which give people the most bitter taste in their mouth are historical examples, ie: the colonization of the americas. The only really contemporary problems that I really even encounter are things like Pres Bush supposedly being a good christian man of faith, pedophile priests, and conflicts at my school between the conservative christians and the multicultural and diversity groups... I dont think that we veiw you any differently or anymore critically than you view us...

Wow, I am speechless. 🙂

Yes, the biggest problem today with christianity is non-christians claiming to be christians.

Turbo-Cajun- Im glad your open minded enough to understand.

well... you say they are non-christians, I say they don't act how christians should act.... if you ask them they will say they are christian. So who is right?

I'm pretty sure that if they were a people of god they would show more kindness and compassion towards other people and respect the world god created for them more. However they claim to have faith, and I really can't tell some one "yes you are a true believer" or "no you are not a true believer".... If someone introduces themselves to me as a christian, I am not going to challenge the fact that they believe in Christ.

So while yeah, they may not be real chrsitans by your view or mine, according to them they are the real deal. Which presents a problem, how do you voice your beliefs and values while not being sunk in the same ship as some of the more extreme christian views out there?

FE> How do you know who Jesus talks to, and what your savior tells them. Maybe he did tell "them" to kill in his name? You claim God talks to you. Why shouldn't Jesus talk to others, hm?
How do you know what you hear isn't a ploy from Satan?

Who gave YOU the monopoly on the truth? And on hearing voices.